Pages: 1 2 3 4 … 6

 

2010-03-29 15:56:45
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6841

RAIMIUS wrote:

Charity = communism?
I will say that some of the early members of the Christian church did practice communism, but that's hardly the same as the religion being communism.

Also, your quote about not worrying about material goods isn't saying "Be a bum. Someone will give you stuff."  Obviously, being dedicated to getting stuff was frowned upon, but I don't think it was implying people shouldn't work.
There are many references, is the book of Acts too which I am currently reading (basically Peter's growth of the church following JC's death from what I've read so far), where all materials goods are rendered up to the Christian community. Two characters, Ananias and his wife, are struck dead for withholding some of their wealth (having given the majority after selling everything they own). Pinko communism. There are direct references in the Gospels themselves about going into villages sponging off folks - Matthew 10 springs to mind.

JC's bottom line was this: everyone should share and anyone who amasses material wealth is a sinner. So whether that's communism or not that's up to the individual. It's a slam dunk for me. Thankfully I'm not a Christian and I'll get an iPhone if I damn well want to.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2010-03-29 16:11:51)

2010-03-29 16:32:26
Morpheus
This shit still going?
+508|6285|The Mitten
tbh... i'm scared of extremists in general... chrsitian/islamic/buddhist/etc.
EE (hats
2010-03-29 18:29:54
BigmacK
Back from the Dead.
+628|7036|Chicago.

Morpheus wrote:

tbh... i'm scared of extremists in general... chrsitian/islamic/buddhist/etc.
I'm not scared. I laugh. It's masking aggressive behavior with the pretense of faith.
2010-03-29 18:56:05
Marlo Stanfield
online poker tax cheating
+122|5448

CameronPoe wrote:

RAIMIUS wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:


Much like everyone else in the modern Christian world. Just finished rereading the four gospels and can confirm that it's basically communism without the work ethic.
based on what principles, exactly?
I'll root out a few quotes seen as it's fresh:

"And if someone wants to sue you and take your tunic, let him have your cloak as well.... Give to the one who asks you, and do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you."

"Do not store up for yourself treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy, and where thieves break in and steal.... No one can serve two masters. Either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and Money."

"So do not worry, saying, 'What shall we eat?' or 'What shall we drink?' or 'What shall we wear?'. For the pagans run after all these things, and your heavenly Father knows that you need them. But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well. Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself."

"Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be open to you. For everyone who asks receives; he who seeks finds; and to him who knocks; the door will be opened."

"If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven."

"I tell you the truth it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God".

That's just a hastily prepared sample from the Book of Matthew! Need I go on?
Charity is not the same as communism aside from that I've never read any communist philosophy that had made women out to be the great destroyers of men nor have I ever read any communist philosophy that said anything about perfect or chosen people.
2010-03-29 20:40:45
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6691|North Carolina

ruisleipa wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

On the flipside, though...  How often have Christian groups engaged in terror in America over the last decade versus Islamic groups?

Obviously, Christianity has equal potential for terror, but in practice, Islamic groups seem to do it more often.
In America? More than any Islamist groups I'm certain. The only organised terrorist attack (apart from the crazy individual people) by teh mooslims was 9/11 right?

In any case the chances of anything happening to any one person are minisicule, but it's OK to think there will be something..for the FEAR.
Well, it's certainly possible that Christian groups will become more of a problem in the coming years.  I'm just saying that Islamic extremism was more dominant as a problem in the last decade than Christian extremism was.
2010-03-30 04:45:24
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6841

Marlo Stanfield wrote:

Charity is not the same as communism aside from that I've never read any communist philosophy that had made women out to be the great destroyers of men nor have I ever read any communist philosophy that said anything about perfect or chosen people.
It's not just charity he's banging on about. He's talking about the fact that the be a true Christian that will be welcomed into God's arms in heaven you have to live the life of an ascetic and forego all material and monetary wealth. Perhaps not communist - just anti-capitalist. Anarchist maybe.

"You cannot serve both God and Money."

"It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."

Last edited by CameronPoe (2010-03-30 04:47:06)

2010-03-30 05:27:34
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,816|6391|eXtreme to the maX
As you say, its not really capitalism, more hope for the best and it'll work out fine.

"You cannot serve both God and Money."

"It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."
So God punishes success? A sliding tax scale is to help you avoid hell. Swallow that one lowing.

Last edited by Dilbert_X (2010-03-30 05:33:48)

Fuck Israel
2010-03-30 06:32:22
11 Bravo
Banned
+965|5523|Cleveland, Ohio

eleven bravo wrote:

where are the christians condeming these people and protesting out in the street?
cuz they havent killed any women or children yet?  i dunno.  might have something to do with that.
2010-03-30 07:23:10
destruktion_6143
Was ist Loos?
+154|6912|Canada

Morpheus wrote:

tbh... i'm scared of extremists in general... chrsitian/islamic/buddhist/etc.
Lol, I would love to see a Buddhist extremist...
2010-03-30 07:29:32
M.O.A.B
'Light 'em up!'
+1,220|6508|Escea

destruktion_6143 wrote:

Morpheus wrote:

tbh... i'm scared of extremists in general... chrsitian/islamic/buddhist/etc.
Lol, I would love to see a Buddhist extremist...
Watch out, they'll snap your back with one kick.

https://static.bf2s.com/files/user/28748/qianjun_jiao_the_feet_exercise744a0e97b5f9cc060469.jpg

OT: Religiously motivated militia's are as wacky as the next no matter where they come from. Although the degree of wackiness can fluctuate.
2010-03-30 12:32:53
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6886|132 and Bush

ATG wrote:

www.hutaree.com

That is the website of the militia group that got raided.
Why are militant websites so shitty? Someone needs to tell their marketing department to put away MS frontpage.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
2010-03-30 13:04:20
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6937|USA

ruisleipa wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

On the flipside, though...  How often have Christian groups engaged in terror in America over the last decade versus Islamic groups?

Obviously, Christianity has equal potential for terror, but in practice, Islamic groups seem to do it more often.
In America? More than any Islamist groups I'm certain. The only organised terrorist attack (apart from the crazy individual people) by teh mooslims was 9/11 right?

In any case the chances of anything happening to any one person are minisicule, but it's OK to think there will be something..for the FEAR.
Not sure how or why you always try to equate pissed off with fear.

No one is afraid, they simply are not willing to stand for the bullshit like Islamic terrorists dish out. Fear has got nothing to do with it.

As for the other comments:

chances are main stream Christians probably have never heard of this Christian extremists group, have you? and rest assured had they carried out any attacks of significance in the name of Christianity main stream Christians would be in an uproar. Justl ike they are when ever the KKK comes into their town.

This group does not represent the a religioin of peace by claiming Christian motives. Christianity does not condone or teach such behavior, so their actions and beliefs fly in the face of Christianity. Islam not so much.
2010-03-30 13:07:54
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6937|USA

Dilbert_X wrote:

As you say, its not really capitalism, more hope for the best and it'll work out fine.

"You cannot serve both God and Money."

"It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."
So God punishes success? A sliding tax scale is to help you avoid hell. Swallow that one lowing.
Sorry, not Christian, so I will continue to work for myself and my family and advocate controlling the money I earn. I would also continue to  encoutrage you to do the same.
2010-03-30 14:12:58
ruisleipa
Member
+149|6508|teh FIN-land

lowing wrote:

Not sure how or why you always try to equate pissed off with fear.

No one is afraid, they simply are not willing to stand for the bullshit like Islamic terrorists dish out. Fear has got nothing to do with it.
because the only reason people think there is a massive threat to everything is because of the fear that the media above all pushes on you, aided and abetted by governments. It's bollocks to say fear has nothing to do with it.


lowing wrote:

chances are main stream Christians probably have never heard of this Christian extremists group, have you? and rest assured had they carried out any attacks of significance in the name of Christianity main stream Christians would be in an uproar. Justl ike they are when ever the KKK comes into their town.

This group does not represent the a religioin of peace by claiming Christian motives. Christianity does not condone or teach such behavior, so their actions and beliefs fly in the face of Christianity. Islam not so much.
but everything you say abot Christianity ('a' or 'the' religion of peace btw??) can be said about Islam. Clearly some Christians do believe in this sect's teachings, and some don't.
2010-03-30 14:22:20
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6937|USA

ruisleipa wrote:

lowing wrote:

Not sure how or why you always try to equate pissed off with fear.

No one is afraid, they simply are not willing to stand for the bullshit like Islamic terrorists dish out. Fear has got nothing to do with it.
because the only reason people think there is a massive threat to everything is because of the fear that the media above all pushes on you, aided and abetted by governments. It's bollocks to say fear has nothing to do with it.


lowing wrote:

chances are main stream Christians probably have never heard of this Christian extremists group, have you? and rest assured had they carried out any attacks of significance in the name of Christianity main stream Christians would be in an uproar. Justl ike they are when ever the KKK comes into their town.

This group does not represent the a religioin of peace by claiming Christian motives. Christianity does not condone or teach such behavior, so their actions and beliefs fly in the face of Christianity. Islam not so much.
but everything you say abot Christianity ('a' or 'the' religion of peace btw??) can be said about Islam. Clearly some Christians do believe in this sect's teachings, and some don't.
To ignore what Islamic terrorists are capable of is foolish, and is not motivated by fear. It is motivated by a sense of standing up four yourself against those that wish you harm. This is not fear. This has been proven by flight 93 as well as the Christmas Day crotch bomber when they beat the fuck outta him.
Regardless as to what Christian nutjobs believe, their actions are not reinforced by what Jesus has taught. The same can not be said about Islam.
2010-03-30 16:10:23
ruisleipa
Member
+149|6508|teh FIN-land

lowing wrote:

Regardless as to what Christian nutjobs believe, their actions are not reinforced by what Jesus has taught. The same can not be said about Islam.
Not gonna get into another argument with you, suffice to say that your individual opinion on any religion means diddly squat, and since I know Muslims who are lovely peaceful people and are totally against fundamentalists, especially those who commit atrocities, then I have to say that you just choose to consider Islam 'evil' and Christianity 'good' at heart. you don't seem to mind if there're some groups in your own country who are as fundamentalist as anyone, no matter what you think about the religion as a whole. You've been swayed by the fundamentalists propaganda, which is exactly what they want. Shame.
2010-03-30 16:35:00
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,056|7057|PNW

Ann Coulter wrote:

Not all Muslims may be terrorists, but all terrorists are Muslims.

ruisleipa wrote:

lowing wrote:

Regardless as to what Christian nutjobs believe, their actions are not reinforced by what Jesus has taught. The same can not be said about Islam.
Not gonna get into another argument with you, suffice to say that your individual opinion on any religion means diddly squat, and since I know Muslims who are lovely peaceful people and are totally against fundamentalists, especially those who commit atrocities, then I have to say that you just choose to consider Islam 'evil' and Christianity 'good' at heart. you don't seem to mind if there're some groups in your own country who are as fundamentalist as anyone, no matter what you think about the religion as a whole. You've been swayed by the fundamentalists propaganda, which is exactly what they want. Shame.
Personally, I find the Koran to be on several levels far creepier than the Christian Bible, but that's just me.

People, on the other hand, are an entirely different matter.

Last edited by unnamednewbie13 (2010-03-30 16:36:45)

2010-03-30 17:01:20
m3thod
All kiiiiiiiiinds of gainz
+2,197|6957|UK
last time i checked FARC and shining path don't point their asses towards Mecca when they pray.
Blackbelts are just whitebelts who have never quit.
2010-03-31 13:59:14
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6937|USA

ruisleipa wrote:

lowing wrote:

Regardless as to what Christian nutjobs believe, their actions are not reinforced by what Jesus has taught. The same can not be said about Islam.
Not gonna get into another argument with you, suffice to say that your individual opinion on any religion means diddly squat, and since I know Muslims who are lovely peaceful people and are totally against fundamentalists, especially those who commit atrocities, then I have to say that you just choose to consider Islam 'evil' and Christianity 'good' at heart. you don't seem to mind if there're some groups in your own country who are as fundamentalist as anyone, no matter what you think about the religion as a whole. You've been swayed by the fundamentalists propaganda, which is exactly what they want. Shame.
Yeah well my opinion means just as much to me as any one elses opinion means to them. Not really sure what point you are trying to make with that statement.

I know some Muslims as well, and they are some of the nicest people I have met. As I have said before, and you continue to ignore, Muslims are individuals and are judged individually. Islam is a religion and is judged by its teachings. This is not my opinion this is a fact. I do not consider Christianity as "good" I think it is a man made religion of convenience, and the second they start blowing up school children in the name of Jesus, you will have my condemnation. I have been swayed by actions and events in the name of religion and like it or not, in this era of our lives, Islam wins the prize as most fucked up. To defend it, is equally as fucked up.
2010-03-31 14:14:08
Morpheus
This shit still going?
+508|6285|The Mitten

BigmacK wrote:

Morpheus wrote:

tbh... i'm scared of extremists in general... chrsitian/islamic/buddhist/etc.
I'm not scared. I laugh. It's masking aggressive behavior with the pretense of faith.
well, yes but my post was referring to the fact that it's the extremist part, not the insert religion here part.


and 'scared' isn't quite the right word either.
EE (hats
2010-03-31 15:08:49
ruisleipa
Member
+149|6508|teh FIN-land

lowing wrote:

Yeah well my opinion means just as much to me as any one elses opinion means to them. Not really sure what point you are trying to make with that statement.

I know some Muslims as well, and they are some of the nicest people I have met. As I have said before, and you continue to ignore, Muslims are individuals and are judged individually. Islam is a religion and is judged by its teachings. This is not my opinion this is a fact. I do not consider Christianity as "good" I think it is a man made religion of convenience, and the second they start blowing up school children in the name of Jesus, you will have my condemnation. I have been swayed by actions and events in the name of religion and like it or not, in this era of our lives, Islam wins the prize as most fucked up. To defend it, is equally as fucked up.
It's not what your opinion means to you, it's how relevant your opinion is to 'the truth': obviously a large part of the problem with religion is that it is ALL interpretation and therefore there are few 'truths'. There are no facts involved, it's all basically conjecture. On the one hand we have Christian and Islamic fundamentalists who both tend to advoacte violence in pursuance of their goals, whatever they may be. Then there are the 'normal' followers who, like most people, want to live a peaceful life. You can't seperate like you want to the teachings and the followers. The followers have thier own interpretation. Some people intertpret Islam to be violent, some do likewise with Christianity. Even the holy books are completely open to interpretation. Half of the bible involves death and killing. It's not a nice book. People HAVE committed atrocities in the name of Christianity, as they have in the name of Islam. I'm not defending 'terrorism', whether state-sponsored by governments or individual acts. But you're wrong to assume that it is a fact Islam is more violent than Christianity, or Muslims more than Christians, as your nice peaceful Muslim friends would attest.

Last edited by ruisleipa (2010-03-31 15:10:16)

2010-03-31 15:37:27
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6937|USA

ruisleipa wrote:

lowing wrote:

Yeah well my opinion means just as much to me as any one elses opinion means to them. Not really sure what point you are trying to make with that statement.

I know some Muslims as well, and they are some of the nicest people I have met. As I have said before, and you continue to ignore, Muslims are individuals and are judged individually. Islam is a religion and is judged by its teachings. This is not my opinion this is a fact. I do not consider Christianity as "good" I think it is a man made religion of convenience, and the second they start blowing up school children in the name of Jesus, you will have my condemnation. I have been swayed by actions and events in the name of religion and like it or not, in this era of our lives, Islam wins the prize as most fucked up. To defend it, is equally as fucked up.
It's not what your opinion means to you, it's how relevant your opinion is to 'the truth': obviously a large part of the problem with religion is that it is ALL interpretation and therefore there are few 'truths'. There are no facts involved, it's all basically conjecture. On the one hand we have Christian and Islamic fundamentalists who both tend to advoacte violence in pursuance of their goals, whatever they may be. Then there are the 'normal' followers who, like most people, want to live a peaceful life. You can't seperate like you want to the teachings and the followers. The followers have thier own interpretation. Some people intertpret Islam to be violent, some do likewise with Christianity. Even the holy books are completely open to interpretation. Half of the bible involves death and killing. It's not a nice book. People HAVE committed atrocities in the name of Christianity, as they have in the name of Islam. I'm not defending 'terrorism', whether state-sponsored by governments or individual acts. But you're wrong to assume that it is a fact Islam is more violent than Christianity, or Muslims more than Christians, as your nice peaceful Muslim friends would attest.
No what is a fact is that the messanger of Chrisitianity taught and practiced peace, and tolerance. and the messanger of Islam was a child molester who was a warrior, and killed many people, to furhter the cause of Islam. Regardless as to what individuals do in the names of each religion, the fact remains what each religion taught and who brought each relgions message.

The OT was mainly stories of what "has happened", the NT is the teachings of Christ.

Using "interpretation" is just another catch all phrase to remove responsibility of Islam for what it advocates because you can not really defend it.
2010-03-31 15:45:42
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6841

lowing wrote:

No what is a fact is that the messanger of Chrisitianity taught and practiced peace, and tolerance. and the messanger of Islam was a child molester who was a warrior, and killed many people, to furhter the cause of Islam. Regardless as to what individuals do in the names of each religion, the fact remains what each religion taught and who brought each relgions message.

The OT was mainly stories of what "has happened", the NT is the teachings of Christ.

Using "interpretation" is just another catch all phrase to remove responsibility of Islam for what it advocates because you can not really defend it.
I'm not going to get into this argument but I will say, having just reread the gospels, is that Christ was certainly ambiguous on the tolerance front:

"For I have come to turn a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law - a man's enemies will be the members of his own household".

There are several references to damnation and sorting the 'wheat from the chaff' metaphorically speaking also. "He who is not with me is against me, and he who does not gather with me scatters". Now where have I heard that before...

Nothing as pointed as in the Quran but nevertheless very much open to interpretation and not quite as serene as you would make out.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2010-03-31 15:50:38)

2010-03-31 15:47:44
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6691|North Carolina
Militia groups operate on the faulty logic that they are capable of doing anything to actually affect a government as powerful as ours.

Like it or not, the government has the final say on things, and if you are a big enough annoyance for them...  they will remove or eliminate you.
2010-03-31 16:04:33
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6937|USA

CameronPoe wrote:

lowing wrote:

No what is a fact is that the messanger of Chrisitianity taught and practiced peace, and tolerance. and the messanger of Islam was a child molester who was a warrior, and killed many people, to furhter the cause of Islam. Regardless as to what individuals do in the names of each religion, the fact remains what each religion taught and who brought each relgions message.

The OT was mainly stories of what "has happened", the NT is the teachings of Christ.

Using "interpretation" is just another catch all phrase to remove responsibility of Islam for what it advocates because you can not really defend it.
I'm not going to get into this argument but I will say, having just reread the gospels, is that Christ was certainly ambiguous on the tolerance front:

"For I have come to turn a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law - a man's enemies will be the members of his own household".

There are several references to damnation and sorting the 'wheat from the chaff' metaphorically speaking also. "He who is not with me is against me, and he who does not gather with me scatters". Now where have I heard that before...

Nothing as pointed as in the Quran but nevertheless very much open to interpretation and not quite as serene as you would make out.
This quote is a famous cherry pick of those trying to dispel Jesus as anything except "righteous". In context, what he was saying was, in following him, and abandoning the traditions of the family, strife would be result within that family. He has not advocated  the destruction of family.


As far as Muhammad there is no interpretation as to what he did in action and what he taught. He WAS a murderer and there is no denying it. He advocated killing to further the cause of Islam.

 

Pages: 1 2 3 4 … 6

Board footer

Privacy Policy - © 2025 Jeff Minard