ATG
Banned
+5,233|6563|Global Command
Moderator Edit: There have been a few reports about this thread, but after reading through it, I've decided to keep it open, at least for the time being.  I see no point in closing this thread when there are multiple threads talking about how terrible Islam is.  I won't be the one to hold up a double standard by closing a thread arguing against what the majority of this forum believes in whilst maintaining other threads that bash religions and races.  Although I agree, this thread is borderline, ATG did a good job of providing articles and statements that back up his ideas and beliefs.  Anytime a subject like this comes up, of course it will have its opponents, but in the end, and as an unbiased mediator, I see no current issues with keeping this thread open.

Growing up, I always thought that our beef with Cuba was because of their communist socialist ties. The French were bad because they are a socialist country. 58000 young Americans died in Vietnam to stop the spread of socialism and communism.

Flash forward to today. Americas main gripe besides exploding Islamic jihadist is the border with Mexico.

Mexico has a enormous problem with poverty and large families. Part of Catholic dogma is an anti-birth control stance. So you have reckless family planning combined with a corrupt  economy and what do you get?
12 million illegal aliens from Mexico in the United States.

Lets examine a few others issues with regards to the catholics, forgetting, of course  crimes or allegations thereof prior to the 1980's.

Pope's New Book Criticizes Capitalism

"Confronted with the abuse of economic power, with the cruelty of capitalism that degrades man into merchandise, we have begun to see more clearly the dangers of wealth and we understand in a new way what Jesus intended in warning us about wealth."
Well, excuse the fuck outta me. I guess owning my own home and making payments on my wifes car is wealth. I'm all for mexicans having a decent quality of life, I'd just prefer that they largely do it in Mexico.

The more illegal aliens are exported to America, the more the quality of life here is diminished, wages are repressed and law and order breaks down.


"You cannot claim to worship Jesus in the Tabernacle, if you do not pity Jesus in the slums.

But instead of teaching responsible family planning you advocate filling the slums with with these needy, largely illiterate people who then go forth to be fruitful and multiply. Teaching responsibility is charity.

If "Towards a Better Distribution of Land" has a failing, it is its emphasis on distribution at the expense of production (though it theorizes that "growth in agriculture leads to an expansion in the industrial service sectors, and hence to overall economic growth") - But land is an issue that lends itself to an overemphasis on distribution because, unlike labor and capital, there is only a fixed quantity of it available.

So, because there is a limited amount of land, it shouldn't be privately owned because that, of course wouldn't be equal now would it?

Are you out of your fucking mind?




In the Jesuit' America, Miguel Esperanza give the following figures: "Between September 1990 and the present moment (June 1992), the Shining Path has assassinated five pastoral agents, two religious women and three priests. The number may seem small, but politically and socially their deaths clearly signified an important new step in the violent career of the Shining Path." 17 Klaiber's writings refer to the same five.

The allegation here is that certain Catholic clergy and nuns have been killed in South America because they are helping foment radical socialist regimes and insurgencies.

We all shook our heads when the nuns were murdered in Peru, now it appears there is more to the story.




Oh, let's not forget the hundreds of millions in sex crimes settlements.

Last I checked, people who went around dorking little boys went to prison, they didn't write a check and get sent on to the next parish.


So in conclusion, the Catholic Church has become a cartoonish vision of evil, and a forceful proponent of socialism. I think it's time the entity be put on a list of vile organizations, like the Taliban.

Whatever good that it has done as been undone by recent scandles and political meddling.

https://raybdbomb.com/uploads/pope_sith.jpg

Any condemnation of individual forum members who happen to be Catholic is not implied.
D6717C
Anger is a gift
+174|6667|Sin City

Nice pics at the end.  (Takes a step back and waits for lightening strike from a clear sky)


Muhahahaha.....
maffiaw
ph33r me 傻逼
+40|6455|Melbourne, AUS
this is bound to infuriate many people here...

not sure about the birth control thing - might not be solely based on religion alone. just look at India - breeding like rabbits- 1.1 billion and rising in a country a third of the size of China. I wonder where they're gonna go?

As for the Catholic Church, no comment as I have no basis or credibility to an opinion (not even a Christian), except for the fact that Darth Sidious does look awfully like the Pope.
neon_flux601
Member
+18|6285|Sidahnee Orstrayleeah
you're not protestant by chance?

just kidding!

can't get that theme song out of my head for 'the catholic boat' from south park - remember? when father mackey had to defeat the water lizards... and the giant spider... oh the times spent at uni...
ATG
Banned
+5,233|6563|Global Command

neon_flux601 wrote:

you're not protestant by chance?

just kidding!

can't get that theme song out of my head for 'the catholic boat' from south park - remember? when father mackey had to defeat the water lizards... and the giant spider... oh the times spent at uni...
No, but I am a long suffering American who lives 93 miles from the mexican border.
CommieChipmunk
Member
+488|6604|Portland, OR, USA

neon_flux601 wrote:

you're not protestant by chance?

just kidding!

can't get that theme song out of my head for 'the catholic boat' from south park - remember? when father mackey had to defeat the water lizards... and the giant spider... oh the times spent at uni...
The Catholic boaaaaaaat

Last edited by CommieChipmunk (2007-04-13 19:10:16)

m3thod
All kiiiiiiiiinds of gainz
+2,197|6706|UK
Muslims and the destruction of mecca this morning.

Dystroy christians in the evening.

ATG c'est loco.

Last edited by m3thod (2007-04-13 19:16:36)

Blackbelts are just whitebelts who have never quit.
FeedUsYourFetus
Member
+89|6487
So do you hate Catholics? Mexicans? Catholic Mexicans?  I'm confused.

Do you hate me?  I'm Catholic.  I grew up in a Catholic family.  I went to Catholic elementary school.  I went to  Catholic high school.  I married a Catholic woman.  And I still CHOOSE to attend mass weekly.  However, my wife is on the pill.  And I don't plan on having any more children than I can support.

Keep in mind that some of the more radical dogma of Catholicism is seen as archaic nonsense by many if not most Catholics in AMERICA.  How many Catholics in America today really believe that Mary and Joseph didn't bang?  And how many Catholics in America really believe they are sinning by using birth control?  Seriously.

KiL
Fen321
Member
+54|6532|Singularity
The urge to procreate by Mexicans does not require a religious belief to do so no? So if its a possibility that its not a requirement then there sure as hell is a possibility that the link between Catholicism and procreation is bound to be weak at some point.

Sure, I can understand the fact that the church places an emphasis on abstaining from procreating -- until married (ha -- this may be different depending on who you talk to) -- yet paradoxically they are then blamed for the birth that happen because people fail to adhere to the alleged correct "path". So -- essentially it gets blamed for the high birth rates because people don't adhere to their standard....so how is it there fault then? If its unrealistic, which is going to be an opinion without a doubt, I'm not sure if i could lay the blame on purely religious undertones. Unless there have been studies to that effect in Mexico that I'm unaware of then -- sorry.
san4
The Mas
+311|6723|NYC, a place to live

FeedUsYourFetus wrote:

How many Catholics in America today really believe that Mary and Joseph didn't bang?
I lol'd at the slangy blasphemy!
TrollmeaT
Aspiring Objectivist
+492|6707|Colorado
Funny how the opponents of capitalism blame it for all the woes of the world when it is the only system that has raised the standard of living for the entire world.
The cruelty of capitalism HA! The pope should check his premises & history, but it is plain too see he is just trying to negate the minds & body's of his followers.
neon_flux601
Member
+18|6285|Sidahnee Orstrayleeah

ATG wrote:

neon_flux601 wrote:

you're not protestant by chance?

just kidding!

can't get that theme song out of my head for 'the catholic boat' from south park - remember? when father mackey had to defeat the water lizards... and the giant spider... oh the times spent at uni...
No, but I am a long suffering American who lives 93 miles from the mexican border.
Hey I didn't mean to play down your post, so I do apologise for that.

I can truly empathise with you.

It was a good episode though...
ATG
Banned
+5,233|6563|Global Command

FeedUsYourFetus wrote:

So do you hate Catholics? Mexicans? Catholic Mexicans?  I'm confused.

Do you hate me?  I'm Catholic.  I grew up in a Catholic family.  I went to Catholic elementary school.  I went to  Catholic high school.  I married a Catholic woman.  And I still CHOOSE to attend mass weekly.  However, my wife is on the pill.  And I don't plan on having any more children than I can support.

Keep in mind that some of the more radical dogma of Catholicism is seen as archaic nonsense by many if not most Catholics in AMERICA.  How many Catholics in America today really believe that Mary and Joseph didn't bang?  And how many Catholics in America really believe they are sinning by using birth control?  Seriously.

KiL
Erm, oh fetus eater, I think you should reread the very last line of my post.


TrollmeaT wrote:

Funny how the opponents of capitalism blame it for all the woes of the world when it is the only system that has raised the standard of living for the entire world.
The cruelty of capitalism HA! The pope should check his premises & history, but it is plain too see he is just trying to negate the minds & body's of his followers.
he gets it, he gets it!.
neon_flux601
Member
+18|6285|Sidahnee Orstrayleeah

ATG wrote:

Any condemnation of individual forum members who happen to be Catholic is not implied.
love the <sub> tags
Spark
liquid fluoride thorium reactor
+874|6709|Canberra, AUS

neon_flux601 wrote:

ATG wrote:

Any condemnation of individual forum members who happen to be Catholic is not implied.
love the <sub> tags
Change to [sup]

Otherwise, excellent post.
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
Skorpy-chan
Member
+127|6379|Twyford, UK
But catholicism is italian, not french. Further south, you illiterate goon.

Although technically it's from the Vatican, but that's IN italy. The 'roman catholic church' part should tip you off there.
sergeriver
Cowboy from Hell
+1,928|6792|Argentina
You cant ban a Religion.  Of course there are some wackos and extremists in every religion, but there are a lot of good people too.  The Pope eats shit, but not all the Catholics like to eat shit.  You shouldn't generalize.  I'm not a religious person but we should respect other people's beliefs.
justice
OctoPoster
+978|6775|OctoLand

sergeriver wrote:

You cant ban a Religion.  Of course there are some wackos and extremists in every religion, but there are a lot of good people too.  The Pope eats shit, but not all the Catholics like to eat shit.  You shouldn't generalize.  I'm not a religious person but we should respect other people's beliefs.
I know fucking karate
ATG
Banned
+5,233|6563|Global Command

sergeriver wrote:

The Pope eats shit, but not all the Catholics like to eat shit.  .
Oh my, that's a keeper.

* edit 
I just thought you should know that your thread "Ban The Catholic Church From America." has been reported for "bashing religion" and "just close this plz."
Instead of hit the report button, why not refute my claims?

Last edited by ATG (2007-04-13 19:55:24)

The#1Spot
Member
+105|6574|byah
Well it boils down to white people messing up again. Since Roman Catholic was big in Europe they forced it on people that they met when discovering a new territory. So if you blame the Mexicans and their religion well its not their fault 75% i would say. If you hate illegal aliens so much quit whining and write a letter to the govt to have them improve the security to stop illegal aliens.
m3thod
All kiiiiiiiiinds of gainz
+2,197|6706|UK

ATG wrote:

sergeriver wrote:

The Pope eats shit, but not all the Catholics like to eat shit.  .
Oh my, that's a keeper.

* edit 
I just thought you should know that your thread "Ban The Catholic Church From America." has been reported for "bashing religion" and "just close this plz."
Instead of hit the report button, why not refute my claims?
This is debate.  If you don't like it challenge him or move on.

Reporting is for pussies.
Blackbelts are just whitebelts who have never quit.
smtt686
this is the best we can do?
+95|6665|USA

The#1Spot wrote:

Well it boils down to white people messing up again.
I had no idea al sharpton and jesse jackson were on this site
Canin
Conservative Roman Catholic
+280|6509|Foothills of S. Carolina

I will attempt to reply to ATGs post as best as I can, with facts as best as possible. For the part about teaching responsible family planning, Roman Catholic teaching is chastity and abstinence. Chastity even in marriage. I know I have gone on about this once before, and I was ridiculed then. The Roman Catholic Churches teachings are not worth the paper they are printed on if people don't listen and don't follow the rules. If parents don't teach and talk to their children about abstinence and chastity than who will? You can try and lay the blame of irresponsible family planning at the feet of the church, but the church can only make the rules, it cannot enforce them. If it could, do you think Ted Kennedy and John Kerry would still be able to call themselves Catholics?


I will post more rebuttals when I am able.

  Oh, and your link "You cannot claim to worship Jesus in the Tabernacle, if you do not pity Jesus in the slums.

  is not to a site that is even in accord with the Catholic Church, and their quote page has all of 3 Bible verses, all old testament, and a bunch of quotes from historical figures, with the words manipulated so that the site owner can feel good about himself.

Last edited by Canin (2007-04-13 20:38:09)

DesertFox-
The very model of a modern major general
+794|6719|United States of America

ATG wrote:

Growing up, I always thought that our beef with Cuba was because of their communist socialist ties. The French were bad because they are a socialist country. 58000 young Americans died in Vietnam to stop the spread of socialism and communism.

Flash forward to today. Americas main gripe besides exploding Islamic jihadist is the border with Mexico.

Mexico has a enormous problem with poverty and large families. Part of Catholic dogma is an anti-birth control stance. So you have reckless family planning combined with a corrupt  economy and what do you get?
12 million illegal aliens from Mexico in the United States.
I don't understand the Mexico implication; however, I assume you are saying that illegals are Catholics who can't are breeding like the old school Christians back in the day?

ATG wrote:

Lets examine a few others issues with regards to the catholics, forgetting, of course  crimes or allegations thereof prior to the 1980's.

Pope's New Book Criticizes Capitalism

"Confronted with the abuse of economic power, with the cruelty of capitalism that degrades man into merchandise, we have begun to see more clearly the dangers of wealth and we understand in a new way what Jesus intended in warning us about wealth."
Well, excuse the fuck outta me. I guess owning my own home and making payments on my wifes car is wealth. I'm all for mexicans having a decent quality of life, I'd just prefer that they largely do it in Mexico.

The more illegal aliens are exported to America, the more the quality of life here is diminished, wages are repressed and law and order breaks down.
The Pope is where the buck stops in the Church. You wouldn't condemn the whole United States for something El Presidente says. However, at this point in time ol' Benedict hasn't filled the shoes of John Paul. He's like the Truman of popes.

ATG wrote:

"You cannot claim to worship Jesus in the Tabernacle, if you do not pity Jesus in the slums.

But instead of teaching responsible family planning you advocate filling the slums with with these needy, largely illiterate people who then go forth to be fruitful and multiply. Teaching responsibility is charity.

If "Towards a Better Distribution of Land" has a failing, it is its emphasis on distribution at the expense of production (though it theorizes that "growth in agriculture leads to an expansion in the industrial service sectors, and hence to overall economic growth") - But land is an issue that lends itself to an overemphasis on distribution because, unlike labor and capital, there is only a fixed quantity of it available.

So, because there is a limited amount of land, it shouldn't be privately owned because that, of course wouldn't be equal now would it?
I don't know of many people who follow the Churchs stance on birth control in this country. Myself, I don't care, since it's not like you need teh sechz to go on living. I frankly don't understand why with the birth control dealie, why people still think it's okay to go on shagging like minxes and think they won't have more children. Control yourself and keep it in your pants while working on improving conditions of life.

ATG wrote:

Are you out of your fucking mind?

In the Jesuit' America, Miguel Esperanza give the following figures: "Between September 1990 and the present moment (June 1992), the Shining Path has assassinated five pastoral agents, two religious women and three priests. The number may seem small, but politically and socially their deaths clearly signified an important new step in the violent career of the Shining Path." 17 Klaiber's writings refer to the same five.

The allegation here is that certain Catholic clergy and nuns have been killed in South America because they are helping foment radical socialist regimes and insurgencies.

We all shook our heads when the nuns were murdered in Peru, now it appears there is more to the story.
Not too well educated on the political and whatnot climate in South America so I don't know what to say about this here argument, Shining Path appear to be commies though. Have a cookie.

ATG wrote:

Oh, let's not forget the hundreds of millions in sex crimes settlements.

Last I checked, people who went around dorking little boys went to prison, they didn't write a check and get sent on to the next parish.

So in conclusion, the Catholic Church has become a cartoonish vision of evil, and a forceful proponent of socialism. I think it's time the entity be put on a list of vile organizations, like the Taliban.

Whatever good that it has done as been undone by recent scandles and political meddling.
Actions of a few have led to the condemnation of thousands. That very article states:
While the vast majority of priests are thought never to have abused any children (99.8%),[9] the small minority of priests who are known to have commited offences did have easy access to children.
Not cool that the media makes it seem über widespread either.

EDIT- If you're gonna reply to this, don't quote it but rather just type my name so I know and address the issues you wish to discuss.

Last edited by DesertFox423 (2007-04-13 20:26:47)

some_random_panda
Flamesuit essential
+454|6425

First ban Scientology and only then will I consider banning anything else.

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