Another US shooting, more people dead. Blah blah blah heard it all before. Totally over it and no longer really care. Just wondering when the US authorities are going to get serious on gun control.....
Yep, that would be nice, but general CCW permits won't happen as easily as giving CCW permits to those with greater risk who can get specialized training (something that will appease the antis). Here in California, you can get a CCW if you're a politician (because naturally, their lives are worth more), or if you have a genuine threat upon you..or if you have a line of work that requires risk of death. I'm guessing it's worse in Illinois. Everywhere I shop for firearm/accessories/ammo, there's always the bright red lettering "CANNOT SHIP TO DC, ILL, NY..etc"RAIMIUS wrote:
There are people willing to do that for free!...and they are generally well trained. They are called CCW holders.IRONCHEF wrote:
Anyway, my first choice is plainclothes armed guards.
See: New Life Church Shooting as an example.
Illinois once again proved how "safe" gun-control can make a society. There are no carry rights for average citizens. If you are an ex-DELTA/anti-terrorism guy, you would still have trouble getting PERMISSION from the "Great State of Illinois" to carry. So, good guys can't carry, but criminals still do. The least we could do is equalize the situation. Having both sides armed is a realistic and simple option. It certainly beats the status quo!
I don't know how much good CCW laws would have on school shootings, as most students are too young to get a permit. There is hope that older college students and teachers could stop such incidents. I know several students at my school who have CCW permits, but cannot carry on campus.
So yeah, prove there's a need for additional protection and that there's obvious risk (4 school shootings in 2 weeks!!), and violá...a worthy need for CCW. Then offer the CCW training and carry option, with increased pay and/or subsidy, for teachers wishing to arm themselves.
It's a good start.
wheres that pesky negative karma button..smartdude992 wrote:
thats because the rest are dead, lol, kidding, but really, i hope they're fineThomasMorgan wrote:
I know a bunch of people who go to school there. So far I've only been able to get in touch with one.
Someone please ban this asshole.
HAVE SOME RESPECT FOR THE DEAD! You wouldn't be making so many jokes if one of your friends was murdered on Thursday. Be decent enough to respect those who lost someone.
HAVE SOME RESPECT FOR THE DEAD! You wouldn't be making so many jokes if one of your friends was murdered on Thursday. Be decent enough to respect those who lost someone.
EDIT:
Ollie, keep your dumb ass comments out of this forum please.Ollie wrote:
(some stupid shit that got removed)
--For clarification.RAIMIUS' response to Ollie wrote:
Someone please ban this asshole.
HAVE SOME RESPECT FOR THE DEAD! You wouldn't be making so many jokes if one of your friends was murdered on Thursday. Be decent enough to respect those who lost someone.
Last edited by RoosterCantrell (2008-02-16 00:55:17)
Meh. Its not a surprise, yet I love how lots of Americans are shocked every time this happens.
"our guns are secured properly, how can this thing happen" - generic response to shooting
Clearly not securely enough.
"our guns are secured properly, how can this thing happen" - generic response to shooting
Clearly not securely enough.
Valentines day... I'm sure he was a virgin.
If the media didn't obsess over it so much, people might not get ideas in their head and it probably wouldn't happen as often.
QFT !iNeedUrFace4Soup wrote:
If the media didn't obsess over it so much, people might not get ideas in their head and it probably wouldn't happen as often.
Which will accomplish, when added to the standard police force employed by most medium to large univiersities, absolutely nothing.PureFodder wrote:
I was going for having a couple of armed security preople specifically for the school/college/university.
The police wouldn't let them go in. What's your point?Oh and in the Columbine incident the local populace, who presumably consisted of many armed people also did bugger all to help.
So let's keep everyone defenseless so the cops don't have to do as much work.Also the last thing the police want when responding to an emergency is lots of armed people all running around as they'll obviously have to disarm all of them before they can get around to determining which one is the criminal.
Give me a fuckin' break.
The ban button worked much better.eusgen wrote:
wheres that pesky negative karma button..smartdude992 wrote:
thats because the rest are dead, lol, kidding, but really, i hope they're fineThomasMorgan wrote:
I know a bunch of people who go to school there. So far I've only been able to get in touch with one.
Is it broken?ThomasMorgan wrote:
The ban button worked much better.eusgen wrote:
wheres that pesky negative karma button..smartdude992 wrote:
thats because the rest are dead, lol, kidding, but really, i hope they're fine
To your first point: Honestly, I think that we can lay a lot of the blame for the spree killings at the feet of CNN/FOX/NBC and their 24 hour news channels. If it bleeds, it leads. And they devote hours and hours of airtime to these events, which really are isolated incidents that really aren't of any consequence to the vast majority of the country (just like that stupid *rich white* girl that got killed or abducted somewhere in the Cariibean).B.Schuss wrote:
Still, I have one question that maybe some of the US guys here can answer. Where do you think those high numbers of school shootings come from ? I mean, this is the fourth or fifth shooting in a month or so. Wouldn't you agree that the high number of guns in circulation and the easy availability play a role here ?
I mean, we have our share of crazy teenagers in germany, too, but a lot less school shootings.
Someone here said that an armed society is a polite society. Personally, I find it ironic that one would think that adding more guns to an already violent society would help make that society less violent.
We glamorize them. We give them the attention they want and need. They want to be remembered, and we give them a glorious finale.
I think the news should be like baseball. When a fan gets on the field, cut to the talking heads who discuss stats, the weather, anything other than the dude on the field. Why do you think no one streaks the Superbowl, or the World Series, the same way they do the World Cup Championships?
If we deny them the one thing they want (fame), there's no point to it. And maybe, just maybe, they'd go back to hanging themselves, or shooting themselves, and leave us alone.
And I point out again that this shooting took place in a Gun Free Zone. Or, as I like to call it, a Government-Approved Slaughter Zone.
Hundreds of people running around with guns, which one's the gunman. Everyone running around, armed, afriad for their lives, seeing hundreds of other people running around armed. It's gonna be carnage.HollisHurlbut wrote:
Which will accomplish, when added to the standard police force employed by most medium to large univiersities, absolutely nothing.PureFodder wrote:
I was going for having a couple of armed security preople specifically for the school/college/university.The police wouldn't let them go in. What's your point?Oh and in the Columbine incident the local populace, who presumably consisted of many armed people also did bugger all to help.So let's keep everyone defenseless so the cops don't have to do as much work.Also the last thing the police want when responding to an emergency is lots of armed people all running around as they'll obviously have to disarm all of them before they can get around to determining which one is the criminal.
Give me a fuckin' break.
Why is it you thinks cops and security guards would be worse in this situation than random armed members of the public?
On a different note, if you look at many of the school shooting that have happened recently, it's fairly obvious that armed guards, armed teachers or armed civillians would have been able to do nothing about them anyway. In this case it sounds like the kid stood up infront of the class then started firing at them. The only way to prevent that is to remove his access to a firearm in the first place.
Probably the one not shooting at unarmed people. Just a guess.PureFodder wrote:
Hundreds of people running around with guns, which one's the gunman.
Except it DOESN'T HAPPEN IN THE REST OF THE CCW POPLUATION. What the hell makes you think it'll happen in one place, but not anywhere else?Everyone running around, armed, afriad for their lives, seeing hundreds of other people running around armed. It's gonna be carnage.
I don't. I have no idea why you made that up. My only assertion is the plain and simple FACT that the police cannot be omnipresent. All they can do is run to an incident, and even then they camp out for a long while trying to decide the best course of action.Why is it you thinks cops and security guards would be worse in this situation than random armed members of the public?
And this precludes the possibility of an armed individual stopping him from continuing his carnage how?On a different note, if you look at many of the school shooting that have happened recently, it's fairly obvious that armed guards, armed teachers or armed civillians would have been able to do nothing about them anyway. In this case it sounds like the kid stood up infront of the class then started firing at them.
If I thought gun-control would save 1 life, I would support it. I would rather not see anymore parents and friends grieving for a lost loved one. I wish I didn't have to go to a friend's funeral yesterday. Gun violence isn't pretty. It hurts and it's senseless, but the evidence points to more crimes being stopped or prevented with guns than crimes commited with them. To me, that indicates a "net-gain" to society by having legally armed citizens. It isn't perfect, but it's better than the alternative.