xBlackPantherx
Grow up, or die
+142|6787|California

doublestuforeo wrote:

For some time now, I have noticed that Atheists in this forum (both conservative and liberal, BF2 and 2142 lovers, British, American, Peruvian, and Australian) have made a habit of suggesting that a certain action or policy is "right" or "wrong," or "good" or "bad." If you are an Atheist, I do not understand how you can logically believe in anything other than "moral relativism." In a world of "moral relativism," anything morality based is 100% opinion, and means exactly nothing in any sort of logical reality.  In "moral relativism" there is no "true" "good" or "bad." The only "truth" that is possibly graspable for Atheists is evolution; in which case, it is not only okay, but it is necessary that I kill you and rape your wife/girlfriend to pass on my more "powerful" seed.  I would guess that most of you aren't okay with that. What I am suggesting, is that I don't understand why you Atheists feel you have the right to state anything more definitive than "I personally wouldn't do that."   I don't believe you have the grounds to suggest something is actually "right" or "wrong." So, here is my question.  Do Atheists have the right to make moral judgements?  And if so, on what grounds?

xBlackPantherx wrote:

Are you saying that someone who is religious doest not base what they believe in on an opinion considering you can not prove your religion is right or even that All the religions are not one of the same just with different point of views (much like the Gossip Game)? On what grounds do the religious have to state what is right or what is wrong. ANYONE who states if something is right or wrong is asserting their opinion and there is no definite standard to the right and the wrong and the good and the bad.

doublestuforeo wrote:

In a world of "moral relativism," anything morality based is 100% opinion, and means exactly nothing in any sort of logical reality.  In "moral relativism" there is no "true" "good" or "bad." The only "truth" that is possibly graspable for Atheists is evolution; in which case, it is not only okay, but it is necessary that I kill you and rape your wife/girlfriend to pass on my more "powerful" seed.  I would guess that most of you aren't okay with that.

xBlackPantherx wrote:

You passing your "stronger" seed along is not evolution. Evolution is,

wikipedia wrote:

Natural selection, one of the processes that drives evolution, results from the difference in reproductive success between individuals in a population. If these traits increase the evolutionary fitness of the individuals that carry them, then those individuals will be more likely to survive and reproduce than other organisms in the population, thus passing more copies of those heritable traits on to the next generation. The corresponding decrease in fitness for deleterious traits results in their becoming rarer. In time, this can result in adaptation: the gradual accumulation of new traits (and the preservation of existing ones) that generally result in a population of organisms becoming better suited to its environment and ecological niche.

doublestuforeo wrote:

Of course natural selection is about passing on the best traits to your young... hence raping your girlfriend to pass on a more "powerful" seed, is basically saying "by killing you I am showing that I am more fit and will produce more desirable young." My original post was aggressive, because I was trying to take a strong position and start a good debate.  Unfortunatly everyone pissed their pants and cryed about how mean I am to Atheists. I will try to re-word my post in a nice way so that you might understand better what I was trying to debate. Without God, it is clear that morals are created by man.  As such, people and societies are all different.  To me this would have to suggest that, without an omnipotent being that declares what is right and wrong, morals must be relative to different individuals and societies.  As such, who are we to say that our version of morals is right? Do we have any grounds to truly say something is "right" or "wrong?"
I dont hate Atheists.  Most of my friends are Atheists, and I once was also.  However, I am starting to think that Atheists are the most insecure, whinny asses I have ever dealt with.
I guess my answer to all of this is...

Survival of the fittest doesn't mean the most physically fit as I'm sure you know. God was created by man, (some even say god was created by THE man to keep the people in-line, which makes very much sence if you research it) and if morals are based on opinions, and everyone has a right to their opinion and opinions are created by man, then man has EVERY right to say something is right or wrong.
You can not have absolute freedom, because at that point, one person's freedoms will become subject to the freedoms that which belong to another.
The point is that, that applies to morals as well. You can only judge something if it does not conflict with a higher law/freedom. Killing someone is wrong, or unmoral, because it violates natural law,

Wikipedia wrote:

Natural law is a law whose content is set by nature, and that therefore has validity everywhere.

Declaration of Independence wrote:

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of Happiness.
If something violates these natural laws then it is said to be unmoral. Since Natural law is also referred to as Laws of Nature,
whose content is set by nature, and that therefore has validity everywhere.
then that has a basis for morals that every human being, man woman or child, has grounds to base their morals upon.
One last quote

The Husband, by Dean Koontz wrote:

Rationalitly is always in a man's self-interest, therefore any act that is rational is right and good and admirable. Stealing, killing, and rape are merely irrational because they put he who commits them in jeopardy of his freedom.They are not evil. They are recovering-, or irredeemable - irrationalist, only that and nothing more. Although an irrational man should be met with compassion and therapy, an evil man was owed nothing more or less than resistance and retribution, the fury of a righteous justice.
ATG
Banned
+5,233|6973|Global Command
Why not address this in his thread?
xBlackPantherx
Grow up, or die
+142|6787|California

ATG wrote:

Why not address this in his thread?
To many posts. Would have been obscured and this is the only way I could have gotten it settled. But please, discuss and debate. I would love to hear a rebutal to anything a I missed or something of the liking.
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7045|132 and Bush

A) He is Banned
B) Mods do not enjoy retaliation threads.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Scorpion0x17
can detect anyone's visible post count...
+691|7210|Cambridge (UK)
xBlackPantherx - d'u often have problems when crossing bridges?
Ender2309
has joined the GOP
+470|7015|USA

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

xBlackPantherx - d'u often have problems when crossing bridges?
ouch?
xBlackPantherx
Grow up, or die
+142|6787|California

Kmarion wrote:

A) He is Banned
B) Mods do not enjoy retaliation threads.
Yea. saw hes banned and this is no retaliation thread.

Ender2309 wrote:

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

xBlackPantherx - d'u often have problems when crossing bridges?
ouch?
Was that meant to be a burn? Cause I didn't get it.
Scorpion0x17
can detect anyone's visible post count...
+691|7210|Cambridge (UK)

xBlackPantherx wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

A) He is Banned
B) Mods do not enjoy retaliation threads.
Yea. saw hes banned and this is no retaliation thread.

Ender2309 wrote:

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

xBlackPantherx - d'u often have problems when crossing bridges?
ouch?
Was that meant to be a burn? Cause I didn't get it.
doublestuforeo is/was a troll... trolls live under bridges... (so, I wasn't attacking you as such, more saying "let it drop, he's not worth it")

Last edited by Scorpion0x17 (2007-04-05 22:01:11)

Deadmonkiefart
Floccinaucinihilipilificator
+177|7150

xBlackPantherx wrote:

ATG wrote:

Why not address this in his thread?
To many posts. Would have been obscured and this is the only way I could have gotten it settled. But please, discuss and debate. I would love to hear a rebutal to anything a I missed or something of the liking.

Last edited by Deadmonkiefart (2007-04-05 22:01:29)

xBlackPantherx
Grow up, or die
+142|6787|California

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

xBlackPantherx wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

A) He is Banned
B) Mods do not enjoy retaliation threads.
Yea. saw hes banned and this is no retaliation thread.

Ender2309 wrote:


ouch?
Was that meant to be a burn? Cause I didn't get it.
doublestuforeo is/was a troll... trolls live under bridges... (so, I wasn't attacking you as such, more saying "let it drop, he's not worth it")
To much logic to work through. I havn't heard why he was banned though. This isn't for him. It's for everyone that doesn't get it.
chittydog
less busy
+586|7279|Kubra, Damn it!

Kmarion wrote:

A) He is Banned
B) Mods do not enjoy retaliation threads.
No problem. In case you didn't notice, this is a realtion thread, not a retaliation thread.
chittydog
less busy
+586|7279|Kubra, Damn it!

xBlackPantherx wrote:

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

xBlackPantherx wrote:


Yea. saw hes banned and this is no retaliation thread.


Was that meant to be a burn? Cause I didn't get it.
doublestuforeo is/was a troll... trolls live under bridges... (so, I wasn't attacking you as such, more saying "let it drop, he's not worth it")
To much logic to work through. I havn't heard why he was banned though. This isn't for him. It's for everyone that doesn't get it.
He was banned for having multiple accounts, I believe. He was also weamo8 (and I suspect he was also righthandedfork).
Scorpion0x17
can detect anyone's visible post count...
+691|7210|Cambridge (UK)

xBlackPantherx wrote:

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

xBlackPantherx wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

A) He is Banned
B) Mods do not enjoy retaliation threads.
Yea. saw hes banned and this is no retaliation thread.


Was that meant to be a burn? Cause I didn't get it.
doublestuforeo is/was a troll... trolls live under bridges... (so, I wasn't attacking you as such, more saying "let it drop, he's not worth it")
To much logic to work through. I havn't heard why he was banned though. This isn't for him. It's for everyone that doesn't get it.
He was banned 'cos he was a duplicate account made by weamo8.

And I still say let it drop. The whole discussion is going nowhere.
Scorpion0x17
can detect anyone's visible post count...
+691|7210|Cambridge (UK)

chittydog wrote:

(and I suspect he was also righthandedfork).
I got that impression too.
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7045|132 and Bush

chittydog wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

A) He is Banned
B) Mods do not enjoy retaliation threads.
No problem. In case you didn't notice, this is a realtion thread, not a retaliation thread.
I see no other reason than that. The forums are already getting cloudy with repetitive Atheists/Creation topics. If people posted their opinions in the appropriate threads we wouldn't have so many repeats. It's been really bad lately. If you want to engage in a specific topic you have about three to pick from now.

Last edited by Kmarion (2007-04-05 22:18:39)

Xbone Stormsurgezz
Flaming_Maniac
prince of insufficient light
+2,490|7151|67.222.138.85

Kmarion wrote:

chittydog wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

A) He is Banned
B) Mods do not enjoy retaliation threads.
No problem. In case you didn't notice, this is a realtion thread, not a retaliation thread.
I see no other reason than that. The forums are already getting cloudy with repetitive Atheists/Creation topics. If people posted their opinions in the appropriate threads we wouldn't have so many repeats. It's been really bad lately. If you want to engage in a specific topic you have about three to pick from now.
srsly

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