BF2S Forums Bash Islam all you want, DST allows you

Yes that's very different from a publically-recognised academic that posts regularly in academic journals .

Teachers in schools can get away with it and give away their opinions because, as you said, most people simply don't care to listen anyway.

A professor preaching his political ideology in an English lecture would be grossly different. Besides it just doesn't happen in Universities - not in my experiences anyway - there's too much professionalism and too little time to cover such irrelevant topics.

m3thod wrote:

sergeriver wrote:

m3thod wrote:

For fucks sake walk away.  You dont HAVE to post.

Both of you.

I can't post in my own thread?

Grow up serge.

Where's method?  Release him now.

damn muslims

Lotta_Drool wrote:

Braddock wrote:

Lotta_Drool wrote:

article:

After the British terrorist attacks on 7/7 the Telegraph did a poll on British Muslims and this is what they found:

"Six percent of those surveyed said they considered the terrorist attacks on London justified.  An additional 24 percent admitted to sympathizing with the terrorists' motives and feelings; 56 percent said that they could understand why someone might commit such acts; 26 percent rejected Tony Blair's description of the terrorists' ideas as "perverted and poisonous"; 18 percent said they felt little or no loyalty to Britain; 32 percent agreed that Western society is decadent and immoral and that Muslims should seek to bring it to an end.  73 percent said they would inform the police if they knew of plans for a terrorist attack; only 47 percent said they would report an imam preaching anti-Western hatred."

In the most "successful" European nations for Muslim immigration 27 percent of Muslims would not inform police if they knew of any terrorist attacks.  For me if you know of a mass murder on innocent people and did not report it that makes you a radical.  I have often wondered why Muslims are very energetic in protesting the Bush Administration, thousands have marched in attacking the U.S. President and his "imperalistic" agenda.  Yet immediately after Van Gogh's brutal murder or the mass violence caused by Muslims in Sweden there were no Muslims out in the streets protesting such acts.  It seems many Muslims are often silent on the issues that involve violent Muslims because they are in fact indifferent to it.

Now many people would claim that the previous paragraph shows a ethnocentric viewpoint.  Yet why is it wrong to simply restate or mirror what has already been said by the "persecuted" group themselves? 

To restate this is in Britian, the only nation in Europe that seems to have the least culture class between natives and immigratns. Can you imagine what the statistics would be in France, Belgium, or Sweden?



http://weblog.xanga.com/Fletch_F_Fletch … graph.html

Absolutely laughable Lotta_Drool, even by your standards. Not only is your link some sort of fucking blog site, the actual source within it is for an article by the Guardian - a paper that is unbelievably Islamophobic and has recently had its already shitty name dirtied even further by a Channel 4 documentary uncovering blatant lies in the media. The Telegraph was found to be publishing completely unfounded scaremongering stories about Muslims working in hospitals not following hygiene procedures, when they were caught out on this they ran the 'retraction' as a story implying the hospitals were backtracking instead of a straightforward retraction.

And regardless of all that your precious statistics don't even back up your argument. I asked how many Muslims were both extremist and militant (in other words terrorists), you said 27%... the statistics here don't back up your claim. Here are the important statistics from your questionable source...

6% of those surveyed said they considered the terrorist attacks on London justified (an infinitesimal minority)
18% said they felt little or no loyalty to Britain (a distinct minority)
73% said they would inform the police if they knew of plans for a terrorist attack (a strong majority)

27% said they wouldn't go to authorities with information about Islamic terrorists.

Well that might mean they're somewhat extremist bit it doesn't make them actively militant. Also, this figure comes from a survey carried out by a paper known for publishing biased, Islamophobic stories (sometimes without any grounds whatsoever)... I'd be curious to see where this survey was conducted and what the actual questioning process entailed. It certainly doesn't represent 27% of the Muslim population of Britain, just 27% or the people they surveyed.

My last comment was a joke, I meant it sarcastically. Why would I as a British person deride and ridicule the power and influence of my nation in such a way? I'm hardly a nationalist but come on- humour .

I think you make a good point that yes Universities are more liberal than the general populace; that is very hard to disagree with and in fact needs little references or statistics to back-up. However you're sort of missing the bigger point that I was getting at: liberalism is not anti-America. It's all very much within the same narrowly-defined political spectrum, a spectrum that is very conventional and similar in many ways. It's not like extreme-right fascism versus laissez-faire anarchism. Liberalism in Universities provides a student-body that are on the whole different in opinion to the American public- but they're not radicals. Generally on the vast majority of topics the different doctrines coincide and agree. My example of M.I.T. during the Vietnam conflict very much emphasized my point as that of an open sign of dissidence and rebellion against the ruling political system. I don't think some liberal pot-smoking hippy students in the Universities nowadays quite represent the same desire for a shift in power and change. But again I do repeat that the jist of your point is very much true.

Of course there are no political litmus tests for government funding. But it's just a logical deducation that you can make about a faculty staff member: if they're there and they've been educated by the institution for so many years of their life, it makes sense that they're hardly free-radicals that disagree with the entire system and want it all brought down and changed. I think you misinterpreted (or perhaps what would be a better term is underestimated) the extent of dissidence and political variety I was alluding to. There's a big difference between having a right-leaning conservative Professor teaching an English class and having a hardcore Nazi-supporter spouting out fascist propaganda in a lecture. The crux of my point is that there is a 'spectrum' in each countries' establishments, but they are only representative of the narrow-scope of 'popular politics' that a country already endorses and practises. It is quite rare to find a Marxist or a fascist follower in a position of authority or tenancy unless they are teachers in the field (e.g. philosophy, politics, economics etc). And furthermore it is even rarer to find such an individual trying to preach to their students about their own personal beliefs when they are contractually obliged to teach an altogether unrelated subject.

I guess that was the point I was trying to make to Marine; he made out that a lot of my disagreement against US foreign policy is somehow as a result of the influence of a (presumably) politically active professor. That's simply not the case. I can bet that most Professors in the British Universities are fairly middle-brow in their political affiliation.

Last edited by Uzique (2008-09-02 17:33:13)

FEOS wrote:

What I believe Marine was getting at was that, in the US, most professors are hardly "fairly middle-brow" in their politics. Perhaps that is a difference between the US and the UK...as I alluded to earlier.

aint that the fucking truth.


I had a professor actually tell me I was right but I was wrong in a bit of information about Iraq that I shared with the class.  The dude is one of those "Castro is a hero" fags.  He had the nerve to actually give me a D in his class.  A history class.  A D.  Me.



the problem with what I said wasnt that I was mistaken, it was that I shared a bit of info about contemporary Iraq that actually got the point across to what the lecture was about, it just didnt have his "USA is evil" angle on it.

Last edited by God Save the Queen (2008-09-02 17:40:58)

FEOS wrote:

What I believe Marine was getting at was that, in the US, most professors are hardly "fairly middle-brow" in their politics. Perhaps that is a difference between the US and the UK...as I alluded to earlier.

I think that is where our differences in opinion and experience arises. I can't think of an example over the last year where any one of my professors made an explicitly political statement or expressed a sentiment of such thing. I guess our faculty staff are more 'to the point' and more focussed on delivering the educational part rather than imparting the personal-opinion part .

Of course it depends on the course but Marine is well aware that I'm an English undergraduate student, where the realistic chances of my English professors indoctrinating me with anti-American rhetoric and babble is zero-to-none. I'm not to say that these people aren't political activists or representatives of a particular cause or party... I'm just saying it doesn't happen in the formal and professional environment.

And yes, in an extra-curricular sense the political talks and societies do gather. But to me I just see that an intrinsic part of the University lifestyle and experience; people gathering together from a wide-variety of backgrounds and spectrums with other intellectual and scholarly people to discuss a whole range of interesting topics. I don't really see it as breeding ground of radicalism or political dissent... and in my opinion it does imply a certain degree of the latter for a Professor to be lecturing me on massively anti-American topics.

Last edited by Uzique (2008-09-02 17:57:07)

What do you think they teach about Israel over here?

Flaming_Maniac wrote:

What do you think they teach about Israel over here?

If I knew I wouldnt have asked.


I saw a "T" there.


In the JC that I goto its all "Israel is evil"

Last edited by God Save the Queen (2008-09-02 18:02:35)

Flaming_Maniac wrote:

God Save the Queen wrote:

Flaming_Maniac wrote:

What do you think they teach about Israel over here?

If I knew I wouldnt have asked.

Is it the school material or the professors?

I could honestly say all the history profs tried their hardest to sway the class into thinking a specific way about whatever issue, the left way.


I think I told you about that cuba castro lover history professor that gave me a D

Uzique wrote:

God Save the Queen wrote:

Uzique wrote:

I think that is where our differences in opinion and experience arises. I can't think of an example over the last year where any one of my professors made an explicitly political statement or expressed a sentiment of such thing. I guess our faculty staff are more 'to the point' and more focussed on delivering the educational part rather than imparting the personal-opinion part .

Of course it depends on the course but Marine is well aware that I'm an English undergraduate student, where the realistic chances of my English professors indoctrinating me with anti-American rhetoric and babble is zero-to-none. I'm not to say that these people aren't political activists or representatives or a particular cause or party... I'm just saying it doesn't happen in the formal and professional environment.

And yes, in an extra-curricular sense the political talks and societies do gather. But to me I just see that an intrinsic part of the University lifestyle and experience; people gathering together from a wide-variety of backgrounds and spectrums with other intellectual and scholarly people to discuss a whole range of interesting topics. I don't really see it as breeding ground of radicalism or political dissent... and in my opinion it does imply a certain degree of the latter for a Professor to be lecturing me on massively anti-American topics.

Im interested to know what they teach about israel over there.

We essentially don't talk about Israel over here. More regularly there are news bulletins and reports of Palestinian 'terrorist' activities, which I guess answers your question in an indirect manner .

Israel is a client-state of the USA; Britain is the snivelling cousin of the USA; it makes logical sense that our mainstream media doesn't really demonise the Israeli's too much. Every now and then something will siphon through about Israel's part in the conflict but really the vast majority just isn't covered.

Of course I can't give a definitive answer to you. Braddock and other such people will probably give a different response.

Despite strong ideological ties between the Republican movement here and the cause of the Palestinians the Irish media doesn't display any great degree of bias either way on the subject of Israel and Palestine. I didn't develop a healthy dislike of Israel until I 'got political' at the age of about 19 or 20 and many people in general are horribly ill-informed on the subject here... this alone is a strong indication of how no one side in particular in the argument is forced on the public by the major media outlets.

Last edited by Braddock (2008-09-02 18:10:07)

Flaming_Maniac wrote:

God Save the Queen wrote:

Flaming_Maniac wrote:

Is it the school material or the professors?

I could honestly say all the history profs tried their hardest to sway the class into thinking a specific way about whatever issue, the left way.


I think I told you about that cuba castro lover history professor that gave me a D

yeah I think you did

I guess I'm not looking forward to college then. All the spinning might keep me awake though.

Room spinning most likely.

Flaming_Maniac wrote:

not going to be a drinker tbh if that's what you're referring to Mr. Marion.

where's the fun in that!!?

I'd ask cowami how the parties are at Embry-Riddle since I was never much of a party person in HS (I'm still not)...but...it's cowami..