im not in the army. now you can answer the question and not come back with some smart ass "miltary drop bombs blah blah blah."Braddock wrote:
What rank are you in the army?11 Bravo wrote:
nice so you just are happy to sit back on your little island and not do a damn thing except bitch and moan?Braddock wrote:
I just explained why in my last post... would you like me to draw you a picture?
Ahhh, so you just sit behind your keyboard and not do a damn thing except bitch and moan?11 Bravo wrote:
im not in the army. now you can answer the question and not come back with some smart ass "miltary drop bombs blah blah blah."Braddock wrote:
What rank are you in the army?11 Bravo wrote:
nice so you just are happy to sit back on your little island and not do a damn thing except bitch and moan?
he was navy armyBraddock wrote:
What rank are you in the army?11 Bravo wrote:
nice so you just are happy to sit back on your little island and not do a damn thing except bitch and moan?Braddock wrote:
I just explained why in my last post... would you like me to draw you a picture?
Baba Booey
ive been to africa as part of a miltary force trying to deliver food. i know thats not the same as knocking back guiness and rocking out but hey.Braddock wrote:
Ahhh, so you just sit behind your keyboard and not do a damn thing except bitch and moan?11 Bravo wrote:
im not in the army. now you can answer the question and not come back with some smart ass "miltary drop bombs blah blah blah."Braddock wrote:
What rank are you in the army?
So you did the exact same thing that the Irish International forces do... and yet you're now criticizing them?11 Bravo wrote:
ive been to africa as part of a miltary force trying to deliver food. i know thats not the same as knocking back guiness and rocking out but hey.Braddock wrote:
Ahhh, so you just sit behind your keyboard and not do a damn thing except bitch and moan?11 Bravo wrote:
im not in the army. now you can answer the question and not come back with some smart ass "miltary drop bombs blah blah blah."
no. you were getting personal and asked me. now you speak of your country. i was speaking of countries. which is what i thought we were doing. stop playing fucking games.Braddock wrote:
So you did the exact same thing that the Irish International forces do... and yet you're now criticizing them?11 Bravo wrote:
ive been to africa as part of a miltary force trying to deliver food. i know thats not the same as knocking back guiness and rocking out but hey.Braddock wrote:
Ahhh, so you just sit behind your keyboard and not do a damn thing except bitch and moan?
You were slagging off Ireland's participation in International situations and yet the only personal experience you have of making any difference to the world (as opposed to just bitching and moaning) is doing the very same thing that our forces do when they go overseas i.e distribute aid, keep the peace etc.11 Bravo wrote:
no. you were getting personal and asked me. now you speak of your country. i was speaking of countries. which is what i thought we were doing. stop playing fucking games.Braddock wrote:
So you did the exact same thing that the Irish International forces do... and yet you're now criticizing them?11 Bravo wrote:
ive been to africa as part of a miltary force trying to deliver food. i know thats not the same as knocking back guiness and rocking out but hey.
no. i was speaking of zimbobway. why not go do anything there?Braddock wrote:
You were slagging off Ireland's participation in International situations and yet the only personal experience you have of making any difference to the world (as opposed to just bitching and moaning) is doing the very same thing that our forces do when they go overseas i.e distribute aid, keep the peace etc.11 Bravo wrote:
no. you were getting personal and asked me. now you speak of your country. i was speaking of countries. which is what i thought we were doing. stop playing fucking games.Braddock wrote:
So you did the exact same thing that the Irish International forces do... and yet you're now criticizing them?
and i have done more than that in africa, son. keep fucking around. this is getting old. fuck this. football time. good day.
Last edited by 11 Bravo (2010-01-24 12:47:15)
Because Zimbabwe needs to sort its own shit out. I'm an isolationist, I believe people need to sort out their own shit... if Iraq wanted rid of Saddam then change should have come from within, you can rarely inject regime change from outside (not without disastrous consequences further down the road). When despots hold onto power in a country its largely because they're either being propped up by the support of a super-power, or because there's not enough support for the opposition movement. The same goes for Zimbabwe, what's the point in a foreign country trying to step in and change the situation there when there's still thousands of idiots who support Mugabe even though he's a total muppet? When a country starts throwing its weight around and picking on other countries then the UN has to sort it out, that's what it's there for. It's nowhere near a perfect system but it's the best we've got... the alternative is every country running around doing what they please and following their own agendas.11 Bravo wrote:
no. i was speaking of zimbobway. why not go do anything there?Braddock wrote:
You were slagging off Ireland's participation in International situations and yet the only personal experience you have of making any difference to the world (as opposed to just bitching and moaning) is doing the very same thing that our forces do when they go overseas i.e distribute aid, keep the peace etc.11 Bravo wrote:
no. you were getting personal and asked me. now you speak of your country. i was speaking of countries. which is what i thought we were doing. stop playing fucking games.
and i have done more than that in africa, son. keep fucking around. this is getting old. fuck this. football time. good day.
PS: You seem in an awful hurry to watch highlights of Arsenal losing?
win, lose...doesnt matter to me. i just like watching the matches.Braddock wrote:
PS: You seem in an awful hurry to watch highlights of Arsenal losing?
Brad, those places are never going to sort themselves out. They just can't do it. Civilian's don't last long against a dictator and his army.Braddock wrote:
Because Zimbabwe needs to sort its own shit out. I'm an isolationist, I believe people need to sort out their own shit... if Iraq wanted rid of Saddam then change should have come from within, you can rarely inject regime change from outside (not without disastrous consequences further down the road). When despots hold onto power in a country its largely because they're either being propped up by the support of a super-power, or because there's not enough support for the opposition movement. The same goes for Zimbabwe, what's the point in a foreign country trying to step in and change the situation there when there's still thousands of idiots who support Mugabe even though he's a total muppet? When a country starts throwing its weight around and picking on other countries then the UN has to sort it out, that's what it's there for. It's nowhere near a perfect system but it's the best we've got... the alternative is every country running around doing what they please and following their own agendas.11 Bravo wrote:
no. i was speaking of zimbobway. why not go do anything there?Braddock wrote:
You were slagging off Ireland's participation in International situations and yet the only personal experience you have of making any difference to the world (as opposed to just bitching and moaning) is doing the very same thing that our forces do when they go overseas i.e distribute aid, keep the peace etc.
and i have done more than that in africa, son. keep fucking around. this is getting old. fuck this. football time. good day.
PS: You seem in an awful hurry to watch highlights of Arsenal losing?
The "alternative" is already here, it's just countries are forced to hide their real goals from their populations and other nations. I thought you understood politicians aren't out to be evil, a lack of morals comes with doing what you can in a position of power. I'm sure you made the thread a year ago or so.Braddock wrote:
Because Zimbabwe needs to sort its own shit out. I'm an isolationist, I believe people need to sort out their own shit... if Iraq wanted rid of Saddam then change should have come from within, you can rarely inject regime change from outside (not without disastrous consequences further down the road). When despots hold onto power in a country its largely because they're either being propped up by the support of a super-power, or because there's not enough support for the opposition movement. The same goes for Zimbabwe, what's the point in a foreign country trying to step in and change the situation there when there's still thousands of idiots who support Mugabe even though he's a total muppet? When a country starts throwing its weight around and picking on other countries then the UN has to sort it out, that's what it's there for. It's nowhere near a perfect system but it's the best we've got... the alternative is every country running around doing what they please and following their own agendas.11 Bravo wrote:
no. i was speaking of zimbobway. why not go do anything there?Braddock wrote:
You were slagging off Ireland's participation in International situations and yet the only personal experience you have of making any difference to the world (as opposed to just bitching and moaning) is doing the very same thing that our forces do when they go overseas i.e distribute aid, keep the peace etc.
and i have done more than that in africa, son. keep fucking around. this is getting old. fuck this. football time. good day.
PS: You seem in an awful hurry to watch highlights of Arsenal losing?
I found it difficult enough watching it the first time round! Very disappointing performance, Wenger's gamble backfired big-time.11 Bravo wrote:
win, lose...doesnt matter to me. i just like watching the matches.Braddock wrote:
PS: You seem in an awful hurry to watch highlights of Arsenal losing?
Biblical References on a gun sight -> Attacking US foriegn policy ->Soccer
WTF?
WTF?
i have to watch them on delay usually..or mid week. so, i have not seen it yet. i do look at the results though for today.Braddock wrote:
I found it difficult enough watching it the first time round! Very disappointing performance, Wenger's gamble backfired big-time.11 Bravo wrote:
win, lose...doesnt matter to me. i just like watching the matches.Braddock wrote:
PS: You seem in an awful hurry to watch highlights of Arsenal losing?
I did indeed, I still hold those beliefs... I didn't anything in my post contradicts that?jord wrote:
The "alternative" is already here, it's just countries are forced to hide their real goals from their populations and other nations. I thought you understood politicians aren't out to be evil, a lack of morals comes with doing what you can in a position of power. I'm sure you made the thread a year ago or so.Braddock wrote:
Because Zimbabwe needs to sort its own shit out. I'm an isolationist, I believe people need to sort out their own shit... if Iraq wanted rid of Saddam then change should have come from within, you can rarely inject regime change from outside (not without disastrous consequences further down the road). When despots hold onto power in a country its largely because they're either being propped up by the support of a super-power, or because there's not enough support for the opposition movement. The same goes for Zimbabwe, what's the point in a foreign country trying to step in and change the situation there when there's still thousands of idiots who support Mugabe even though he's a total muppet? When a country starts throwing its weight around and picking on other countries then the UN has to sort it out, that's what it's there for. It's nowhere near a perfect system but it's the best we've got... the alternative is every country running around doing what they please and following their own agendas.11 Bravo wrote:
no. i was speaking of zimbobway. why not go do anything there?
and i have done more than that in africa, son. keep fucking around. this is getting old. fuck this. football time. good day.
PS: You seem in an awful hurry to watch highlights of Arsenal losing?
You referred to pretty much what is happening now as an "alternative". The only small difference is most countries hide their methods of completing their agenda.Braddock wrote:
I did indeed, I still hold those beliefs... I didn't anything in my post contradicts that?jord wrote:
The "alternative" is already here, it's just countries are forced to hide their real goals from their populations and other nations. I thought you understood politicians aren't out to be evil, a lack of morals comes with doing what you can in a position of power. I'm sure you made the thread a year ago or so.Braddock wrote:
Because Zimbabwe needs to sort its own shit out. I'm an isolationist, I believe people need to sort out their own shit... if Iraq wanted rid of Saddam then change should have come from within, you can rarely inject regime change from outside (not without disastrous consequences further down the road). When despots hold onto power in a country its largely because they're either being propped up by the support of a super-power, or because there's not enough support for the opposition movement. The same goes for Zimbabwe, what's the point in a foreign country trying to step in and change the situation there when there's still thousands of idiots who support Mugabe even though he's a total muppet? When a country starts throwing its weight around and picking on other countries then the UN has to sort it out, that's what it's there for. It's nowhere near a perfect system but it's the best we've got... the alternative is every country running around doing what they please and following their own agendas.
PS: You seem in an awful hurry to watch highlights of Arsenal losing?
You can't say they'll never sort themselves out... unless you have a crystal ball of course. It is depressing how self-defeating African politics can be sometimes but they're a continent with a huge chip on their shoulder. Slavery, imperialism, famine, debt... they haven't had it easy. We can't hold their hand forever, they need to learn to look after themselves.M.O.A.B wrote:
Brad, those places are never going to sort themselves out. They just can't do it. Civilian's don't last long against a dictator and his army.Braddock wrote:
Because Zimbabwe needs to sort its own shit out. I'm an isolationist, I believe people need to sort out their own shit... if Iraq wanted rid of Saddam then change should have come from within, you can rarely inject regime change from outside (not without disastrous consequences further down the road). When despots hold onto power in a country its largely because they're either being propped up by the support of a super-power, or because there's not enough support for the opposition movement. The same goes for Zimbabwe, what's the point in a foreign country trying to step in and change the situation there when there's still thousands of idiots who support Mugabe even though he's a total muppet? When a country starts throwing its weight around and picking on other countries then the UN has to sort it out, that's what it's there for. It's nowhere near a perfect system but it's the best we've got... the alternative is every country running around doing what they please and following their own agendas.11 Bravo wrote:
no. i was speaking of zimbobway. why not go do anything there?
and i have done more than that in africa, son. keep fucking around. this is getting old. fuck this. football time. good day.
PS: You seem in an awful hurry to watch highlights of Arsenal losing?
The "alternative" certainly became the accepted norm during the Bush regime, I agree. Although I understand the mechanics of politics I do not agree with them.jord wrote:
You referred to pretty much what is happening now as an "alternative". The only small difference is most countries hide their methods of completing their agenda.Braddock wrote:
I did indeed, I still hold those beliefs... I didn't anything in my post contradicts that?jord wrote:
The "alternative" is already here, it's just countries are forced to hide their real goals from their populations and other nations. I thought you understood politicians aren't out to be evil, a lack of morals comes with doing what you can in a position of power. I'm sure you made the thread a year ago or so.
They're only going to learn if somebody teaches them. Africa operates tribally for the most part and they have little grasp of running a country like everywhere else.Braddock wrote:
You can't say they'll never sort themselves out... unless you have a crystal ball of course. It is depressing how self-defeating African politics can be sometimes but they're a continent with a huge chip on their shoulder. Slavery, imperialism, famine, debt... they haven't had it easy. We can't hold their hand forever, they need to learn to look after themselves.M.O.A.B wrote:
Brad, those places are never going to sort themselves out. They just can't do it. Civilian's don't last long against a dictator and his army.Braddock wrote:
Because Zimbabwe needs to sort its own shit out. I'm an isolationist, I believe people need to sort out their own shit... if Iraq wanted rid of Saddam then change should have come from within, you can rarely inject regime change from outside (not without disastrous consequences further down the road). When despots hold onto power in a country its largely because they're either being propped up by the support of a super-power, or because there's not enough support for the opposition movement. The same goes for Zimbabwe, what's the point in a foreign country trying to step in and change the situation there when there's still thousands of idiots who support Mugabe even though he's a total muppet? When a country starts throwing its weight around and picking on other countries then the UN has to sort it out, that's what it's there for. It's nowhere near a perfect system but it's the best we've got... the alternative is every country running around doing what they please and following their own agendas.
PS: You seem in an awful hurry to watch highlights of Arsenal losing?
People like Mugabe. Former rebel leader who takes power, runs the country into and below the ground and yet still remains in his position because he controls the army. The people are not equipped to take him on directly and working politically bares few results in somewhere like Zimbabwe.
As someone who lives in a former colony I find that attitude extremely condescending. The Brits probably thought the same about us "savages". We're part of the problem as regards Africa (Protectionist trading policies, International debt, plundering their resources, cheap labour etc.), we can't expect to get up on our high horses and teach them how to "help themselves" while we're fucking them in the ass.M.O.A.B wrote:
They're only going to learn if somebody teaches them. Africa operates tribally for the most part and they have little grasp of running a country like everywhere else.Braddock wrote:
You can't say they'll never sort themselves out... unless you have a crystal ball of course. It is depressing how self-defeating African politics can be sometimes but they're a continent with a huge chip on their shoulder. Slavery, imperialism, famine, debt... they haven't had it easy. We can't hold their hand forever, they need to learn to look after themselves.M.O.A.B wrote:
Brad, those places are never going to sort themselves out. They just can't do it. Civilian's don't last long against a dictator and his army.
People like Mugabe. Former rebel leader who takes power, runs the country into and below the ground and yet still remains in his position because he controls the army. The people are not equipped to take him on directly and working politically bares few results in somewhere like Zimbabwe.
Whatever it is you think, they cannot do it themselves. Its a fact. Africa is for the most part like a giant Afghanistan, filled with tribes and rebel groups constantly fighting each other. Without outside help, Afghanistan would remain a shithole forever, as will most of Africa.Braddock wrote:
As someone who lives in a former colony I find that attitude extremely condescending. The Brits probably thought the same about us "savages". We're part of the problem as regards Africa (Protectionist trading policies, International debt, plundering their resources, cheap labour etc.), we can't expect to get up on our high horses and teach them how to "help themselves" while we're fucking them in the ass.M.O.A.B wrote:
They're only going to learn if somebody teaches them. Africa operates tribally for the most part and they have little grasp of running a country like everywhere else.Braddock wrote:
You can't say they'll never sort themselves out... unless you have a crystal ball of course. It is depressing how self-defeating African politics can be sometimes but they're a continent with a huge chip on their shoulder. Slavery, imperialism, famine, debt... they haven't had it easy. We can't hold their hand forever, they need to learn to look after themselves.
People like Mugabe. Former rebel leader who takes power, runs the country into and below the ground and yet still remains in his position because he controls the army. The people are not equipped to take him on directly and working politically bares few results in somewhere like Zimbabwe.
So you have to tell me, how will it work if they go it alone? How are they going to take control and stabalise? How while they create a good stable economy?
The same way mankind has done for centuries... learning from mistakes and eventually developing some 'cop-on', as we say in Ireland. Who held our hands back in prehistoric times when we were trying to get a handle on the whole 'civilisation' thing? Nobody... we figured it out for ourselves (unless Kubrick was right about the whole monolith thing). I know it's a simplistic analogy but think of a troublesome teenager who refuses to take responsibility for themselves, the more you baby him the longer he will continue to act irresponsibly. Eventually you have to cut the chord and force the teenager to stand on his own two feet.M.O.A.B wrote:
Whatever it is you think, they cannot do it themselves. Its a fact. Africa is for the most part like a giant Afghanistan, filled with tribes and rebel groups constantly fighting each other. Without outside help, Afghanistan would remain a shithole forever, as will most of Africa.Braddock wrote:
As someone who lives in a former colony I find that attitude extremely condescending. The Brits probably thought the same about us "savages". We're part of the problem as regards Africa (Protectionist trading policies, International debt, plundering their resources, cheap labour etc.), we can't expect to get up on our high horses and teach them how to "help themselves" while we're fucking them in the ass.M.O.A.B wrote:
They're only going to learn if somebody teaches them. Africa operates tribally for the most part and they have little grasp of running a country like everywhere else.
People like Mugabe. Former rebel leader who takes power, runs the country into and below the ground and yet still remains in his position because he controls the army. The people are not equipped to take him on directly and working politically bares few results in somewhere like Zimbabwe.
So you have to tell me, how will it work if they go it alone? How are they going to take control and stabalise? How while they create a good stable economy?
I've yet to see it happen in Africa. I really have, and they've had a good few years to make some progress.Braddock wrote:
The same way mankind has done for centuries... learning from mistakes and eventually developing some 'cop-on', as we say in Ireland. Who held our hands back in prehistoric times when we were trying to get a handle on the whole 'civilisation' thing? Nobody... we figured it out for ourselves (unless Kubrick was right about the whole monolith thing). I know it's a simplistic analogy but think of a troublesome teenager who refuses to take responsibility for themselves, the more you baby him the longer he will continue to act irresponsibly. Eventually you have to cut the chord and force the teenager to stand on his own two feet.M.O.A.B wrote:
Whatever it is you think, they cannot do it themselves. Its a fact. Africa is for the most part like a giant Afghanistan, filled with tribes and rebel groups constantly fighting each other. Without outside help, Afghanistan would remain a shithole forever, as will most of Africa.Braddock wrote:
As someone who lives in a former colony I find that attitude extremely condescending. The Brits probably thought the same about us "savages". We're part of the problem as regards Africa (Protectionist trading policies, International debt, plundering their resources, cheap labour etc.), we can't expect to get up on our high horses and teach them how to "help themselves" while we're fucking them in the ass.
So you have to tell me, how will it work if they go it alone? How are they going to take control and stabalise? How while they create a good stable economy?
hey wtf we were talking arsenal...