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2006-04-21 12:16:25
Talon
Stop reading this and look at my post
+341|6972
Wow, I've never had so many positive replies. I'll add any direct comparisons to the list, if I think they're true, so don't be shy.

Mashtuur also wins the award of being the most balanced map in BF2. All the others, one side has at least a slight advantage. Mash is nice and symmetrical. Also, it's rarely done, but blowing up the bridges at the right moment (when the city is divided in half) stops all the movement of jeeps and turns the map into a completely different exprience (many snipers line either side of the valley, but you can get round by sneaking round the side roads or using the helis).

Of course, the best thing is still no APCs!

Last edited by Talon (2006-04-21 12:20:02)

2006-04-21 12:24:37
Burning_Monkey
Moving Target
+108|7049

Talon wrote:

Wow, I've never had so many positive replies. I'll add any direct comparisons to the list, if I think they're true, so don't be shy.

Mashtuur also wins the award of being the most balanced map in BF2. All the others, one side has at least a slight advantage. Mash is nice and symmetrical. Also, it's rarely done, but blowing up the bridges at the right moment (when the city is divided in half) stops all the movement of jeeps and turns the map into a completely different exprience (many snipers line either side of the valley, but you can get round by sneaking round the side roads or using the helis).

Of course, the best thing is still no APCs!
You know, I almost never see the bridge blown up.  When I do it's kind of shocking actually.
2006-04-21 12:25:26
RustyNails
BF2s US Server Admin
+31|6831|Margaritaville via Austin

I used to hate Mashtuur because of all the running around.  However, with time, it really has grown on me.  I'm becoming a true sniper junkie now and I love all of the great spots...for headshots :-).  I still play Karkwhore a lot but Ghost Town is the best inf map IMHO.

Cheers!
2006-04-21 12:28:33
Talon
Stop reading this and look at my post
+341|6972
You know, I almost never see the bridge blown up
It's so wide, people think its permanent. But anything with the bridge icon can go.
2006-04-21 12:41:50
Eric
Member
+0|6793|Chicago
Mashtuur is far better than Karkand in my opinion, but sadly Karkand seems to be running on many more servers
2006-04-21 13:05:39
CoconutBlitz
I've had the diarrheas since Easters
+145|6801|California U.S.A
Mashtuur!!!

I think its prob my best win/lose ratio as far as maps go.

No uncaps for any side=balanced. Equal armour i tank per side which you could steal/take away from other team

A highly superior design compared to Karkand. Mashtuur it's not linear like Karkand. More of a 360 degree approachable map the transport choppers rock... Kinda hard when your Spec ops seeing as how the enemy assets are spread over two flags for each side.

No one class is dominate, it all around flat out infantry battle, not a battle of the fucking "Hotel" cluster fuck like so many of Karkand's opening moments on every one i play.

It brings a smile when i see Mashtuur come up on the rotation it really is a beautiful map I think my fav is the street sign near the large bridge in the middle that says "Karkand->" kinda gives you a sense that all the maps are connected. I just like the sign, not the map Karkand, that map gives me a rash..

And before the patch/BH heli nerf a few ago that gawdamn Blackhawk was the undisputed Whore mobile!!!

(I must admit i was Engi wrenching like a mo-Fo pre BH-nerf patch laughing as we were not shot down at worst maybe once in a game)

And at that some serious shit had to hit the BH for it to go down. Like if all engis got shot out the doors and two AA missiles hit 3 AT rockets at the same time then your in trouble...now if you had 2 engi's a support a medic and a spec ops that was some Grade A whore time!!

I just wish they hadn't replaced the BH mini-guns with airsoft bullets. Can't kill shit with those things now as long as the enemy below has goggles on they wont get there eyes shot out and will be able to go about their infantry business unmolested seeing as how the Airsoft plastic bullets wont kill you..   

And to sum up, Mashtuur a highly superior design compared to Karkand!!

(Did I mention Karkand gived me a rash??) 

Last edited by Seal 3 (2006-04-21 13:09:14)

2006-04-21 13:11:43
IronFerret
Member
+48|6869|Mexico City.
aja
2006-04-21 13:12:33
PRiMACORD
Member
+190|6837|Home of the Escalade Herds
Agree, i like Mashtuur better when i just want to do infantry stuffs.
2006-04-21 15:06:04
Talon
Stop reading this and look at my post
+341|6972
Woohoo! 20 Karma.

More of a 360 degree approachable map
Added to the list. Every base has loads of approaches (think of the garage, where the US tank spawns, or the mosque). Plus, you can capture them in any order. Good point. Plus 1 karma to you.

Last edited by Talon (2006-04-21 15:06:57)

2006-04-21 15:14:21
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6983|PNW

OP:

You approached the comparisons on a neutral basis, yet the title of your post is a bit one-sided. I think multi-armor maps are cool, but I also like Mashtuur. Both that and Karkand great maps in their own right.

Here's my comparison...

Air:

Karkand: n/a
Mashtuur: transports, allowing for placement of infantry on ladderless buildings and quick flagging; weapons of both otherwise ineffective infantry supression since the Blackhawk nerf

Armor:

Karkand: tank + 2 APC's on each side (64 player) allow each team early access to armor; difficult for one team to hijack every armored vehicle; noob infantry are usually wiped out by the onslaught
Mashtuur: one tank on each side, each spawning dependant on cappable flags; very easy for one team to take control of both, which could be a bad thing

Antiarmor:

Karkand: plenty of TOW missiles and alleyways to hide in. mines can be easily hidden, and C4 placed in bushes or behind trees
Mashtuur: wide open roads make it more difficult to take out armor with anything but direct C4/AT strikes; no TOW's; mines easily avoidable on all areas but the bridge ramp, if armor is in a hurry

Assets:

Karkand: all assets are isolated within the farthest enemy bases, making it difficult for a team to destroy them
Mashtuur: assets are generally out in the open and easily neutralized due to the multiple approach paths for specops incursions; C4 can be dropped from on supply-equipped choppers for destruction in record time

Layout:

Karkand: linear, focusing large numbers of players to fight in one area; easy strategic options and choke points for the commander; easy to guesstimate artillery placement against enemies sneaking behind the lines
Mashtuur: wide open circular map allowing for many more approaches; difficult to predict enemy action, though it's safe to say that a smart team will allow your army to capture their tank spot, then attempt to hijack your armor

Overall:

Both these maps, despite both being small-town combat, are far too different to merit superiority contests.

Talon wrote:

Mashtuur does have the least Tanks/APCs.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but Mashtuur does not have APCs.

Last edited by unnamednewbie13 (2006-04-21 15:27:05)

2006-04-21 15:15:38
bullit
Tank Troll
+71|6901|London, UK
on maashtur who ever has the tank should always go for the place where the enemy tank is and cap the flag i done that alot and also protected the other tank that spawned, which meant my team had two tanks
http://bf3s.com/player/175948227
2006-04-21 15:24:50
Talon
Stop reading this and look at my post
+341|6972

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

OP:

I think multi-armor maps are cool, but I also like Mashtuur.
I did put infantry map in the top line. Mashtuur does have the least Tanks/APCs.
2006-04-21 15:26:56
eusgen
Nugget
+402|7004|Jupiter
good comparison +1
2006-04-21 15:34:06
Vilham
Say wat!?
+580|6978|UK
I own at either so.... However i do prefere mashture, best for clan matches. The scope for tactics is so much bigger, karkand is too linear as u said. +1 k
2006-04-21 15:34:11
Paco_the_Insane
Phorum Phantom
+244|6856|Ohio
I personally think Sharqi is better than both, as some one said earlier. The armor is almost ineffective, and the Helos usually end up fighting eachother because its such a small fighting area. So it makes it awsome for infantry which i usually am.
2006-04-21 15:35:06
Vilham
Say wat!?
+580|6978|UK
PS mashtur has APC for each team on 16 player...
2006-04-21 15:38:14
Vampira_NB
Trying is the first step to failing
+76|6885|Canada Eh?
I prefer Mashtuur to Karkand, Sharqi to Mashtuur, and Wake to Sharqi.
2006-04-21 15:41:20
mcminty
Moderating your content for the Australian Govt.
+879|6933|Sydney, Australia
I like Mashtuur better although if you look at my stats, you can see Karkand is my 2nd most player map (by a long shot).

The simple reason is I didn't have enough RAM to play it lag-free. But now that's been solved I'll be playing Mashtuur again today.
2006-04-21 16:03:27
wooly-back-jack
Jihaaaaaad!!!
+84|6952|England

FesterTheMolester wrote:

overall, karkand ownz mashtuur
I dont usually nit pick on peoples stats (mainly because mine are shite ) but mate you cant make a comment like that when you clearly havent got experience on any other maps apart from Karkwhore

total played 175:54:24
...of which Karkand 157:39:48

1st seargent and you have played 7 minutes on FuShe Pass, 53 seconds on Operation Clean Sweep...and staying on-topic... less than 2 hours on Mashtuur.
no offence, but get some variety in your game and enjoy the other maps for a change

Last edited by wooly-back-jack (2006-04-21 16:05:39)

2006-04-21 16:14:32
Capt. Foley
Member
+155|6799|Allentown, PA, USA

Talon wrote:

Lets get the flaming... I mean discussion started! IMO Mashtuur is the ultimate infantry map.

http://wiki.bf2s.com/_media/maps/strike … ache=cachehttp://wiki.bf2s.com/_media/maps/mashtu … ache=cache


Karkand/Mashtuur

2 APCs and 1 tank each/1 tank each

US has uncap base/neither side has uncap base

US cant lose vehicles/both sides can lose vehicles

No transport helicopters/1 transport heli each

Only one or two good places for sniping/many places to snipe, but enough paths to dodge snipers. (unlike Wake, for example)

Total grenade and claymore spamming/big enough for them to be less effective.

Constant spawnraping due to small size and lack of spawn points/many spawnpoints at each base.

Support and medic classes only ones worth using/other classes are viable as well as those two

Full of pointwhores who care only about knife badges and getting their rank up/much more teamwork orientated

Very linear map/360 degree apporachable map



-------------

Anyway, add any comparisons in favour of Kark or Mash that you like.
notice how on mastaur city the red area outlined(the area the map in game can show) is no where near the size of the entire map
why?
because the map was supposed to have planes attack choppers un cappable bases more armor viechals and more bases
i think u would see alot more of mastauur 24\7 servers if they had this map because it would be a great combination of city and open area conflic
kinda like the city on gulf of oman times 10
i realy wish u could play the map but its not in
my guess is it is somewhere in the game files and u might be able to pull it out of EA didnt give DICE enough time to incorperate the map along with other things
aka SIMRAD( ever wonder why the sniper class is underpowered, thats cause it is missing the SIMRAD), AH60 Warhawk, THE AH64D Apcache(look on the box cover, u can see them), another map called Hingan Hills which u can find in the game files someone said, the M82A1, Mi24 (also many of the things in SF were things that were supposed to be in BF2 but where not put in because EA rushed the release date,
2006-04-21 16:16:42
Capt. Foley
Member
+155|6799|Allentown, PA, USA

Seal 3 wrote:

Mashtuur!!!

I think its prob my best win/lose ratio as far as maps go.

No uncaps for any side=balanced. Equal armour i tank per side which you could steal/take away from other team

A highly superior design compared to Karkand. Mashtuur it's not linear like Karkand. More of a 360 degree approachable map the transport choppers rock... Kinda hard when your Spec ops seeing as how the enemy assets are spread over two flags for each side.

No one class is dominate, it all around flat out infantry battle, not a battle of the fucking "Hotel" cluster fuck like so many of Karkand's opening moments on every one i play.

It brings a smile when i see Mashtuur come up on the rotation it really is a beautiful map I think my fav is the street sign near the large bridge in the middle that says "Karkand->" kinda gives you a sense that all the maps are connected. I just like the sign, not the map Karkand, that map gives me a rash..

And before the patch/BH heli nerf a few ago that gawdamn Blackhawk was the undisputed Whore mobile!!!
on shoungu stalemate there is also a sigh by the Fish Factory that says Dragon Valley >
also on Daquing Oilfields there is 1 by the china main but i cant remeber what it says

this could of been a realy great game if EA and the consumers had given DICE another month or 2 to put out the game


(I must admit i was Engi wrenching like a mo-Fo pre BH-nerf patch laughing as we were not shot down at worst maybe once in a game)

And at that some serious shit had to hit the BH for it to go down. Like if all engis got shot out the doors and two AA missiles hit 3 AT rockets at the same time then your in trouble...now if you had 2 engi's a support a medic and a spec ops that was some Grade A whore time!!

I just wish they hadn't replaced the BH mini-guns with airsoft bullets. Can't kill shit with those things now as long as the enemy below has goggles on they wont get there eyes shot out and will be able to go about their infantry business unmolested seeing as how the Airsoft plastic bullets wont kill you..   

And to sum up, Mashtuur a highly superior design compared to Karkand!!

(Did I mention Karkand gived me a rash??) 
Also on Shongu Stalemate by the Fish Factory there is a sigh that says Dragon Valley>
i have seen them on many more maps as well
somewhere on Sharqi Pennisula there is a sign pointing to Zatar Wetlands

Last edited by Capt. Foley (2006-04-21 16:18:38)

2006-04-21 16:30:28
thefousteph
Member
+8|6943
I would say Mashtur is better....but less played!

One reason i think, is the hability on mash to take all the post witch provoke the round to end prematurely.
Most often i saw unbalanced teams on this map ( on karks too, but the gameplay is less affected)

Overall, when the team and member are cool, i've spend a hell of a time on mash!
2006-04-21 17:40:18
a fly
Member
+105|6856|The netherlands
Great mastuur server (im always at it, kill me )

24/7 mastuur       (its from insomnia)
2006-04-22 01:30:50
CoconutBlitz
I've had the diarrheas since Easters
+145|6801|California U.S.A

Talon wrote:

Woohoo! 20 Karma.

More of a 360 degree approachable map
Added to the list. Every base has loads of approaches (think of the garage, where the US tank spawns, or the mosque). Plus, you can capture them in any order. Good point. Plus 1 karma to you.
Neat I've been quoted and karma'd thx
2006-04-22 01:36:22
ReDmAn_ThE_uNiQuE
oh hai :D
+156|6863|The Netherlands
I own in karkand being a sniper so it is not true what you said about support/medic classes. But the only thing about mashtuur that isnt good: the Blackhawk. everyone wanna hop in to the choppa. and if your not on the usmc team you will lose.

 

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