so a choco holic is the opposite of a crack addictts-pulsar wrote:
Chocolate is considered to be a drug by many doctors, though I don't know any doctors that consider it to be a bad drug.
white powder skinny
brown sludge fat
white powder skinny
brown sludge fat
wow, that list brought back alot of memories
you cant be addicted to marijauna maybe mentally but not physically.
Youd be surprised. Caffine addicts dont know they are addicted and see nothing wrong with it. However, and illegal substance like cannabis is easy to spot. It just seems like there are more potheads.Flaming_Maniac wrote:
Exactly. Addictive substances when used in a non-addictive fashion is fine, but over-use leading to addiction is bad. Coffee, for example, is not bad, but can be very bad for someone who is addicted to it, as is Cannabis. However, I would hazard a guess that there are more Weed addicts than coffee addicts.Skruples wrote:
You can get addicted to practically any substance. You can get addicted to caffeine for christs sake, addictive properties do not necessarily make a substance bad.Flaming_Maniac wrote:
The fact that cannabis causes addiction means it's bad right there. Show me one example of a good addiction to prove me wrong.
I know, and honestly there should be more "caffeine addiction awareness", but I think Cannabis damages more lives and relationships than caffeine, as it has to be a pretty strong addiction to make a big difference.jonsimon wrote:
Youd be surprised. Caffine addicts dont know they are addicted and see nothing wrong with it. However, and illegal substance like cannabis is easy to spot. It just seems like there are more potheads.Flaming_Maniac wrote:
Exactly. Addictive substances when used in a non-addictive fashion is fine, but over-use leading to addiction is bad. Coffee, for example, is not bad, but can be very bad for someone who is addicted to it, as is Cannabis. However, I would hazard a guess that there are more Weed addicts than coffee addicts.Skruples wrote:
You can get addicted to practically any substance. You can get addicted to caffeine for christs sake, addictive properties do not necessarily make a substance bad.
This whole addiction thing total depends on the person and how they handle themselfs. I smoke weed every day and many times a day, I have two degrees right now in mechanical engineering, and I am in the process of getting my third. I have been smoking pot for almost 12 years now, I have never had a problem with stopping if I need to I did. This whole addiction thing is simply mind over matter. If you let it run your life then it will do just that, and this is true with all drugs, yes some are harder than others to kick. Out of all the drugs that I have done on a regular basis (pot, special-k, E, coce, lsd, tobaco, shrooms, pcp, opium) tobaco is the hardest one to walk away from. And this is just me everyone is diffrent.
drugs are already classified in such a manner. They are called Schedules. Schedule V being the most mundane and least dangerous, and Schedule I being illegal narcotics and the like.
EDIT - Marijuana is currently at Schedule I
EDIT - Marijuana is currently at Schedule I
Last edited by PuckMercury (2006-07-31 18:34:58)
The problem is the other people that can't walk away from it, and I shutter at the thought of cannabis being legalized compared to the productivity of our society.Ether151 wrote:
This whole addiction thing total depends on the person and how they handle themselfs. I smoke weed every day and many times a day, I have two degrees right now in mechanical engineering, and I am in the process of getting my third. I have been smoking pot for almost 12 years now, I have never had a problem with stopping if I need to I did. This whole addiction thing is simply mind over matter. If you let it run your life then it will do just that, and this is true with all drugs, yes some are harder than others to kick. Out of all the drugs that I have done on a regular basis (pot, special-k, E, coce, lsd, tobaco, shrooms, pcp, opium) tobaco is the hardest one to walk away from. And this is just me everyone is diffrent.
Nicotine should be at the top of that list.
Was I refering to overdose? No? Well then.SuperSlowYo wrote:
no offence but thats an absolutely ridiculous comment you can say the same with any drug... it wasnt alcohol that killed him it was liver failure or it wasnt a cocaine o.d. it was his heart exploding... bottom line is those ppl died from E...UnOriginalNuttah wrote:
No-one has 'directly' died from smoking a cigarette either...=OBS= EstebanRey wrote:
Cannabis more dangerous than ecstasy? Bollocks, no one has ever died directly from smoking a spliff, plenty have from taking an 'E'.
And actually, no-one has died 'directly' from E, it's always been dehydration or water on the brain from excessive drinking as far as I know... please correct me if you can.
http://www.lycaeum.org/ <--------- best drug reference site
Anyway, over here where the study took place there are 'suspected' ecstasy overdoses and reactions, but as far as I'm aware the actual deaths are attributed to contaminants in pills, dehydration or excessive hydration. But don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that it's safe, it can obviously cause death for those very reasons. Would you like to show me where your source refutes this claim, exactly? I read the relevant sections, but it doesn't actually mention fatal reactions at normal dose without an outside agent being involved.
In fact, the only paragraph I can find refering to death doesn't say anything to indicate it is any more or less dangerous to other stimulants:
I have said, no deaths have been attribute to pure ecstasy at a normal dose 'as far as i know', but I'd love to see any credible sources which can show me otherwise. I didn't say overdose is impossible, you can overdose on pretty much anything.http://leda.lycaeum.org/?ID=10549 wrote:
Contraindications and overdose information:
MDMA causes an increase in blood pressure and pulse rate, modest in most people, similar to moderate exercise. Because of this, and because a few people may have a more pronounced cardiac response to MDMA, people with a history of high blood pressure, heart trouble, or stroke are advised not to use MDMA, or at the very least are advised to start with a much lower than average dose. The same warning applies to people who are hypersensitive to drugs. Liver or kidney problems may also contraindicate MDMA use. It is, of course, desirable to hear from your physician that you're in good overall health before ingesting any powerful substance.
Deaths have been reported of some MDMA users who were also taking Monoamine Oxidase Inhibitors (MAOIs are often prescribed as antidepressants). MDMA is *not* recommended to anyone taking any MAOI. Ask your doctor or pharmacist if you're unsure whether a drug you are taking is an MAOI. Also be aware that some antidepressants (e.g. Prozac and Zoloft) may inhibit some of the effects of MDMA.
MDMA is thought by many to be a fairly safe drug, as long as you keep track of what your body is telling you (see Section III below for more discussion of safety). The euphoria that it induces can make it easy to ignore bodily distress signals, so be watchful for things like dehydration (drink lots of water or fruit juices!), muscle cramping, dizziness, exhaustion or overexertion. Several reports from England tell of dosed ravers dancing themselves into severe dehydration and heat exhaustion that required hospitalization and in a few cases resulted in death. An MDMA overdose is characterized by high pulse or blood pressure, faintness, muscle cramping, or panic attacks. If you experience any of these symptoms, sit down, rest, and drink some fruit juice, water, or a gatorade-type sports drink. In the unlikely event someone has a more severe reaction, e.g. loss of consciousness or seizures, get medical help as soon as possible.
Here's an interesting fact:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tetrahydrocannabinol wrote:
THC has a LD50 value of 1270 mg/kg (male rats) and 730 mg/kg (female rats) administered orally dissolved in sesame oil.
If this were scaled up to an adult human, the lethal dose would be between approximately 50 and 86 g for a 68 kg (150 lb) person. This would be equivalent to 1-1.8 kg of marijuana with a 5% THC content (roughly average) taken orally (much more if smoked).
Last edited by UnOriginalNuttah (2006-07-31 18:47:57)
Cannabis should be legalized, the only reason it is illegal is the lobbying of our manufacturing industry.
The truth is that the Cannabis plant can be used to create anything from superior building materials, to soaps, to clothing superior to cotton, to healthy foods and supplements. Hemp is an extremely versitile plant being healthy for you while containing the strongest plant fibers in the world. The real kicker is its growth as a crop. Resistent to pesticides, pests, adaptable to dry or wet climates, and even varying temperatures, Cannabis is probably the most robust crop in the world.
Psychoactive Marijuana is illegal as a pretense to shelter American industry from the devastating effects of a full fledged Hemp market.
The truth is that the Cannabis plant can be used to create anything from superior building materials, to soaps, to clothing superior to cotton, to healthy foods and supplements. Hemp is an extremely versitile plant being healthy for you while containing the strongest plant fibers in the world. The real kicker is its growth as a crop. Resistent to pesticides, pests, adaptable to dry or wet climates, and even varying temperatures, Cannabis is probably the most robust crop in the world.
Psychoactive Marijuana is illegal as a pretense to shelter American industry from the devastating effects of a full fledged Hemp market.
Last edited by jonsimon (2006-07-31 18:52:20)
Meth is GRADE A the WORST drug out on todays streets!! Anyone want to argue that, talk with your local police, they will tell you I'm right!!
You don't need to bother karmaing me to say that, you are entitled to your opinion based on whatever you based it on... but I operate on facts, not mindless hysteria. And this thread is about whether people think that drugs should be classified in the same way, by the reality of the harm they cause. Like I've said, if you can show me anything which says MDMA is deadly in normal, pure dosage other than you saying 'drugs are bad, mkaay' and 'e is a killer' then I'll gladly take a look.karma wrote:
im not gettin into an argument about drugs with ya but you seriously dont have a clue if the kids werent high they wouldnt have died E is to blame period... SuperS
I don't particular feel the need to debate on whether your opinion about E and about me is right or wrong, you are entitled to your opinion no matter how baseless. But I have studied a vast body of literature on the subject from Shulgin to Saunders and MAPS to Mendelson and everything in between and know a massive number of people who take or have taken MDMA, plus extensive personal experience, but please feel free to continue to think I "don't have a clue". To put your comments into the perspective of the discussion, may I take it that you think the present system of classifying drugs by hype and opinion is the best way to do things?
An on topic response, +1. In the UK we have 3 classifications, A (most dangerous), B (soft drugs) and C (prescription drugs) as well as unclassified substances. If you look at the graph you can see that the classes are colour coded, and are wildly different from the calculated dangers of each of the substances.PuckMercury wrote:
drugs are already classified in such a manner. They are called Schedules. Schedule V being the most mundane and least dangerous, and Schedule I being illegal narcotics and the like.
EDIT - Marijuana is currently at Schedule I
I've just noticed that cocaine is a classified lower than cannabis according to the US schedule system... also GHB was placed in schedule I simply because people started using it recreationally. This to me reeks of a system run by opinion and hysteria, not fact. Just look where barbituates are placed, which are known to be dangerous and have been all but phased out of common use. This proposal, if it were relating to the US system, would be suggesting that valid scientific study be used to determine the placement of drugs on the scale and the penalties for possession, production or distribution.
I imagine you're being sarcastic, but the last time I checked marijuana was the least of their worries. The government in general has been demonizing the drug for as long as can be remembered, but the most dangerous activity potheads are likely to be involved in is loitering.fadedsteve wrote:
Meth is GRADE A the WORST drug out on todays streets!! Anyone want to argue that, talk with your local police, they will tell you I'm right!!
HUH?? What are you talking about?? Meth is NOT pot my friend. . . .Skruples wrote:
I imagine you're being sarcastic, but the last time I checked marijuana was the least of their worries. The government in general has been demonizing the drug for as long as can be remembered, but the most dangerous activity potheads are likely to be involved in is loitering.fadedsteve wrote:
Meth is GRADE A the WORST drug out on todays streets!! Anyone want to argue that, talk with your local police, they will tell you I'm right!!
Your right Weed is the least of anyones worries, their is no disputing that, but METHAMPHETAMINE is THE WORST drug out there right now! The recovery rates of meth are lower than heroin!!!!!! Thats sad!!!!!!!
Very correct +1 dude.Scorpion0x17 wrote:
And, by that definition, so is chocolate.
Kids, Weed is bad for you and its addictive, please don't think its ok cos it aint a white powder or a tablet with a pic on it. Over time you will loose some memory and it can turn you anti - social. The drug is a downer not an upper, it makes you want to chill not dance. However, its better for you than alcohol, but if you do smoke, stick to the green cos the Taliban are probably lacing the brown with all kinds of shit. If they legalised it fully and sold it as they do with beer there would be less crime. Crime goes up in my area when the police raid someone, confiscate the weed and thus stop other sfrom buying, smoking and chilling the fuck out.
LOL yah a HAPPY pill that makes one not discriminate whome they have sex with, thus spreading genital Herpies, and other STD's. It also results in Unwanted Kids, and leads to higher rates of abortion. In my book its a BAD drug. You could say the same for Weed, but i think the medical uses of Pot outweigh the negatives if there really are any.gbr.hitman wrote:
Ectacy shouldn't be that high because its a 'happy' pill which causes hardly any problems to society.
As UnOriginalNuttah pointed out, no one has ever died from estacy, only from drinking too much or too little water.
I would have rated over a 10 before i found the woman i merried, She basically saved my life 17 years ago.
Spot on! Also, the stinking price goes up every time they raid the big guy LOL.1927 wrote:
Kids, Weed is bad for you and its addictive, please don't think its ok cos it aint a white powder or a tablet with a pic on it. Over time you will loose some memory and it can turn you anti - social. The drug is a downer not an upper, it makes you want to chill not dance. However, its better for you than alcohol, but if you do smoke, stick to the green cos the Taliban are probably lacing the brown with all kinds of shit. If they legalised it fully and sold it as they do with beer there would be less crime. Crime goes up in my area when the police raid someone, confiscate the weed and thus stop other sfrom buying, smoking and chilling the fuck out.
What are you on about, you've mixed up alcohol and e there I think. Ecstasy gives feelings of platonic love, where as alcohol gives people 'beer goggles'. I've never heard anyone say that e makes you less discriminating about who you have sex with before, only in that horrorist track 'one night in new york city' track but that is about statutory rape anyway because the girl is only 15. It's a very dark track designed to shock people, and not a reflection of reality.<[onex]>Headstone wrote:
LOL yah a HAPPY pill that makes one not discriminate whome they have sex with, thus spreading genital Herpies, and other STD's. It also results in Unwanted Kids, and leads to higher rates of abortion. In my book its a BAD drug. You could say the same for Weed, but i think the medical uses of Pot outweigh the negatives if there really are any.gbr.hitman wrote:
Ectacy shouldn't be that high because its a 'happy' pill which causes hardly any problems to society.
As UnOriginalNuttah pointed out, no one has ever died from estacy, only from drinking too much or too little water.
I would have rated over a 10 before i found the woman i merried, She basically saved my life 17 years ago.
I have never ever pulled in a nightclub when the chicks are on E, or when I used to for that matter. Its a clubbers drug, people dont want to go home early for a sesh "after coffee" they want to stay out and party and thats why they take E in the 1st place, so they get "up" and stay "up". Same goes for fighting, not that I do go out looking for that but I have never seen True Clubbers fight because they swollowing the love drug as if its going outta fashion, passing water along the line along with Vicks Nose Spays ?? What the heck they were for I do not know, but I smiled said "thanks m8" had a sniff "sorted" ??
Amthetamine/Speed/Whizz/Billy is bad, very bad, Will lead to addiction, your life will depend on it, yes your confidence will go up as the drug takes effect. Gives prolonged "staying power" after the coffee back at hers and she will think your a "Sex Guru" but thats it, it's a shit drug, cheap, readily available but dont take the bait, leave it alone.
I learned in 1998 in Es Paradise - Ibiza Aug 24th, you only need Alcohol for a good time, I left my pills and powder on the Island. Im chuffed my Drug days are behind me, I can warn my kids and others about them and take them clubbing myself and show how you dont need this or that, regardless of what "dave down the pub" says.
Whenever I was the driver when we went clubbing I found with Eyes lit up like balloons I always drove with more concentration and when I got pulled by the police they could see I had my wits about me and wouldnt even bother asking to "blow into this sir". Nowadays they can swab you to see what drugs you have taken that night and prosecute accordingly.
Amthetamine/Speed/Whizz/Billy is bad, very bad, Will lead to addiction, your life will depend on it, yes your confidence will go up as the drug takes effect. Gives prolonged "staying power" after the coffee back at hers and she will think your a "Sex Guru" but thats it, it's a shit drug, cheap, readily available but dont take the bait, leave it alone.
I learned in 1998 in Es Paradise - Ibiza Aug 24th, you only need Alcohol for a good time, I left my pills and powder on the Island. Im chuffed my Drug days are behind me, I can warn my kids and others about them and take them clubbing myself and show how you dont need this or that, regardless of what "dave down the pub" says.
Whenever I was the driver when we went clubbing I found with Eyes lit up like balloons I always drove with more concentration and when I got pulled by the police they could see I had my wits about me and wouldnt even bother asking to "blow into this sir". Nowadays they can swab you to see what drugs you have taken that night and prosecute accordingly.
I know from being abit of a drug fiend in my youth and trying almost everything on that list that its aload of bolloxs. The Science Select Committee is a bunch of politicians who know nothing directly about drugs themselves but rely on consultants who are usually biased. This comes from the same "experts" who one year say cannabis isn't harmful and should be a class C drug to the next year saying the opposite because they have been put under pressure from a right wing lobbyist.
Nutter I agree with your attitude. But for proportionate harm and deaths in numbers first would have to be alcohol followed closely by tobacco then prescription drugs then heroin. Cannabis should be mid to low end of the table.
Nutter I agree with your attitude. But for proportionate harm and deaths in numbers first would have to be alcohol followed closely by tobacco then prescription drugs then heroin. Cannabis should be mid to low end of the table.
Mostly true, but do you mean most out of all drug deaths or most proportional to users? I'd say that heroin would still be highest proportional to users, I knew 2 people who've died from ODs, and 1 who died from hypothermia due to passing out at a warehouse party and 1 who drowned in a canal in holland.JahManRed wrote:
I know from being abit of a drug fiend in my youth and trying almost everything on that list that its aload of bolloxs. The Science Select Committee is a bunch of politicians who know nothing directly about drugs themselves but rely on consultants who are usually biased. This comes from the same "experts" who one year say cannabis isn't harmful and should be a class C drug to the next year saying the opposite because they have been put under pressure from a right wing lobbyist.
Nutter I agree with your attitude. But for proportionate harm and deaths in numbers first would have to be alcohol followed closely by tobacco then prescription drugs then heroin. Cannabis should be mid to low end of the table.
i've eaten hundreds of E's in my clubbing/raving dayz the reason the odd people die from ecstacy is cos of allergic reactions E's are no more deadly than peanuts.
LSD is quite dangerous i've had some hairy experiances on that shit.
weed isn't deadly but it is addictive people say it isn't it psycological but that's bollocks, i know
LSD is quite dangerous i've had some hairy experiances on that shit.
weed isn't deadly but it is addictive people say it isn't it psycological but that's bollocks, i know
It is addictive, Im not sure how many people in this thread have said it isnt but I for one have already and will always say it is. Im in my 16th year of it.Orgtheone wrote:
weed isn't deadly but it is addictive people say it isn't it psycological but that's bollocks, i know