Spearhead
Gulf coast redneck hippy
+731|6700|Tampa Bay Florida
http://www.press.uchicago.edu/cgi-bin/h … 251757.ctl

“American success or failure in Iraq may well depend on whether the Iraqis like American soldiers or not.”

The U.S. military could certainly have used that bit of wisdom in 2003, as violence began to eclipse the Iraq War’s early successes. Ironically, had the Army only looked in its own archives, they would have found it—that piece of advice is from a manual the U.S. War Department handed out to American servicemen posted in Iraq back in 1943.

The advice in Instructions for American Servicemen in Iraq during World War II, presented here in a new facsimile edition, retains a surprising, even haunting, relevance in light of today’s muddled efforts to win Iraqi hearts and minds. Designed to help American soldiers understand and cope with what was at the time an utterly unfamiliar culture—the manual explains how to pronounce the word Iraq, for instance—this brief, accessible handbook  mixes do-and-don’t-style tips (“Always respect the Moslem women.” “Talk Arabic if you can to the people. No matter how badly you do it, they will like it.”) with general observations on Iraqi history and society. The book’s overall message still rings true—dramatically so—more than sixty years later: treat an Iraqi and his family with honor and respect, and you will have a strong ally; treat him with disrespect and you will create an unyielding enemy.

With a foreword by Lieutenant Colonel John A. Nagl reflecting on the manual’s continuing applicability—and lamenting that it was unknown at the start of the invasion—this new edition of Instructions for American Servicemen in Iraq will be essential reading for anyone who cares about the future of Iraq and the fate of the American soldiers serving there."

Might buy it, sounds pretty interesting.
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6782|PNW

There are servicemen in Iraq today who do treat Iraqis with unbridled kindness and respect. Unfortunately, there are others who just joined to shoot people, which is all well and fine, but an unproductive personality in a 'hearts & minds' campaign.

Last edited by unnamednewbie13 (2007-12-05 13:26:31)

Mekstizzle
WALKER
+3,611|6631|London, England
I dunno. Think about a book talking about how to treat an American in the 40's and in the 21st Century and you'll probably get beaten up if you follow the 40's code. Or simply dismissed as insane.

Then again, it's not like Iraq or the Middle East has progressed at all (socially) since the 7th Century so it probably would be relevant in todays Iraq.
Stingray24
Proud member of the vast right-wing conspiracy
+1,060|6455|The Land of Scott Walker
Violence is at all time lows in Iraq (hence it's absence in the news).  Perhaps this idea has been distributed?  Or perhaps the insurgency has suffered great enough losses that they can't project force like they used to?  Whatever the case, the military is not designed to be an effective police force.  If soldiers are trained in the Arabic languages, wonderful, they should use them. But to expect the whole military to function in that capacity is unrealistic imo.

Last edited by Stingray24 (2007-12-05 13:34:01)

Phrozenbot
Member
+632|6626|do not disturb

Stingray24 wrote:

Violence is at all time lows in Iraq (hence it's absence in the news).  Perhaps this idea has been distributed?  Or perhaps the insurgency has suffered great enough losses that they can't project force like they used to?  Whatever the case, the military is not designed to be an effective police force.  If soldiers are trained in the Arabic languages, wonderful, they should use them. But to expect the whole military to function in that capacity is unrealistic imo.
It shouldn't be the case, but this is the situation we are in and it never hurts to prepare for things like this. But one soldier who can get around in Arabic can help his/her platoon out a lot. One way of winning respect is being able to speak their language, something that is lacking amongst Iraqis.

Last edited by Phrozenbot (2007-12-06 05:35:44)

(T)eflon(S)hadow
R.I.P. Neda
+456|6839|Grapevine, TX

Dilbert_X wrote:

So if the US military had done a tiny bit of research, planning and training for the post invasion period they would have saved thousands of lives, billions of dollars and 5 years in the Iraqi quagmire?

Bunch of doofuses, nice work Rumsfeld.
You're statement reflects how ignorant you are. Just because you are against the US policy being in Iraq, helping the good citizens, we are glad to do it. You have the luxury of your opinion and to make less than intelligent statements; this goes to the OP, too.
It amazes me how you civilians, most in their teens, know what kind of training US Armed Forces receive. We receive extensive training before we depart and when we land, what the common customs, local laws and culture are.

Find a topic that has substance, then we can have a real debate.
TigerXtrm
Death by Indecency
+51|6378|Netherlands

Spearhead wrote:

http://www.press.uchicago.edu/cgi-bin/hfs.cgi/00/251757.ctl

“American success or failure in Iraq may well depend on whether the Iraqis like American soldiers or not.”

The U.S. military could certainly have used that bit of wisdom in 2003, as violence began to eclipse the Iraq War’s early successes. Ironically, had the Army only looked in its own archives, they would have found it—that piece of advice is from a manual the U.S. War Department handed out to American servicemen posted in Iraq back in 1943.

The advice in Instructions for American Servicemen in Iraq during World War II, presented here in a new facsimile edition, retains a surprising, even haunting, relevance in light of today’s muddled efforts to win Iraqi hearts and minds. Designed to help American soldiers understand and cope with what was at the time an utterly unfamiliar culture—the manual explains how to pronounce the word Iraq, for instance—this brief, accessible handbook  mixes do-and-don’t-style tips (“Always respect the Moslem women.” “Talk Arabic if you can to the people. No matter how badly you do it, they will like it.”) with general observations on Iraqi history and society. The book’s overall message still rings true—dramatically so—more than sixty years later: treat an Iraqi and his family with honor and respect, and you will have a strong ally; treat him with disrespect and you will create an unyielding enemy.

With a foreword by Lieutenant Colonel John A. Nagl reflecting on the manual’s continuing applicability—and lamenting that it was unknown at the start of the invasion—this new edition of Instructions for American Servicemen in Iraq will be essential reading for anyone who cares about the future of Iraq and the fate of the American soldiers serving there."

Might buy it, sounds pretty interesting.
Treating people with respect gets you friends instead of foes... that seems like 1 + 1 = 2 to me, I thought Americans were always shouting they weren't idiots?
Spearhead
Gulf coast redneck hippy
+731|6700|Tampa Bay Florida

(T)eflon(S)hadow wrote:

this goes to the OP, too.
Dude, those were not my words.  Thats why I've got them in quotes.  The reason I used that website is bc this manual was featured in my local paper many months ago and I never got around to posting here about it. 

I have no doubt that the vast majority of soldiers in Iraq do their best to be respectful to Iraqis.  But if you've got even 5 percent of soldiers who act like asswipes (and there are some that do) then the efforts of the rest of the pack are nullified.  And when soldiers have orders from their commanders telling them to barge into peoples houses, regardless of whether or not they want/need to, that's also going to cause some problems.

I might be joining the armed forces FYI.
Commie Killer
Member
+192|6397

(T)eflon(S)hadow wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

So if the US military had done a tiny bit of research, planning and training for the post invasion period they would have saved thousands of lives, billions of dollars and 5 years in the Iraqi quagmire?

Bunch of doofuses, nice work Rumsfeld.
You're statement reflects how ignorant you are. Just because you are against the US policy being in Iraq, helping the good citizens, we are glad to do it. You have the luxury of your opinion and to make less than intelligent statements; this goes to the OP, too.
It amazes me how you civilians, most in their teens, know what kind of training US Armed Forces receive. We receive extensive training before we depart and when we land, what the common customs, local laws and culture are.

Find a topic that has substance, then we can have a real debate.
Dont be mad at Spearhead, hes making some points, Dilbert on the other hand doesnt do much except make dumbass comments.
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6415|North Carolina

Mekstizzle wrote:

I dunno. Think about a book talking about how to treat an American in the 40's and in the 21st Century and you'll probably get beaten up if you follow the 40's code. Or simply dismissed as insane.

Then again, it's not like Iraq or the Middle East has progressed at all (socially) since the 7th Century so it probably would be relevant in todays Iraq.
To be honest, it's probably regressed.

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