BF2S Forums When, OH When are E.A. Going to get rid of the DAMN claymores?

Wait isn't -fe.lep- the one who was saying that sniper class sucked in I haven't seen a good sniper thread???

Bellasadda wrote:

Most people who are defending the current status of the claymore are overstating peoples claims with the “why don't they just remove guns” line without actually defending the current status of the claymore. And the “Meat-shield + Medic solution” is clearly not how the designers planed for the players to deal with claymores. If you let other explosives like grenades, Rockets, or C4 destroy grenades, you would still be able to use claymores to cover your ass but you can't just throw them everywhere. The game would be a lot more interesting and tense if claymores where only effective if you they are well hidden. From a design perspective, thats a good thing.

You make a fair point, but i don't think the maps allow for this kind of tack. Bushes and long grass are great places for Clays, but more often than not it makes more sence to place it in the only entrance to a particular place (ie flag) and that results in them being left in the open. Also snipers are already limited to 2 active clays at a time aren't they?

What about if every class was capable of dis-arming (not just destroying) Clays, but took varying times over it - eg Engi's / Snipers faster than Assault or Support. That way you could get past them but also the Sniper could still hit you if he's still in the area - i like that idea.

Maybe if they made an active radius on the claymores. Meaning that the sniper has to be within so many meters close to it for the claymore to explode. Since their purpose is to cover the sniper back. Also, the claymore should deactivate when the sniper dies, not a minute later. That may help on the random dropping of clays.

ArMaG3dD0n wrote:

Wait isn't -fe.lep- the one who wrote this in another thread?

-fe.lep- wrote:

I am just trying to think ahead to see what's the next gun EA will nerf?

So far, The grenade launcher, creative C4 usage, and the PKM bites the dust because of "underpowered players" who are incapable of devising combat tactics to overcome these weapons.

I suppose I will get flamed by the usual, "um my stats link is missing" idiots that seem to run this game or the , "hey, I've played BF2 for 4 hours, I know everything!" squad, Who cares?

For my money, its going to be the G36E. I mean, hell, its accurate and powerful, can't have that, Whats next? removing the ability for medic's to heal themselves? I mean how lame are they, HA!

I was thinking, how about we just get rid of all the weapons? Give everyone the ability to kill using harsh language only. Ops forgot, not allowed "harsh language!"

just give everyone one of these.....

http://www.gasolinealleyantiques.com/im … 74-454.jpg

Now I could be an ass and say that this time you are the "underpowered player" who is incapable of devising combat tactics to overcome these weapons.
Well but regardless of that I have to say that you are actually RIGHT this time. Claymores need to be fixed! How can they be fixed?---Make them explode when they are hit by other explosives. It s ridiculous that you can NOT.....i repeat.....NOT capture the TV station flag at sharqi when there are claymores on both entrances. This is ridiculous. Making claymores destroyable would fix it or at least make things better.
Additionally one could think about reducing the blast radius and making claymores explode when teammates walk over them. This would reduce randomly placed claymores in highly populated areas and would limit claymores to self defence or to clever ambushes if the sniper is being chased by assault guys.

You underline my point even better than I could have, If you look @ my stats I had 70%+ accuracy with a grenade launcher, a number of C4 kills and 90 hours with a pkm, Those weapons imo impacted game play and for some were too much to handle but E.A. Stepped in to change them. I had no problem with any of them and in typical fashion adopted them to stay ahead of the rest and did so. BUT none of those weapons had the effect on the game claymores have. I will restate this again

When a team is pinned down on a room like the 2 palaces in warlord, it means they have been pushed there. All the other points taken from them by firepower. In the normal scheme of things the last flag would have been taken and the map would finish, The winners taking more points through superior skill. Now tho thats just not the case. The loosing team get trapped in the room, go support and sniper, make no real attempt to get out and this can go on for 10 minutes + These points are undeserved as they should have just lost their flag and the game finish early. The claymores are effecting the game in an unfair maner and need changed, especially as they are being used NOT in the spirit of the class or the way they were intended.

So, I used c4, PKM and grenade launcher effectively, I had no complaint about the weapons and was never on here moaning about them, a change in tactics and playing smart enabled a good player to contine to play and do well, SO, does that mean when I come out and say "this weapon is effecting gameplay, making one of my game purchases unplayable and it needs fixing" you take me more seriously or less?

Last edited by -fe.lep- (2006-03-31 02:05:58)

-fe.lep- wrote:

The loosing team get trapped in the room, go support and sniper, make no real attempt to get out and this can go on for 10 minutes + These points are undeserved as they should have just lost their flag and the game finish early. Its stats padding plain and simple.

Who are you to say these points are "undeserved" if you don't like them scoring points in this manner THINK before running into the Clays! They killed you, meaning that they got the better of you, therefore they deserve all the points they get.

Kontrolfreq wrote:

-fe.lep- wrote:

The loosing team get trapped in the room, go support and sniper, make no real attempt to get out and this can go on for 10 minutes + These points are undeserved as they should have just lost their flag and the game finish early. Its stats padding plain and simple.

Who are you to say these points are "undeserved" if you don't like them scoring points in this manner THINK before running into the Clays! They killed you, meaning that they got the better of you, therefore they deserve all the points they get.

PLEASE READ WHAT I HAVE TO SAY BEFORE AN OBVIOUS MISTAKE LIKE THIS.

The flags should have been taken, They cant be taken due to the claymores, without penalty to the attacking teams stats. ( a huge penalty ) That means as I have stated you cant "play to win" without this unfair penalty. If you can remove the PKM because it shot a little bit too far too accurately then Im damn sure these things need to be changed if I cant play to win. I didn't say I ran in like a lemming which is what u assumed. I said that the people in the room in the normal run of things are getting undeserved points. The game should have been over. The claymores need to be restricted to area's near ladders / objects snipers are sniping from or made diffusable by nades.

bingobones wrote:

-fe.lep- wrote:

When a team is pinned down on a room like the 2 palaces in warlord, it means they have been pushed there. All the other points taken from them by firepower. In the normal scheme of things the last flag would have been taken and the map would finish, The winners taking more points through superior skill. Now tho thats just not the case. The loosing team get trapped in the room, go support and sniper, make no real attempt to get out and this can go on for 10 minutes + These points are undeserved as they should have just lost their flag and the game finish early. The claymores are effecting the game in an unfair maner and need changed, especially as they are being used NOT in the spirit of the class or the way they were intended.

so go take the palace before the other flags if u dont like claymores.... then the final flags maybe the security palace, or mosque etc etc

ur just a whining noob felep, go away

A well thought out and incisive post, do you HEAR the sarcasm?

Kontrolfreq wrote:

If your ENTIRE team can't break through they clearly deserved to hold that CP.

exactly!  u just got owned by claymores and a well defended CP.

if you want felep im sure there are some private tutor lessons or books available for this....i think they are called: "Capturing the final flag for Dummies"

Kontrolfreq wrote:

Don't get me wrong i'm not out to berate you, I even agree that Clays should be destructable, by the right weapon. It's just that your argument seems to be based on the fact your team failed to take a flag due to heavy use of Claymores, and I see no problem with that. If your ENTIRE team can't break through they clearly deserved to hold that CP.

NOT if its with a weapon that is unable to be diffused, moved or in a position that it should not be able to be deployed in the first place. If they can't hold the point with normal weapons why should they be able to do it with a weapon that clearly has flaws in design for use on special forces maps. Palace being the best example as they simply cant be diffused.

However ,the nightflight example, every single point on the map holds the same problems on it that the palace does, this means not just one massacre of your team by claymores, but every single point they take will result in this. like I said in a previous post, I have seen 10 and more claymores sitting on points in nightflight making the game unplayable with any level of fairness as it requires team members to be used as minesweepers, Im not saying the points "cant" be taken but to do so would be a Pyrrhic victory. We are here to play the game to win are we not?

I think this point is a little muddled but its dinner time and Im about to go get a sandwich, I hope its clear enough what I mean, If not I will clarify it after I get some nosh

Ok, so i think we are (mostly) agreed that Clays need to be made destructable by other explosives. This would cure your problem would it not? I guess until then you'll have to make do with the old "human claymore ram" backed up by a medic.

I think that the idea of preventing them being dropped in certain locations is flawed though. Limiting them to eg the top of ladders (which i think you mentioned earlier) assumes that all snipers employ the same tactics.

I agree with you up to a point: some places are ludicrously easy to defend with claymores, and there is no way to "be careful" when coming round a corner. Either there is a claymore there, or there isn't.

Where I disagree is when you state how snipers should play (high up, sniping) and where they should be allowed to place their claymores (defending ladders). To enforce that style of play would be a counter-sniper's dream. Snipers on rooftops and in cranes and towers are conspicuous enough already.

Simple fix: turn FF for mines on again, make it the default server option.

Now won't that put a smile on players' faces?

JeSTeR_Player1 wrote:

Claymores have no down-side...not one, They can't be destroyed and the explode range is far to big.

In the past you could remove a Claymore with a Handgrenade, now you can't. Why not?

They need to put that back into the game.

There actually is a down-side,the backside that is!
If you just don't run like an idiot to the next flag to capture it and actually have a look first you will be able to capture flags even if there is a whole bunch of claymores around,just don't approach them from the front.
And btw,engineers can defuse them(but who wants to play the lame engineer? )....

And the handgrenade thing is just ridiculous,what is the point of laying mines when they can be removed so easily?Why don't make the claymores and AT-mines destructable by handgunfire?

All these complaints about unfair claymores are coming from people who obviously run around "danger zones" of maps without awareness of their surroundings,it's not the claymore's nor the sniper's fault if you are stupid enough to run into it.