BF2S Forums Firefighters watch man drown himself in San Francisco Bay

jord wrote:

Taking pills isn't really an option when you're considering suicide and have researched it. They can really fuck up your internal organs and leave you alive, and in pain.

That's all I'm chiming in with anyway, avoiding the main argument.

This is true. It does not work very often these days.
Most common method of suicide for both genders is hanging.

Last edited by Jaekus (2011-06-03 10:27:31)

Yes, and painkillers are even worse.

jord wrote:

lowing wrote:

jord wrote:

Taking pills isn't really an option when you're considering suicide and have researched it. They can really fuck up your internal organs and leave you alive, and in pain.

That's all I'm chiming in with anyway, avoiding the main argument.

seriously? It is really uncommon to die from sleeping pill OD?

Sleeping pills are the better option than painkillers but still a bad choice. People assume you just go to sleep peacefully, the reality is you can convulse and vomit for half an hour in agony, put yourself into a coma and wake up with liver and kidney damage.

and left wishing they were dead? Wow didn't know that.

4 pages and not a single post that was worth the bandwidth. It's my fault though, I should have made a better OP.

Rather than debate whether public suicide is selfish or not I was hoping there would be a discussion regarding spending priorities or what would you had done if you were a firefighter on the shore.

Of all the places in the world to not have water rescue training available, San Fransisco is not one of them. I would love to see what the city decided to keep in exchange for their water training. Whoever signed off on that should lose their job. Not because of this one asshole but because of the pure stupidity of removing water training on a place that is surrounded on three sides by water. (it's called a peninsula. )

I also think the firefighters should be ashamed of themselves. As much as they bitch and complain about how they save lives and are in danger all the time whenever a budget debate comes up it's a pretty despicable thing to just sit there and watch the guy drown. FFS a woman dragged his corpse to shore, you can't tell me a bunch of burly firefighters couldn't help pull the man to shore. What a bunch of pieces of shit. Worthless fucking assholes to be honest.

So yeah, I eagerly await the one reply this will get and the eventual continuation of lowing vs the world

lowing wrote:

Cybargs wrote:

13/f/taiwan wrote:

why do people think that mentally sane people voluntarily commit suicide? just wait until it happens to someone you love and i can guarantee you will be singing a different tune.

i can see it from the perspective of the firefighter with two kids, a wife, car/mortgage payments who lives paycheck to paycheck but i don't know if you could live with yourself knowing you let someone die right in front of you.

one of my closest friends cousin jumped off a building... yeah people need to stfu about talking shit to suicidal people. everyones got their reasons and its usually the ones that seem the happiest.

Hey the big thing in Atlanta is to climb on an over pass and jump. These assholes will tie up city traffic for hours and waste everyone's time while they try and talk them down. If you wanna kill yourself go into the woods and do it, if you want attention and are willing to snarl traffic up for hours to get it, you should be pushed off the fuckin' bridge.

I have had friends commit suicide and Ive watched people with depressions spiral in and out of it. Even after that I have to side with lowing (to a point)

You need some attention, see someone trained to do it, there a countless hotlines and facilities available to you designed to give you a brighter perspective on life and just try to get you through a new day.

If you do decide its all too much and you want to end your life do it, but don't cause a scene. There's suicide from depression and then there's attention seeking. Figure out witch one you want.

I knew a guy who got dumped by his girlfriend and decided he'd make her feel bad buy cutting his wrists. They were pathetic and shallow but he was seeking attention and thought it would work. She told him its pathetic that he was seeking attention like that and if he really wanted to kill himself he would have. He never did. Point is if you wanna kill yourself just do it. Its not that hard (from a purely non emotional standpoint). If you just want some attention, its not hard to find.

Depression is a hard thing to understand and its a sensitive issue to debate about, so please don't take this in an ignorant shallow way, its just my opinion. Like Ive said I've had friends end their lives and family members go through depression and mental illness.

lowing wrote:

Adams_BJ wrote:

I have had friends commit suicide and Ive watched people with depressions spiral in and out of it. Even after that I have to side with lowing (to a point)

You need some attention, see someone trained to do it, there a countless hotlines and facilities available to you designed to give you a brighter perspective on life and just try to get you through a new day.

If you do decide its all too much and you want to end your life do it, but don't cause a scene. There's suicide from depression and then there's attention seeking. Figure out witch one you want.

I knew a guy who got dumped by his girlfriend and decided he'd make her feel bad buy cutting his wrists. They were pathetic and shallow but he was seeking attention and thought it would work. She told him its pathetic that he was seeking attention like that and if he really wanted to kill himself he would have. He never did. Point is if you wanna kill yourself just do it. Its not that hard (from a purely non emotional standpoint). If you just want some attention, its not hard to find.

Depression is a hard thing to understand and its a sensitive issue to debate about, so please don't take this in an ignorant shallow way, its just my opinion. Like Ive said I've had friends end their lives and family members go through depression and mental illness.

to what point do we part company, because it seems we are in 100% agreement. Or is it you are just more eloquent in your wording?

I don't separate myself entirely from the person. I don't feel pity for them for committing suicide. But I do recognise that it is a hard decision to make, and a little time out of my day isn't what they may have gone through. I do think it is wrong to do it so publicly.

Macbeth wrote:

4 pages and not a single post that was worth the bandwidth. It's my fault though, I should have made a better OP.

Rather than debate whether public suicide is selfish or not I was hoping there would be a discussion regarding spending priorities or what would you had done if you were a firefighter on the shore.

Of all the places in the world to not have water rescue training available, San Fransisco is not one of them. I would love to see what the city decided to keep in exchange for their water training. Whoever signed off on that should lose their job. Not because of this one asshole but because of the pure stupidity of removing water training on a place that is surrounded on three sides by water. (it's called a peninsula. )

I also think the firefighters should be ashamed of themselves. As much as they bitch and complain about how they save lives and are in danger all the time whenever a budget debate comes up it's a pretty despicable thing to just sit there and watch the guy drown. FFS a woman dragged his corpse to shore, you can't tell me a bunch of burly firefighters couldn't help pull the man to shore. What a bunch of pieces of shit. Worthless fucking assholes to be honest.

So yeah, I eagerly await the one reply this will get and the eventual continuation of lowing vs the world

I'm quite surprised the fire fighters did nothing.
Are the repercussions really that severe if they did breach policy?

FEOS wrote:

We could certainly speculate what the repercussions would have been, but I can't imagine they would have been so bad that they couldn't have fought them with the simple argument: "I saved this guy's life."

That's what I'm thinking too. It's not like they'd get fined thousands of dollars or get charged with anything, surely.

you don't know that.

Whatever helps him sleep at night I guess.

Jaekus wrote:

Macbeth wrote:

4 pages and not a single post that was worth the bandwidth. It's my fault though, I should have made a better OP.

Rather than debate whether public suicide is selfish or not I was hoping there would be a discussion regarding spending priorities or what would you had done if you were a firefighter on the shore.

Of all the places in the world to not have water rescue training available, San Fransisco is not one of them. I would love to see what the city decided to keep in exchange for their water training. Whoever signed off on that should lose their job. Not because of this one asshole but because of the pure stupidity of removing water training on a place that is surrounded on three sides by water. (it's called a peninsula. )

I also think the firefighters should be ashamed of themselves. As much as they bitch and complain about how they save lives and are in danger all the time whenever a budget debate comes up it's a pretty despicable thing to just sit there and watch the guy drown. FFS a woman dragged his corpse to shore, you can't tell me a bunch of burly firefighters couldn't help pull the man to shore. What a bunch of pieces of shit. Worthless fucking assholes to be honest.

So yeah, I eagerly await the one reply this will get and the eventual continuation of lowing vs the world

I'm quite surprised the fire fighters did nothing.
Are the repercussions really that severe if they did breach policy?

I would just like to point out first that I am a volunteer firefighter undergoing training as of right now. There are several things to consider when attempting a rescue. I am going to assume that your opinion is directed at these firefighters and not all firefighters, even then I am going to have to disagree with your opinion in the first place. They have to do this stuff  every day and it can become difficult emotionally to deal with.

First is that you have to survey the scene. You do not want to become a casualty yourself. If I see an unsafe scene that I am not equipped to handle, then I am going to wait until someone more qualified shows up with the right equipment. In this case I think they didn't have water rescue gear?

Secondly policy and legal; You can lose your job if you have an unsafe attitude and disregard for personal safety. There is also such a thing as refusal of care. The man could refuse care(if he was indeed suicidal) if they swam out there(there may be a different policy for that area). If they had the right equipment and weren't handcuffed by policy, they could in theory have waited until he was unconscious to attempt a rescue assuming implied consent(unless he had 'do not resuscitate' papers).

Personally I think the bystanders  a little too. The scene was relatively safe because it would take longer for hypothermia to set in in that water. Of course they may have been restrained by the officers. Props to the guy who pulled him out.