ATG
Banned
+5,233|6545|Global Command

Kmarion wrote:

Consider.
Is the housing crisis really a "crisis"? In his commentary, Dennis Kneale crunches the numbers.
[google]http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1869812772037052822&hl=en[/google]
The commentary is recent.
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id … _article=1

Address       Sold Price       Sold On       Bed       Bath       Square Feet       Distance (miles)       Up  Comparable Relevance
      2*** Russell Dr     --     --     3     2.0     1,206     0.0     100% I paid 410k
1     2094 Mammoth Ln     $286,000     06/03/2008     3     2.0     1,485     0.3     97%
2     2144 Russell Dr     $348,000     05/02/2008     4     3.0     2,012     0.0     94%
3     1884 Stonehaven Dr     $257,500     06/17/2008     3     2.0     1,828     0.4     94%
4     742 Lassen Dr     $320,000     05/07/2008     3     3.0     1,699     0.3     94%
5     2213 Arabian Way     $234,900     05/23/2008     3     3.0     1,318     0.2     93%
6     545 Ventura Ave     $289,000     05/23/2008     3     2.0     1,240     0.9     92%
7     2125 Saddleback Dr     $343,000     04/02/2008     4     2.75     1,862     0.2     92%
8     421 Yosemite Cir     $360,000     04/01/2008     3     2.5     1,663     0.6     91%
9     428 Yellowstone Cir     $340,000     04/30/2008     3     2.5     1,663     0.7     91%
10     659 Shenandoah Rd     $390,000     05/16/2008     5     3.0     2,410     0.3     91%
      Average     $316,840     05/09/2008     3.4     2.575     1,718     0.4     93%
topal63
. . .
+533|6734
It isn't a housing crisis, it's a credit is money crisis. It's simple, well not really because there is know way to ever know how much money there actually is, credit is money. The money supply has shrunk drastically and is still shrinking. We are not anywhere near the bottom of the money collapse (a few fortune 500 birdies - that know their shit whispered in my ear, "... we are not doing anything, taking any chances now. You can write this entire year off and part of next year off to."). The collapse of credit money has yet to trickle through the entire economy - slowly but surely it is doing so.

IMO, a talented singular human workforce going by the BF2S moniker ATG could easily afford a house at any price. But, not if a money supply collapse happens. If a year ago someone told me I would fire EVERYONE that I employed and that my engineering business would be down 95%. I would have said, "you're full of shit." And, yet I'd have been the wrong one. I am fairly certain that ATG's business is somewhat like mine in these respects: it is not connected to any governmental money spinning/circling, it's a real world real economy enterprise, it is dependent upon real work and real human effort, and it is dependent upon others having access to a money supply else no work-orders for HIM/ME!!!

As a long time business owner, and having worked in responsible charge in others businesses, over the last 25 years. For our industry (engineering, land surveying, land development) this credit money collapse issue - is the single worst thing ever to have happened in any business cycle ever.

I guess if I was an unethical government whore with no personal integrity and had some DOT contracts, muni-projects, etc, I wouldn't think it's so bad - well actually those scumbags sort-of-friends of mine are hurting to.

WTF has personal ideology have to do with current situation - nothing. It's a money supply issue. It's a 30-40 year in the making American decimation of the work-ethic/working-man issue. It's a how money is created issue and what in relation it is created to issue.

Personally I couldn't afford my own house - if I had to purchase it today at today's prices. Can I afford an xbox 360, a new cell phone, a night out at the movies? You betcha moron. Could I come up with the 20% down payment for the home I am living in? Now way moron. In the current economic environment can I afford to employee people - who have families and mortgages? No way moron.

Last edited by topal63 (2008-07-14 08:19:47)

13rin
Member
+977|6495
410k  ... ouch.
I stood in line for four hours. They better give me a Wal-Mart gift card, or something.  - Rodney Booker, Job Fair attendee.
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6572
Bring on the collapse. I'll be there to scavenge for the leftovers. Not having bought ftw!!
deeznutz1245
Connecticut: our chimps are stealin yo' faces.
+483|6509|Connecticut

CameronPoe wrote:

Bring on the collapse. I'll be there to scavenge for the leftovers. Not having bought ftw!!
Those who already own and survive will come out on top with a very lucrative amount of equity. Tis my plan.
Malloy must go
m3thod
All kiiiiiiiiinds of gainz
+2,197|6687|UK

CameronPoe wrote:

Bring on the collapse. I'll be there to scavenge for the leftovers. Not having bought ftw!!
You've got competition! Lets have ye campoe!!
Blackbelts are just whitebelts who have never quit.
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6617|132 and Bush

Personally I couldn't afford my own house - if I had to purchase it today at today's prices. Can I afford an xbox 360, a new cell phone, a night out at the movies? You betcha moron. Could I come up with the 20% down payment for the home I am living in? Now way moron. Can I afford to employee people - who have families and mortgages? No way moron.
I think you'll find that most builders will help with closing cost.. or pay for them completely as they did in my circumstance. In my neighborhood if you use the builders lender you can get a rate around 5% fixed. If you are looking at a resale convince the seller to use a program like Nehemiah. If you have the good credit you say you have I seriously doubt you will be looking at 20% down. That's what most of my commercial loans require, and they are backed by SBA. Not being able to afford your house due to it's appreciation is not a bad thing.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
ELITE-UK
Scratching my back
+170|6490|SHEFFIELD, ENGLAND
Im starting to get worried now, the company i work for is doing well even though the credit crunch is in full swing. But my step dad and my brother work for the same company and they have slashed my step dads and my brothers overtime to virtually none, my step dad was getting £22k basic pay and £30k with his overtime. Our household income for my mom and step dad was at £42k a year and is now down around 20%.

But theres some good news in this, the company they work for which is a tow bar company,is one of the largest in europe and was booming before the crisis and sales are down 25%, but they told all their emplyees including my brother and step dad that noone will lose their jobs, and said they have enough money to keep on working even with falling orders and are going to wait out this crisis
Phrozenbot
Member
+632|6632|do not disturb

Kmarion wrote:

^^All part of the correction. Let them fail is right.. let them learn.

Your link wrote:

More than 252,000 properties, or one in 501 U.S. households, entered a stage of the foreclosure process, RealtyTrac Inc., a seller of default data, said today in a statement
Or approximately 0.199600798% .. "entered a stage" is faaaar from foreclosure. Especially now.
You are right the subprime market is only a fraction of the housing market, although people abroad are still being hurt with negative home equity (many peopled used their homes as ATMs). I think the housing market in itself isn't really that bad, although this problem is far from over. Inflation in my opinion is really amplifying its intensity. The fact that the dollar purchases less and wages have not been increasing means people are getting stretched thin with their money, already having a hard time paying off their mortgages.

Here is something interesting.



Kind of goes with this.

Last edited by Phrozenbot (2008-07-12 09:03:42)

Marinejuana
local
+415|6601|Seattle

Phrozenbot wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

^^All part of the correction. Let them fail is right.. let them learn.

Your link wrote:

More than 252,000 properties, or one in 501 U.S. households, entered a stage of the foreclosure process, RealtyTrac Inc., a seller of default data, said today in a statement
Or approximately 0.199600798% .. "entered a stage" is faaaar from foreclosure. Especially now.
You are right the subprime market is only a fraction of the housing market, although people abroad are still being hurt with negative home equity (many peopled used their homes as ATMs). I think the housing market in itself isn't really that bad, although this problem is far from over. Inflation in my opinion is really amplifying its intensity. The fact that the dollar purchases less and wages have not been increasing means people are getting stretched thin with their money, already having a hard time paying off their mortgages.

Here is something interesting.

lowing
Banned
+1,662|6667|USA

ELITE-UK wrote:

Im starting to get worried now, the company i work for is doing well even though the credit crunch is in full swing. But my step dad and my brother work for the same company and they have slashed my step dads and my brothers overtime to virtually none, my step dad was getting £22k basic pay and £30k with his overtime. Our household income for my mom and step dad was at £42k a year and is now down around 20%.

But theres some good news in this, the company they work for which is a tow bar company,is one of the largest in europe and was booming before the crisis and sales are down 25%, but they told all their emplyees including my brother and step dad that noone will lose their jobs, and said they have enough money to keep on working even with falling orders and are going to wait out this crisis
I think I like the company you work for, it appears they have the pulse of their employees and they care.

My airline delivered no less than 4 lay-off notices ( 30 day notice) only to "extend" the lay off to a future date each time over the course of 2 years.  Talk about having your life put on hold. Finally I lost my job an it was almost a relief because now the die was cast and I could then make a decision as to what to do next.
liquix
Member
+51|6470|Peoples Republic of Portland
Well, it sucks to lose your home I'm sure. Plenty of good hard working people lost their home because they didn't understand the risks of variable rates. There could be a 1,200 mortgage that balloons to 9 grand in a month, not many people can deal with that. Still, flipping and ridiculous lending/buying behavior did this, and we all got a slap in the face because of it.
LividBovine
The Year of the Cow!
+175|6396|MN
I honestly have little to no sympathy for people that lose their house because they cannot afford it.  If you blame the price of gas for pushing you over the edge, then you pushed the envelope too close.  If you cannot afford the payments that you signed up for, then you misjudged the economy and its affect on your business.  The only ones I have sympathy for is the children of those that feel they are taking it in the shorts.  The attitude that they are probably fostering in their children has to be a bitter one. 

I am not military, I have a mortgage, I have a car loan, I drive 45 miles each way to work, my wife owns her own business.

Edit: Fail spelling fails.

Last edited by LividBovine (2008-07-12 02:19:30)

"The President does not have power under the Constitution to unilaterally authorize a military attack in a situation that does not involve stopping an actual or imminent threat to the nation" - Barack Obama (a freshman senator from Illinios)
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6667|USA

LividBovine wrote:

I honestly have little to no sympathy for people that lose their house because they cannot afford it.  If you blame the price of gas for pushing you over the edge, then you pushed the envelope too close.  If you cannot afford the payments that you signed up for, then you misjudged the economy and its affect on your business.  The only ones I have sympathy for is the children of those that feel they are taking it in the shorts.  The attitude that they are probably fostering in their children has to be a bitter one. 

I am not military, I have a mortgage, I have a car loan, I drive 45 miles each way to work, my wife owns her own business.

Edit: Fail spelling fails.
ok................. but are you a mercenary??

Last edited by lowing (2008-07-12 03:52:49)

LividBovine
The Year of the Cow!
+175|6396|MN
No.  I make food, but I hope to be making wireless water and gas meters soon.  Does that count?
"The President does not have power under the Constitution to unilaterally authorize a military attack in a situation that does not involve stopping an actual or imminent threat to the nation" - Barack Obama (a freshman senator from Illinios)
KEN-JENNINGS
I am all that is MOD!
+2,973|6648|949

I wish I could buy afford to buy the house I live in.

Last edited by KEN-JENNINGS (2008-07-12 03:56:33)

lowing
Banned
+1,662|6667|USA

LividBovine wrote:

No.  I make food, but I hope to be making wireless water and gas meters soon.  Does that count?
Close enough!!, You are a govt. pimp no wonder you are successful. Now it all makes sense!!!!!!!!
13/f/taiwan
Member
+940|5715
Good news! They found the peopleperson responsible for this.

The U.S. Attorney for the Western District of Wisconsin announced a major conviction today in the ongoing criminal prosecution of the people who brought the economy to its knees four years ago via a toxic campaign of mortgage fraud. Meet James Wazlawik of Prescott, Wisc.

Wazlawik is 48 years old. He is married with three sons, one of whom was born with Down Syndrome and required heart surgery not long after he was born. Today he was sentenced to one day in jail and three years supervised release after pleading guilty to "making a false statement to a bank in connection with a home equity loan." His crime: When he applied for a $150,000 home equity loan from Citibank in 2005, he put his signature to an "income verification form" claiming that his monthly income was $8,500. In fact, it was substantially less than that.

Why would someone claim, falsely, to earn more income than they in fact do when applying for a mortgage? To get the loan, obviously. But here's how Wazlawik put it in a sentencing letter to U.S. District Court Judge Lynn Adelman:

https://img.gawkerassets.com/img/18qmgis91fiyyjpg/ku-xlarge.jpg

So Wazlawik, surprised to find that "a person could get a loan without a consistent income," took advantage of a loan officer's offer and signed on the dotted line. But why would a loan officer encourage someone without consistent income to obtain a home equity loan?

Probably because Citibank, the victim in this case—the U.S. Attorney's press release notes that the bank "lost $146,829 when Wazlawik was unable to repay the loan"—spent most of the last decade feverishly buying, packaging, and reselling mortgages that it knew would never be repaid. In 2012, Citigroup paid $158 million to the federal government to settle claims that in order to obtain insurance from the Federal Housing Administration, it systematically lied about the likelihood its loans would be repaid—sort of like providing false information on a loan application.

    The government said Wednesday that CitiMortgage had certified 30,000 mortgages for insurance provided by the Federal Housing Administration and submitted many certifications that were “knowingly or recklessly false.”

    More than a third of those mortgage loans went into default, resulting in millions of dollars in losses for the government because of the insurance claims.

    Preet Bharara, the United States attorney in Manhattan, said lenders for too long viewed “insurance of their mortgages like they were playing with house money.”

Justice Department prosecutors calculated that 30 percent of Citibank's FHA-insured loans went into default. That's $1.44 billion dollars worth of bad loans. For purposes of comparison, Wazlawik's loan (which may or may not have been FHA-insured) constituted 0.01 percent of that amount.

To hear Bloomberg describe it, back in 2005 Citigroup was hungrily scooping up as many mortgages as it could find without regard to the likelihood that they may be paid back. Almost as if they were, as a matter of corporate policy, soliciting people to fraudulently apply. Or soliciting mortgage brokers to find people to do so. Maybe the cousin of a friend.

    Investor demand was so strong for mortgages packaged into securities that Citigroup couldn’t process them fast enough. The Citi stamp of approval told investors that the bank would stand behind the mortgages if borrowers quit paying.

    At the mortgage-processing factory in O’Fallon, Hunt was working on an assembly line that helped inflate a housing bubble whose implosion would shake the world. The O’Fallon mortgage machinery was moving too fast to check every loan, Hunt says.

    By 2006, the bank was buying mortgages from outside lenders with doctored tax forms, phony appraisals and missing signatures, she says. It was Hunt’s job to identify these defects, and she did, in regular reports to her bosses.

In 2005, though it lost $146,829 on the mortgage it issued to Wazlawik as part of its aggressive, overt campaign of purposefully and knowingly issuing mortgages to people who couldn't repay them, Citibank made $19.8 billion in profit. Much of that profit came in the form of fees from packaging and selling loans like Wazlawik's. But like Wazlawik, Citibank failed to anticipate the economy turning sour. It has since been the recipient of more than $476.2 billion in cash and guarantees from American taxpayers, making it the single largest recipient of federal bailout funds after the economy collapsed as a direct result of what Citibank did with loans like Wazlawik's.

To date, no one in the executive ranks of Citibank—or any of the other Wall Street institutions that solicited and profited from loans like the one Citibank issued to Wazlawik—have been criminally targeted by the Department of Justice.

But Wazlawik now has a felony conviction on his record, will spend a humiliating day in jail, and will spend the next three years at risk of going to prison if he violates the terms of his release. You can sleep easy tonight, America, knowing that your Department of Justice is diligently going after those criminals who would do us harm.
Macbeth
Banned
+2,444|5602

We did it bf2s
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6122|eXtreme to the maX
So much easier to nail the small fry, not the real thieves.
Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!

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