That and Botrytis cinerea, in the instances of dessert wine.globefish23 wrote:
Wine making is craftsmanship.
The real artist is the Vitis species that grew the berries.
Humans just harvest and mush them, leave it for fermentation by Saccharomyces (other artists), as well as bottle and cork it.
I'm definitely not a wine aficionado, but after only 3 years of moderate/heavy consumption, I can tell you with 100% certainty that your taste buds will change and detect subtleties that you would have called bullshit on 3 years earlier. I don't pretend to understand it, but it's a real phenomenon.Uzique The Lesser wrote:
never said wine making wasn't a craft. i said it's bullshit that someone's taste will 'develop' in 20 years so they can 'appreciate' a drink more. a) it's subjective, b) your taste isn't a faculty that improves progressively, like some sort of knowledge or memory.
Last edited by iNeedUrFace4Soup (2013-06-25 00:58:54)
if you open your mind too much your brain will fall out.
I've found this after a few months, as have everyone I worked with. Wine also develops secondary characteristics with age and most fine wines drink optimally with 10 years minimum cellaring. The more advanced wine courses involve blind tastings as a requirement to pass as to remove any bias.iNeedUrFace4Soup wrote:
I'm definitely not a wine aficionado, but after only 3 years of moderate/heavy consumption, I can tell you with 100% certainty that your taste buds will change and detect subtleties that you would have called bullshit on 3 years earlier. I don't pretend to understand it, but it's a real phenomenon.Uzique The Lesser wrote:
never said wine making wasn't a craft. i said it's bullshit that someone's taste will 'develop' in 20 years so they can 'appreciate' a drink more. a) it's subjective, b) your taste isn't a faculty that improves progressively, like some sort of knowledge or memory.
this^ reminds me of a colleague who bought himself a "5.1 headset" from "respectable manufacturer" (i don't remember which). that thing was supposed to allow him to tell not just left-right as normal stereo-phones would, but also front-rear - and he claimed he could actually tell. i called bullshit on that and asked if he would put money where his mouth was - won a hundred bucks from that dude when he brought that thing along with a game he claimed it worked well with and... couldn't tell shit when we turned his monitor off and asked him where the sources of different sounds in the game were.
if you open your mind too much your brain will fall out.
Win a bottle of Grange and people get mad, lel
i dunno what you are talking about - i don't drink alcohol - but i had another bet with one of my friends who claimed he'd be able to tell sorts of beer just by taste. i'm pretty sure i've got another hundred bucks coming my way.
Last edited by Shahter (2013-06-25 04:40:08)
if you open your mind too much your brain will fall out.
Basically yesterday I posted that a good thing that happened to me recently was winning a bottle of Australia's most iconic wine, Penfold's Grange. Retails at $550+ a bottle. Clearly the price is inflated due to reputation and market value to collectors. Nonetheless it is certainly something cool to win because at the very least it could quite easily be sold off at $400+, as the 2007 vintage isn't nearly as in demand when compared to the 2008. I then stated what I intended to do with the bottle to the derision of the peanut gallery, a very predictable pattern of behaviour. Taste being subjective and all I have found my perception to have increased, hence my earlier comment before yours.
"iconic wine for $550+"... my point is you most probably wouldn't be able to tell it from similar "non-iconic" one which costs $10. it's all bullshit to make pretentious bastards pay for dubious shit that has no real value.
but, whatever floats your boat.
but, whatever floats your boat.
if you open your mind too much your brain will fall out.
I'm happy to have won it. Other people clearly feel the need to comment, which is fascinating.
i didn't read that much back, so i didn't know.
congratulations on the good thing that happened in your life lately. you are now a proud owner of overpriced wine... i guess.
congratulations on the good thing that happened in your life lately. you are now a proud owner of overpriced wine... i guess.
Last edited by Shahter (2013-06-25 05:16:33)
if you open your mind too much your brain will fall out.
I just commented on the fact you sound like a commercial now and presenting yourself as a characature of everything that sucks about the faux elitist wine industry. It's grape juice that spoiled.
Yes I drink wine on occasion, yes I can tell the difference between varietals, yes I can smell the various notes and feel the tannins. But the faux elitist bullshit surrounding wine is completely offputting.
Yes I drink wine on occasion, yes I can tell the difference between varietals, yes I can smell the various notes and feel the tannins. But the faux elitist bullshit surrounding wine is completely offputting.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
-Frederick Bastiat
It's not about being elitist. That wine has serious market value. What I prefer to drink? Good wine that I et at staff price around $10 a bottle. I've tried a lot of different wines lately and there were a few more expensive ones that turned out average.
i'd love to prove to you that all of that is but wishful thinking, but since you are probably not going to come visit just for that, well, enjoy your wine.Jay wrote:
yes I can tell the difference between varietals, yes I can smell the various notes and feel the tannins.
edit: oh, crap, it's you jay... well, my point still stands.
Last edited by Shahter (2013-06-25 05:33:11)
if you open your mind too much your brain will fall out.
They each have different flavors. I couldn't name the grapes they're grown with, except acertico thanks to my honeymoon, but at least with white wines its easy for me to tell a chardonay from a pinot grigio or a sauvignon blanc etc.Shahter wrote:
i'd love to prove to you that all of that is but wishful thinking, but since you are probably not going to come visit just for that, well, enjoy your wine.Jay wrote:
yes I can tell the difference between varietals, yes I can smell the various notes and feel the tannins.
edit: oh, crap, it's you jay... well, my point still stands.
Red wine is usually tougher for me, all I taste is the tannins, which I don't find pleasant. Much the same way I dislike hops-heavy beers.
Last edited by Jay (2013-06-25 05:42:52)
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
-Frederick Bastiat
come visit and we'll have a bet.Jay wrote:
They each have different flavors. I couldn't name the grapes they're grown with, except acertico thanks to my honeymoon, but at least with white wines its easy for me to tell a chardonay from a pinot grigio or a sauvignon blanc etc.Shahter wrote:
i'd love to prove to you that all of that is but wishful thinking, but since you are probably not going to come visit just for that, well, enjoy your wine.Jay wrote:
yes I can tell the difference between varietals, yes I can smell the various notes and feel the tannins.
edit: oh, crap, it's you jay... well, my point still stands.
if you open your mind too much your brain will fall out.
So wine appreciation is subjective but appreciation of novels is a hard science.Uzique The Lesser wrote:
never said wine making wasn't a craft. i said it's bullshit that someone's taste will 'develop' in 20 years so they can 'appreciate' a drink more. a) it's subjective, b) your taste isn't a faculty that improves progressively, like some sort of knowledge or memory.
Keep digging, this stuff is gold.
Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!
idiot. no. I said you can learn enough knowledge wise to concretely 'appreciate more'. there is nothing you can learn from tasting wine. whether you like or dislike a novel is, to a certain degree, subjective. however a novel involves concrete knowledge. wine tasting is complete bullsjit. if you can't tell the difference... zzz, twat.Dilbert_X wrote:
So wine appreciation is subjective but appreciation of novels is a hard science.Uzique The Lesser wrote:
never said wine making wasn't a craft. i said it's bullshit that someone's taste will 'develop' in 20 years so they can 'appreciate' a drink more. a) it's subjective, b) your taste isn't a faculty that improves progressively, like some sort of knowledge or memory.
Keep digging, this stuff is gold.
also your sense of taste doesn't 'develop' like your sense of novels does. sorry. taste buds decay. your sense of taste cognitively degrades - like sight, like hearing. your ability to CONTEMPLATE something, however, like a novel or painting, will increase as your memory and knowledge INCREMENTALLY increases. your taste doesn't have a memory. read enough novels about Paris from the 1880's impressionists, however, and you'll gain a 'sense' of style. it's really senses vs. intelligence on this one. what a mong.
total. bullshit. THE TOP WINE TASTERS IN THE WORLD cannot reliably and consistently detect 'quality', in a graded and qualificatory sense. I'm sure you 'get a sense' of tastes. but as for 'appreciating' a finer taste? LOL. total pseudo-science (in fact science calls it bs).Jaekus wrote:
I've found this after a few months, as have everyone I worked with. Wine also develops secondary characteristics with age and most fine wines drink optimally with 10 years minimum cellaring. The more advanced wine courses involve blind tastings as a requirement to pass as to remove any bias.iNeedUrFace4Soup wrote:
I'm definitely not a wine aficionado, but after only 3 years of moderate/heavy consumption, I can tell you with 100% certainty that your taste buds will change and detect subtleties that you would have called bullshit on 3 years earlier. I don't pretend to understand it, but it's a real phenomenon.Uzique The Lesser wrote:
never said wine making wasn't a craft. i said it's bullshit that someone's taste will 'develop' in 20 years so they can 'appreciate' a drink more. a) it's subjective, b) your taste isn't a faculty that improves progressively, like some sort of knowledge or memory.
I drink a lot of wine. I enjoy it. hpwbever I won't be pretentious about it's taste. then again my paltry livelihood doesn't depend on this wine industry schlock.
hey uzique i got something you can taste
Your friend got surround headphones that dont work? My logi ones are amazing. I can sit in a bush playing arma and hear a helicopter doing loops around me. Or tell the direction of a vehicle without looking at it.Shahter wrote:
this^ reminds me of a colleague who bought himself a "5.1 headset" from "respectable manufacturer" (i don't remember which). that thing was supposed to allow him to tell not just left-right as normal stereo-phones would, but also front-rear - and he claimed he could actually tell. i called bullshit on that and asked if he would put money where his mouth was - won a hundred bucks from that dude when he brought that thing along with a game he claimed it worked well with and... couldn't tell shit when we turned his monitor off and asked him where the sources of different sounds in the game were.
also jake how do I order this case of wine
no you can't.Adams_BJ wrote:
I can sit in a bush playing arma and hear a helicopter doing loops around me. Or tell the direction of a vehicle without looking at it.
if you open your mind too much your brain will fall out.
Well I have. On many occasions. So ner.Shahter wrote:
no you can't.Adams_BJ wrote:
I can sit in a bush playing arma and hear a helicopter doing loops around me. Or tell the direction of a vehicle without looking at it.
i can tell which direction vehicles are coming from when i have 2 speakers.
it's called having decent speakers with a proper sound set-up. 2 monitor speakers with the correct distance apart/angle creates a 'field' of sound where you can specifically hear elements. for e.g. cymbals and hi-hats normally always 'come' from 2 different distinct locations when i am listening to music (normally because most mixes/masters always 'place' them there, typically). sounds can phase from left/right and be detected really easy. no need to gimp yourself with terribly sound quality 'omfg imax 5.1' shit, either.
it's called having decent speakers with a proper sound set-up. 2 monitor speakers with the correct distance apart/angle creates a 'field' of sound where you can specifically hear elements. for e.g. cymbals and hi-hats normally always 'come' from 2 different distinct locations when i am listening to music (normally because most mixes/masters always 'place' them there, typically). sounds can phase from left/right and be detected really easy. no need to gimp yourself with terribly sound quality 'omfg imax 5.1' shit, either.
Last edited by Uzique The Lesser (2013-06-26 02:16:12)