Pages: 1 2 3 4 … 11

 

2010-04-18 20:38:22
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5648|London, England

Turquoise wrote:

100% agreed, John.

The problem is... if you try explaining this to the average person, you'll get all kinds of bullshit responses back defending the registry.
The average person is a nosy bastard who reads US Weekly in order to spy into the private lives of celebrities. If given the chance, they would keep tabs on their neighbors social lives as well. All a sex offender registry does is feed the peeping toms.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
2010-04-19 00:06:15
ruisleipa
Member
+149|6513|teh FIN-land

JohnG@lt wrote:

This. Is there any wonder there is so much recidivism? People blame the jails for being soft, or blame sentencing for not being harsh enough or blame the fact that people learn how to be better criminals in jail. No, it's the fact that they're now fucked for the rest of their life. They have to put on every single job application, no matter how menial the job, that they are a former criminal. Not only is that embarrassing enough, but the vast majority of HR departments will automatically throw out the application.
well quite.

wonder what lowing has to say about this.
2010-04-19 08:32:14
west-phoenix-az
Guns don't kill people. . . joe bidens advice does
+632|6680
John, Do you think they should also be able to vote and purchase firearms?
https://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p123/west-phoenix-az/BF2S/bf2s_sig_9mmbrass.jpg
2010-04-19 08:46:41
Chou
Member
+737|7081

Hurricane2k9 wrote:

An even more egregious example is one I heard a couple days ago at this discussion about drinking at my college. According to a police officer (and this has actually happened in many places), if you are caught urinating in public you can be charged with a sex crime (indecent exposure) and be registered as a sex offender. That's right; if you're drunk and stupid and take a piss in someone's lawn, you're not just called a dumbass and have to pay the owner of the lawn a small fine. You have to essentially lose what life you had and live in exile.


The law often ignores any excuses made for such behavior because it's a job and serious business, nobody gives a fuck if a life is ruined over some dumb bullshit like this because at the other end of the road there's Parole Office and they also need to make a living.

Hey, life's a cage, enjoy it.
2010-04-19 09:24:57
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5648|London, England

west-phoenix-az wrote:

John, Do you think they should also be able to vote and purchase firearms?
It depends on the crime. Should someone convicted of armed robbery, assault or murder etc be allowed to purchase a firearm? No. But it shouldn't be a life sentence thing. If the guy did time when he was 20 and has been a productive member of society for ten years after getting out of prison, I really don't see why we should treat him any different than a normal citizen. As for voting, I've never understood or agreed with it. Why does a person lose their right to choose who represents them just because they've been convicted of a felony? Universal suffrage is universal suffrage. You can't pick and choose who you don't want to vote or in the end you end up with crap like poll taxes.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
2010-04-19 09:42:12
13rin
Member
+977|6770

Turquoise wrote:

100% agreed, John.

The problem is... if you try explaining this to the average person, you'll get all kinds of bullshit responses back defending the registry.
Sorry man.  I've got a kid and I want to know if a child molestor has moved into the neighborhood.  If that's an average person bullshit response -so be it.  Pretty much once a pedo, always a pedo.

Florida is all ready reworking the law through glitch bills to address the 17-15 consentual sex and the average streaker.
I stood in line for four hours. They better give me a Wal-Mart gift card, or something.  - Rodney Booker, Job Fair attendee.
2010-04-19 10:56:27
Marlo Stanfield
online poker tax cheating
+122|5453
Personally I think rapist and pedos should be executed so I don't feel bad when they end up on sex offender list, but the law should be better defined so a 13 year old sending texts doesn't get dragged into it.
2010-04-19 11:10:23
blademaster
I'm moving to Brazil
+2,075|6936
http://www.familywatchdog.us/
use this link to see if there are any in offenders in ur area...
2010-04-19 12:55:32
13rin
Member
+977|6770

blademaster wrote:

http://www.familywatchdog.us/
use this link to see if there are any in offenders in ur area...
2 pedos living within a mile of my home (I all ready knew this though).
I stood in line for four hours. They better give me a Wal-Mart gift card, or something.  - Rodney Booker, Job Fair attendee.
2010-04-19 13:01:55
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5648|London, England

blademaster wrote:

http://www.familywatchdog.us/
use this link to see if there are any in offenders in ur area...
https://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb139/winterkiss42/offender.jpg

Lit up like a Christmas tree
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
2010-04-19 13:12:04
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6942|USA

DesertFox- wrote:

Even if they are major sex offenders, I still don't like the idea of a registry. It's a continuing punishment for the rest of your life, and these days anyone can find out where you live and what you did. Those who commit other crimes, even violent ones, don't have to go through that process and that just doesn't seem right. Either make everyone register, or no one, but we can't have double standards.
So what? the victim has to live with the crime the rest of their life, why are you so against the criminal having to do the same thing?

I loath your concern for the criminal while not a word uttered about what their actions has done to an innocent person.

Last edited by lowing (2010-04-19 13:19:02)

2010-04-19 13:55:28
DesertFox-
The very model of a modern major general
+796|6975|United States of America
Are they sentenced to a lifetime of punishment? Usually not. As I said, my major issue is that we have arbitrarily singled out sex crimes as being worse than any other type. They serve their time and get released, but the punishment isn't over thanks to this system. If a convicted drug dealer, burglar, or any other sort of criminal lives near you, do you know it? No, but thanks to this registration, all that info is out there. I don't really expect to change your mind anyway, because if I recall correctly, you lean towards the "prison is for punishment" end of the scale, amirite?
2010-04-19 14:02:19
Ilocano
buuuurrrrrrppppp.......
+341|6957

DBBrinson1 wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

100% agreed, John.

The problem is... if you try explaining this to the average person, you'll get all kinds of bullshit responses back defending the registry.
Sorry man.  I've got a kid and I want to know if a child molestor has moved into the neighborhood.  If that's an average person bullshit response -so be it.  Pretty much once a pedo, always a pedo.

Florida is all ready reworking the law through glitch bills to address the 17-15 consentual sex and the average streaker.
Yup.  Rape/Molest anyone I know, I'll personally brand a big R on your forehead.

As for 18 with 16, well, wait...  Or find another 18 year old.  Can't?  Tough shit...

Last edited by Ilocano (2010-04-19 14:04:17)

2010-04-19 14:04:12
blademaster
I'm moving to Brazil
+2,075|6936

JohnG@lt wrote:

blademaster wrote:

http://www.familywatchdog.us/
use this link to see if there are any in offenders in ur area...
http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb13 … fender.jpg

Lit up like a Christmas tree
wow!
2010-04-19 14:10:46
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6942|USA

DesertFox- wrote:

Are they sentenced to a lifetime of punishment? Usually not. As I said, my major issue is that we have arbitrarily singled out sex crimes as being worse than any other type. They serve their time and get released, but the punishment isn't over thanks to this system. If a convicted drug dealer, burglar, or any other sort of criminal lives near you, do you know it? No, but thanks to this registration, all that info is out there. I don't really expect to change your mind anyway, because if I recall correctly, you lean towards the "prison is for punishment" end of the scale, amirite?
The victim is sentenced to a life time of punishment, again where is your concern for that over the concern for criminal?

I have no problem labeling a thief a murderer, etcc as such on a registry...

and yes  i view prison sould be punishment...What exactly do you view it as? let me guess, free college, free gym, free room and board for those "unfortunate" and "unlucky" people who choose to acquire such things by stealing them from others.
2010-04-19 14:45:34
DesertFox-
The very model of a modern major general
+796|6975|United States of America
The goal of prison should be to make sure they don't fucking go back, because the conditions that breed crime sure as hell aren't as liable to change as a person is. As far as the victims go, there's just about nothing that legal/governmental matters can do for them.

Also, I'm assuming you're fairly middle-class like myself. As people did in that topic about those Apache pilots who lit up those journalists among others, it's easy for people to say what they would and wouldn't do in that situation. The same applies here. Neither of us are in a desperate situation where our minds let us think it reasonable, or even conceivable to steal from someone else.
2010-04-19 14:53:10
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6942|USA

DesertFox- wrote:

The goal of prison should be to make sure they don't fucking go back, because the conditions that breed crime sure as hell aren't as liable to change as a person is. As far as the victims go, there's just about nothing that legal/governmental matters can do for them.

Also, I'm assuming you're fairly middle-class like myself. As people did in that topic about those Apache pilots who lit up those journalists among others, it's easy for people to say what they would and wouldn't do in that situation. The same applies here. Neither of us are in a desperate situation where our minds let us think it reasonable, or even conceivable to steal from someone else.
yes, because most of us are willing to make sacrifices in life for the life style we want, IE go to fuckin school, get a fuckin job, and make proper fuckin decsions. I have made my decisions in life that I do not have to fuck someone elses life up in order to survive. I have no sympathy for those that choose a different path, or for people like you that choose to excuse them.

Yup and by making prison a punishment, people will not want to go back


I love it can't do shit for the victim so lets coddle the criminal and improve their situations and lives....fuck that
2010-04-19 15:02:07
DesertFox-
The very model of a modern major general
+796|6975|United States of America
Yeah, we're all equal, lowing. We all have the same opportunities. You must be outside your mind to think that a good number of people who make the "choice" to be criminals don't really have much of a choice at all. Wake up and smell the coffee in the real world. They don't currently tortue you in prison as well, so it's pretty weak as a deterrent to crime. You've got an excellent snippet of how society views these people though in that last line: labelling them as criminals for the rest of their lives.
2010-04-19 15:12:44
Ilocano
buuuurrrrrrppppp.......
+341|6957

DesertFox- wrote:

Yeah, we're all equal, lowing. We all have the same opportunities. You must be outside your mind to think that a good number of people who make the "choice" to be criminals don't really have much of a choice at all. Wake up and smell the coffee in the real world. They don't currently tortue you in prison as well, so it's pretty weak as a deterrent to crime. You've got an excellent snippet of how society views these people though in that last line: labelling them as criminals for the rest of their lives.
DesertFox, what kind of criminals are you referring to that should not be punished for the rest of their lives (no voting, stigma, etc.).  I want to make sure they didn't have a choice when commiting the crime.
2010-04-19 15:20:44
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6942|USA

DesertFox- wrote:

Yeah, we're all equal, lowing. We all have the same opportunities. You must be outside your mind to think that a good number of people who make the "choice" to be criminals don't really have much of a choice at all. Wake up and smell the coffee in the real world. They don't currently tortue you in prison as well, so it's pretty weak as a deterrent to crime. You've got an excellent snippet of how society views these people though in that last line: labelling them as criminals for the rest of their lives.
You mean rape is not a choice? Murder is not a choice. Sorry I came into this world naked just like everyone else. I grew up poor, and I made decisions for myself to improve my life. What exactly would you expect the outcome to be for someone that chooses todrop out of school and sell drugs on the street corner as opposed to someone who finished school and koined the military for example?

God Damn! Stop toting personal responsibility as something only the "fortunate" and the "lucky" possess.
2010-04-19 15:28:26
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5648|London, England

lowing wrote:

DesertFox- wrote:

Are they sentenced to a lifetime of punishment? Usually not. As I said, my major issue is that we have arbitrarily singled out sex crimes as being worse than any other type. They serve their time and get released, but the punishment isn't over thanks to this system. If a convicted drug dealer, burglar, or any other sort of criminal lives near you, do you know it? No, but thanks to this registration, all that info is out there. I don't really expect to change your mind anyway, because if I recall correctly, you lean towards the "prison is for punishment" end of the scale, amirite?
The victim is sentenced to a life time of punishment, again where is your concern for that over the concern for criminal?

I have no problem labeling a thief a murderer, etcc as such on a registry...

and yes  i view prison sould be punishment...What exactly do you view it as? let me guess, free college, free gym, free room and board for those "unfortunate" and "unlucky" people who choose to acquire such things by stealing them from others.
If they want to be a victim for life that's their own damn problem. Most of us get over the bad shit that happens in our life and move on. If they are somehow missing that piece of the evolutionary puzzle, fuck 'em. If a woman has been raped, she's been raped exactly one time in her life, it doesn't continue on a daily basis for the rest of her life. If she's remembering the crap that's happened to her so vividly and so often that it impacts her daily life, maybe she should stop seeing the shrinks that are fucking with her mind for a pay day.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
2010-04-19 15:33:23
DesertFox-
The very model of a modern major general
+796|6975|United States of America

lowing wrote:

DesertFox- wrote:

Yeah, we're all equal, lowing. We all have the same opportunities. You must be outside your mind to think that a good number of people who make the "choice" to be criminals don't really have much of a choice at all. Wake up and smell the coffee in the real world. They don't currently tortue you in prison as well, so it's pretty weak as a deterrent to crime. You've got an excellent snippet of how society views these people though in that last line: labelling them as criminals for the rest of their lives.
You mean rape is not a choice? Murder is not a choice. Sorry I came into this world naked just like everyone else. I grew up poor, and I made decisions for myself to improve my life. What exactly would you expect the outcome to be for someone that chooses todrop out of school and sell drugs on the street corner as opposed to someone who finished school and koined the military for example?

God Damn! Stop toting personal responsibility as something only the "fortunate" and the "lucky" possess.
It's interesting how you quoted yourself for those words in the last sentence

Tell me when this starts sounding absurd:
God, my life has been tough. I was born into a loving family that has enough money to support itself and buy some luxuries as well. I was raised basically to be your stereotypical "good boy" by both of my parents, and we lived in quite a safe neighborhood in the suburbs. I was able to go to school, make friends, and excel in academic pursuits with the help of my family, too. My school was also well-funded enough to provide extracurricular activities, a safe environment to learn, and an excellent jumping-off point for so many universities. I was then able to attend a major university with a hefty scholarship, which helps because my other two siblings are in college as well. I'm currently working on pursing my degree and then attending a professional school. Thank God I made the right choices in my life.



Ilocano, as long as I'm beating the drum for being fair here, I suppose I would be referring to anyone where the sentence given is not a lifetime of punishment.
2010-04-19 15:35:44
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6942|USA

ruisleipa wrote:

JohnG@lt wrote:

This. Is there any wonder there is so much recidivism? People blame the jails for being soft, or blame sentencing for not being harsh enough or blame the fact that people learn how to be better criminals in jail. No, it's the fact that they're now fucked for the rest of their life. They have to put on every single job application, no matter how menial the job, that they are a former criminal. Not only is that embarrassing enough, but the vast majority of HR departments will automatically throw out the application.
well quite.

wonder what lowing has to say about this.
I will tell you what lowing has to say about this.

Every employer has the right to know the background of the person they are asked to entrust. I favor full disclosure.  I have to disclose my background why shouldn't a criminal? because his background is questionable? Fuck that. Why exaclt, do you think they even conduct interviews, have applications, ask for resumes? Time to get real.

I suppose you would have no problem dropping your children off at a day care that employs felons....yeah right.

Perhaps this is something that should be thought of before it is decided that is a great idea to rape or murder or molest a child or B&E.

THere are consequences to actions... get used to it.

Last edited by lowing (2010-04-19 15:46:40)

2010-04-19 15:41:19
Ilocano
buuuurrrrrrppppp.......
+341|6957

JohnG@lt wrote:

If they want to be a victim for life that's their own damn problem. Most of us get over the bad shit that happens in our life and move on. If they are somehow missing that piece of the evolutionary puzzle, fuck 'em. If a woman has been raped, she's been raped exactly one time in her life, it doesn't continue on a daily basis for the rest of her life. If she's remembering the crap that's happened to her so vividly and so often that it impacts her daily life, maybe she should stop seeing the shrinks that are fucking with her mind for a pay day.
So, after said rapists served his/her time, you would forgive him/her after raping your wife/sister/daughter?  No further punishment?

DesertFox- wrote:

Ilocano, as long as I'm beating the drum for being fair here, I suppose I would be referring to anyone where the sentence given is not a lifetime of punishment.
Wait, so rapists and murderers qualify?
2010-04-19 15:42:40
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6942|USA

JohnG@lt wrote:

lowing wrote:

DesertFox- wrote:

Are they sentenced to a lifetime of punishment? Usually not. As I said, my major issue is that we have arbitrarily singled out sex crimes as being worse than any other type. They serve their time and get released, but the punishment isn't over thanks to this system. If a convicted drug dealer, burglar, or any other sort of criminal lives near you, do you know it? No, but thanks to this registration, all that info is out there. I don't really expect to change your mind anyway, because if I recall correctly, you lean towards the "prison is for punishment" end of the scale, amirite?
The victim is sentenced to a life time of punishment, again where is your concern for that over the concern for criminal?

I have no problem labeling a thief a murderer, etcc as such on a registry...

and yes  i view prison sould be punishment...What exactly do you view it as? let me guess, free college, free gym, free room and board for those "unfortunate" and "unlucky" people who choose to acquire such things by stealing them from others.
If they want to be a victim for life that's their own damn problem. Most of us get over the bad shit that happens in our life and move on. If they are somehow missing that piece of the evolutionary puzzle, fuck 'em. If a woman has been raped, she's been raped exactly one time in her life, it doesn't continue on a daily basis for the rest of her life. If she's remembering the crap that's happened to her so vividly and so often that it impacts her daily life, maybe she should stop seeing the shrinks that are fucking with her mind for a pay day.
I see, so fuck the person that is traumatized, fuck understanding, and compassion for what they have to go through. and coddle the person that committed the crime with sympathy, understanding and forgivness..

All of you preach how we are shaped by our environment, apparently unless you are a victim, then you should just shake it off and move on, you are not expected to carry what has happened to you as something that shaped your life. You excuse a criminal and condemn the victim.

 

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