hooahGunSlinger OIF II wrote:
by the way, calling me a typical US grunt is the best compliment you could have given me...thankyou
I'm going to consider a temp ban because he blatantly continued to ruin the thread after I warned him.GunSlinger OIF II wrote:
with one little line of muck, this guy takes away the whole thread
Temped him...
I took only a few minutes to read a little bit if the post (there's quite a lot ). I found it pretty interesting, I might spend some more time reading the entire thing.
The reason that the Brits are better at keeping civilians alive I would say is down to training and experience, and not education. We've been doing this kind of thing for years in N.Ireland, and a large amount of British troops have been stationed out there at some point in time. Because of this experience, the British Army can provide better training for this kind of work, and also the troops are less likely to panic and shoot someone.
Ricardo, it's all very well saying that "americans are stupid etc", but you have to remember that whilst British officers generally are well educated, the average soldier looks something like this:
Ricardo, it's all very well saying that "americans are stupid etc", but you have to remember that whilst British officers generally are well educated, the average soldier looks something like this:
It's a long old haul to get through, i'm only finished now! With the exception of the convoys murdering civilians, pretty much all the other atrocities and murders of civilians and the way the soldiers conduct themselves mirrors the British in Northern Ireland imo. You can read any amount of similar stories about the murder of innocent men, women & children here - http://cain.ulst.ac.uk/othelem/chron.htm So I suggest knocking off the bullshit oh we're better trained than Americans shite that is permeating this thread. Brits wondered why they got spat on and had urine thrown on them as they walked the streets here? Reading this it's easy to understand why such great hatred is being fermented against the US in Iraq..
The link doesn't work but going by the file name i can guess exactly the kind of person it shows and while it is a scary prospect that people like that are allowed weapons I hope their training turns them in to decent human beings.ghettoperson wrote:
The reason that the Brits are better at keeping civilians alive I would say is down to training and experience, and not education. We've been doing this kind of thing for years in N.Ireland, and a large amount of British troops have been stationed out there at some point in time. Because of this experience, the British Army can provide better training for this kind of work, and also the troops are less likely to panic and shoot someone.
Ricardo, it's all very well saying that "americans are stupid etc", but you have to remember that whilst British officers generally are well educated, the average soldier looks something like this:
http://uk.geocities.com/allchavsshoulddie/chav.jpg
I think, that killing innocent civilians will only piss of the general public, leading to more deaths of soldiers. So they're essentially traitors.
But i ain't been to Iraq so I don't know. That's my opinion and i'm sticking to it.
But i ain't been to Iraq so I don't know. That's my opinion and i'm sticking to it.
Last edited by Mekstizzle (2007-07-14 05:42:10)
Back on topic...
It was a very interesting read. Some of those stories are terrible, some are blatant crimes. However, I also noticed that in the "Raids" section, most of those tactics are designed to scare and keep US soldiers alive. I would definitely want to scare the living shit out of anyone in a house I was clearing. It would at least give our troops a better chance of survival. Speed and Aggressiveness are pretty much mandatory in room clearing.
I hate to sound uncaring, but a lot (definitely not all) of those stories reflect a basic rational, better them than us! As a soldier, loyalty goes to those around you more than a random passerby.
**Just my opinion as someone who has recieved minimal MOUT training and has not been to the AOR.
It was a very interesting read. Some of those stories are terrible, some are blatant crimes. However, I also noticed that in the "Raids" section, most of those tactics are designed to scare and keep US soldiers alive. I would definitely want to scare the living shit out of anyone in a house I was clearing. It would at least give our troops a better chance of survival. Speed and Aggressiveness are pretty much mandatory in room clearing.
I hate to sound uncaring, but a lot (definitely not all) of those stories reflect a basic rational, better them than us! As a soldier, loyalty goes to those around you more than a random passerby.
**Just my opinion as someone who has recieved minimal MOUT training and has not been to the AOR.
Last edited by RAIMIUS (2007-07-14 18:55:59)
yeah, a real shame I tell ya. Too bad we arent the only nation that has to deal with sexism in the military.
Double hmmm...GunSlinger OIF II wrote:
yeah, a real shame I tell ya. Too bad we arent the only nation that has to deal with sexism in the military.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13459928/
Murder, kidnap and false statements all in one.
Im sure there are other threads you could contribute thatspecifically involve that topic.JohnnyBlanco wrote:
Double hmmm...GunSlinger OIF II wrote:
yeah, a real shame I tell ya. Too bad we arent the only nation that has to deal with sexism in the military.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13459928/
Murder, kidnap and false statements all in one.
I like the way you tried to paint the military as raping iraqis and afghanis with your first link, when you obviously didnt read the content. Now you are bringing up another one that specifically implicates US troops in crimes against civilians. Indeed a crime, good thing its isolated and represents the "1 in a million" scenario of modern war. It happens, not as often as you would like Im afraid. Too bad they are getting prosecuted. kinda poops on your point.
Dude, start another thread. Your tactics are obvious.
Last edited by GunSlinger OIF II (2007-07-14 19:55:38)
Triple hmmm...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/ar … 4Dec7.html
So, murder, rape, killing kids/women/unarmed civilians. You still call your mates professional and well trained? Seriously? How many stories do you have to hear before you don't class these as 'one in a million'?
The thread was about your boys coming home with mental issues, i can see why. Maybe if they had better training they wouldn't commit such acts and at the very least a certain degree of intelligence would stop them. Start killing the real enemy and you'll win the war.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/ar … 4Dec7.html
So, murder, rape, killing kids/women/unarmed civilians. You still call your mates professional and well trained? Seriously? How many stories do you have to hear before you don't class these as 'one in a million'?
The thread was about your boys coming home with mental issues, i can see why. Maybe if they had better training they wouldn't commit such acts and at the very least a certain degree of intelligence would stop them. Start killing the real enemy and you'll win the war.
Johnny, are you RicardoBlanco's brother or something?
Whatever... I banned him for taking a similar line to yours. Just drop this crap, or I'll ban you too.
Whatever... I banned him for taking a similar line to yours. Just drop this crap, or I'll ban you too.
This has got to be one of the dumbest posts I've ever seen, so according to you all average US soldiers and Marines are dumb rednecks? Well I could say that the average British soldier/marine were all dumb chavs seeing as that's where a large majority end up doing as a job, they're not that civilized are they? Show some goodamn respect for people and stop assuming you're the best of the crop of humanity.RicardoBlanco wrote:
The problem with the average US soldier is they aren't particularly bright, hence ending up in the army in the first place. If you stick them in a situation where they are going to get shot and you also give them weapons, you can't expect anything else. The British ones are far more intelligent and, dare I say, civilised, which is why you don't hear any where near as many stories of civilian rape/murder/abuse from our boys. Simple really.
P.S I realize that the British Army is not entirely made up of chavs for those of you serving in it and not all of them are dumb.
Back on topic though, I haven't read the whole thing but I will take the time to look at it.
Last edited by M.O.A.B (2007-07-14 20:27:45)
Just the same as you other account, you failed to address my post pointing out UK troops and PTSD.JohnnyBlanco wrote:
Triple hmmm...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/ar … 4Dec7.html
So, murder, rape, killing kids/women/unarmed civilians. You still call your mates professional and well trained? Seriously? How many stories do you have to hear before you don't class these as 'one in a million'?
The thread was about your boys coming home with mental issues, i can see why. Maybe if they had better training they wouldn't commit such acts and at the very least a certain degree of intelligence would stop them. Start killing the real enemy and you'll win the war.
By all means Rich, please continue.
how gay and uninteresting...
why the heck are national guards in Iraq ... weekend warriors who think they are Rambo ... they should "Guard there country not operate in war thorn countries like Iraq ...IMO
gonna read it l8
Truly effed up read. To gunslinger & marine, how old are u guys. Do you think an experience gap is the reason for the increased PTSD claims or that its just BS?
That was the nice part about my job. I never had to nuke anyone.
That was the nice part about my job. I never had to nuke anyone.
Did you think insugents worried that their efforts made a safe place for animals and children ? Imagine how much worse it would be if any other country was running the Show.
" Poe is like a goat. You can coddle him, but eventually he rams you in the hind."
Fourtunatly he is one of the few non-friends I could turn my back on with NO FEAR AT ALL.
" Poe is like a goat. You can coddle him, but eventually he rams you in the hind."
Fourtunatly he is one of the few non-friends I could turn my back on with NO FEAR AT ALL.
Last edited by Hunter/Jumper (2007-07-16 11:30:05)
Marine is 29 and Gunslinger 24 or 25.golgoj4 wrote:
Truly effed up read. To gunslinger & marine, how old are u guys. Do you think an experience gap is the reason for the increased PTSD claims or that its just BS?
That was the nice part about my job. I never had to nuke anyone.
GS > USM05 (thought i'd just slip that in there for no reason)
Blackbelts are just whitebelts who have never quit.
Trying to create an internal rift eh? You're evil, pure evil!m3thod wrote:
Marine is 29 and Gunslinger 24 or 25.golgoj4 wrote:
Truly effed up read. To gunslinger & marine, how old are u guys. Do you think an experience gap is the reason for the increased PTSD claims or that its just BS?
That was the nice part about my job. I never had to nuke anyone.
GS > USM05 (thought i'd just slip that in there for no reason)
You immaturity and elitism is astounding.RicardoBlanco wrote:
God I really am bored now. I went to Oxford university before you question my levels of intelligence. You try and get in. I'm done with this thread and if you still don't believe what I say why not ask the rest of the world who have reached the same conclusion. I'm sure the war in Iraq will all end swimmingly and all your troops will come home mentally fit with glowing references from the Iraqi population!
Lol, debate and serious talk! Try the Oxford Union for some proper debate.
Education does not equate to intelligence, although it helps (at least most people). Based on your comments in this thread and others, character flaws are preventing you from reaching your potential. I hope for your sake that your position is for building the size of your e-penis and you don't actually act like this in real life.
Anyhow, to the OP - I think the article is pretty good commentary on how confusing the entire war is from many points of view. I've read stuff like this from WWII, Vietnam, Bosnia, etc. Interesting and similar.
Their stories, recorded and typed into thousands of pages of transcripts, reveal disturbing patterns of behavior by American troops in Iraq. Dozens of those interviewed witnessed Iraqi civilians, including children, dying from American firepower. Some participated in such killings; others treated or investigated civilian casualties after the fact. Many also heard such stories, in detail, from members of their unit. The soldiers, sailors and marines emphasized that not all troops took part in indiscriminate killings. Many said that these acts were perpetrated by a minority. But they nevertheless described such acts as common and said they often go unreported--and almost always go unpunished.
Ahh...the old Vietnam war left wing propaganda of American troops as "Baby Killers" lives on...
Ahh...the old Vietnam war left wing propaganda of American troops as "Baby Killers" lives on...
Last edited by Comrade Ogilvy (2007-07-16 17:33:54)
Wrong.m3thod wrote:
Marine is 29 and Gunslinger 24 or 25.golgoj4 wrote:
Truly effed up read. To gunslinger & marine, how old are u guys. Do you think an experience gap is the reason for the increased PTSD claims or that its just BS?
That was the nice part about my job. I never had to nuke anyone.
GS > USM05 (thought i'd just slip that in there for no reason)
Correct.