BF2S Forums Why Healthcare is already Socialized for the Uninsured

Turquoise wrote:

FEOS wrote:

Ghandi767 wrote:

No. Healthcare is not basically free. Its free until they realize you have no insurance, then anything beyond patching you up is unavailable. Have cancer? Go die in a hole. Arrythmia? Go into cardiac arrest near a fire station. The system is f*cked. And god forbid you have a preexisting condition, in which case you might as well shoot yourself in the face now.

Untrue. Hospitals are required to by law to treat emergent conditions when presented, regardless of insurance situations.

They are, but the extent to which they treat you is about the same as Ghandi said, if you have no insurance or no ability to pay.

It's honestly not much different under government-run healthcare. It's great if you're sick. It sucks balls if you're trying to keep from getting sick.

Flaming_Maniac wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

because sharing would be the norm.

I threw up a little.

I figured you would... 

Turquoise wrote:

Flaming_Maniac wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

because sharing would be the norm.

I threw up a little.

I figured you would... 

Turquoise is a washed up KGB agent physically bound to a wheelchair. He gets his kicks antagonizing all the good little American boys.

Turquoise wrote:

FEOS wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

They are, but the extent to which they treat you is about the same as Ghandi said, if you have no insurance or no ability to pay.

It's honestly not much different under government-run healthcare. It's great if you're sick. It sucks balls if you're trying to keep from getting sick.

Not the way French healthcare is run.  Preventive care is their primary focus.

This ain't France.

FEOS wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

FEOS wrote:

It's honestly not much different under government-run healthcare. It's great if you're sick. It sucks balls if you're trying to keep from getting sick.

Not the way French healthcare is run.  Preventive care is their primary focus.

This ain't France.

Are you suggesting our government isn't competent enough to accomplish what the French government has?

Macbeth wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

FEOS wrote:

This ain't France.

Are you suggesting our government isn't competent enough to accomplish what the French government has?

France doesn't have 12-20 million leeches who will go an Emergency room for a cold.

France actually has always had higher unemployment than us.  They probably have a higher percentage of people living off of the system as well.

That tends to happen when you are a more socialized country, so whether or not we will follow suit is unknown with universal care.

We do have some lazy fuckers (see the amount of welfare leeches in New Orleans), but I'm not sure if we have a higher proportion of lazy people than France.  We could though....

EDIT: In reference to illegals, France has a large portion of North African immigrants that mostly live off of the system, so I suppose that is comparable to our illegals in some respects.

Granted, our illegals tend to be harder workers than the North Africans in France.  Of course, that's partially because France keeps them isolated in shitty tenements.  There is arguably much more racism against North Africans in France than against Mexicans here.

Last edited by Turquoise (2009-08-11 16:33:30)

FEOS wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

FEOS wrote:

This ain't France.

Are you suggesting our government isn't competent enough to accomplish what the French government has?

To a degree. There is also the issue of scale. And the issue of basic cultural tendencies here vs. there.

With the way things are going, I think you may be right.

Well, I'll let you know how Toronto is, if I actually make my way up there via my company.

PureFodder wrote:

FEOS wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

Are you suggesting our government isn't competent enough to accomplish what the French government has?

To a degree. There is also the issue of scale. And the issue of basic cultural tendencies here vs. there.

The issue of scale is essentially an unknown. It's equally possible that the large scale of the US will make it easier and cheaper in the US. As far as I know the US military isn't falling to bits despite being far larger than any European force.

But the budget is crushing...due largely (no pun intended) to scale.

So has anyone worked out how much extra tax they would pay if the US set up an NHS-like system?

FEOS wrote:

PureFodder wrote:

FEOS wrote:

But the budget is crushing...due largely (no pun intended) to scale.

How is scale causing it exactly?

Size = more cost to field, sustain, etc.

There's only one truth to that I can see.  We do have a lot of land area to cover, and our population is more rural than those of more socialized countries, like Norway and France.

Still, when you figure in the fact that we have a better medical infrastructure than any other country in the world, I don't see how it would be that much more to administer to the needs of our people with socialization.  Bureaucratically speaking, it would be much cheaper.

Bertster7 wrote:

FEOS wrote:

PureFodder wrote:

How is scale causing it exactly?

Size = more cost to field, sustain, etc.

Another way of looking at it is size = greater purchasing power, lower costs for equipment/drugs.....

Pretty much, but free market types only look at economies of scale when it favors privatization.

Bertster7 wrote:

FEOS wrote:

PureFodder wrote:

How is scale causing it exactly?

Size = more cost to field, sustain, etc.

Another way of looking at it is size = greater purchasing power, lower costs for equipment/drugs.....

Even with economies of scale due to volume, the actual expenditure is still higher. And as has been pointed out before, the costs are not linear.