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2006-09-07 17:08:55
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6555

BBC wrote:

Mr Bush said the CIA had used an "alternative set of procedures", agreed with the justice department, once suspects had stopped talking.
Maybe Al Qaeda are using "an alternative set of procedures" in Iraq and Afghanistan. LOL. This'll be the new bullshit phrase to try and water down torture by 'allied nations'. Previous bullshit phrases used to alter the meaning/gravity of a term or water it down include:
- Negative Patient Output: in other words - deaths - used during the Vietnam war
- Homicide bomber: OMG we better catch the guy who did it!!! Oh wait a second - he's dead... LOL
- Regime Change: often equates to 'screw their democratic choice, we don't like it' - used in Palestine (Hamas), Iran and Venezuela
- Rendition: Illegal transporting of prisoners, WTF does rendition mean to anyone?
- Terrorists: Anyone oppposed to the will of another more powerful force or political entity
I'll add more as I think of them...
2006-09-07 17:09:37
13rin
Member
+977|6479

CameronPoe wrote:

France & Germany have been against the US all along? Maybe that's why the US military ferry soldiers towards the middle east through the two countries with the consent of said countries. Are you saying that JUST BECAUSE France and Germany decided not to support the war on Iraq for retrospectively completely legitimate reasons (although at the time France did have ulterior motives) that they are now no longer US allies? Gimme a break. The US violated the sovereignty of Poland for fuck sake: they SENT troops to Iraq.

PS Muslims have infinitely more respect for Europe than they do for USA, that's for sure.

PPS To legitimise inhumane behaviour you constantly call upon horrific graphic images of the debauchery of the terrorists: that doesn't make your behaviour any more respectable.
1. Yea.  I've been to France and they hate Americans.  Every time America tries to do anything France is there attempting to undermind.  Germany was reight there with it.  Again Russia /Iraq...Oil for night visions/AK's/RPG's ..  Those were used to kill US soldiers.   

2.  Great.  Maybe they'll kill you last then.

3.  I call upon those images to remind other readers that the people who you continually defend and attempt to justify their actions are the same ones that actually DID these things to my country men.  Sorry if you don't think that makes my or the US behaviour more respectable but, we did nothing and more of my counrtymen died.
I stood in line for four hours. They better give me a Wal-Mart gift card, or something.  - Rodney Booker, Job Fair attendee.
2006-09-07 17:11:55
Poseidon
Fudgepack DeQueef
+3,253|6538|Long Island, New York
This isn't like the Nazi party, if you're referring to it IG-Calibre. These people actually committed crimes and were trying to attack us (Well, so we think ).
2006-09-07 17:18:31
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6555

DBBrinson1 wrote:

1. Yea.  I've been to France and they hate Americans.  Every time America tries to do anything France is there attempting to undermind.  Germany was reight there with it.  Again Russia /Iraq...Oil for night visions/AK's/RPG's ..  Those were used to kill US soldiers.   

2.  Great.  Maybe they'll kill you last then.

3.  I call upon those images to remind other readers that the people who you continually defend and attempt to justify their actions are the same ones that actually DID these things to my country men.  Sorry if you don't think that makes my or the US behaviour more respectable but, we did nothing and more of my counrtymen died.
1. I think you'll find that governments very rarely represent the true will of the people. Money usually overrides everything. If there is something from which both France and USA can profit from through alliance they do so. France is an arrogant self-sufficient little country and that probably riles you Americans. Get over it. They had their decision, you had yours on the Iraq issues. On a GREAT MANY other issues they cooperate and are in complete agreement. International relations are not based solely around ONE issue. Sheesh. Same goes for Germany. BTW, are you disgruntled that these countries chose to do otherwise with respect to Iraq when it was their right to do so? That's not very democratic.

2. Well they didn't kill me when I was in Palestine, Jordan or Morocco and they probably won't kill me when I'm in Istanbul at the end of October. Maybe they mistake my red hair and pale skin for that of a typical muslim. LOL. I got the warmest of welcomes from all Arabs. Did you know that in Tehran they have a street named after Bobby Sands, the Irish Republican hunger striker?

3. Newsflash: nobody is defending true terrorists. People are defending due process and the concept: Innocent Until Proven Guilty. Maybe that isn't part of your vision for a just and moral America.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2006-09-07 17:20:57)

2006-09-07 17:20:30
sergeriver
Cowboy from Hell
+1,928|6757|Argentina

DBBrinson1 wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:

France & Germany have been against the US all along? Maybe that's why the US military ferry soldiers towards the middle east through the two countries with the consent of said countries. Are you saying that JUST BECAUSE France and Germany decided not to support the war on Iraq for retrospectively completely legitimate reasons (although at the time France did have ulterior motives) that they are now no longer US allies? Gimme a break. The US violated the sovereignty of Poland for fuck sake: they SENT troops to Iraq.

PS Muslims have infinitely more respect for Europe than they do for USA, that's for sure.

PPS To legitimise inhumane behaviour you constantly call upon horrific graphic images of the debauchery of the terrorists: that doesn't make your behaviour any more respectable.
1. Yea.  I've been to France and they hate Americans.  Every time America tries to do anything France is there attempting to undermind.  Germany was reight there with it.  Again Russia /Iraq...Oil for night visions/AK's/RPG's ..  Those were used to kill US soldiers.   

2.  Great.  Maybe they'll kill you last then.

3.  I call upon those images to remind other readers that the people who you continually defend and attempt to justify their actions are the same ones that actually DID these things to my country men.  Sorry if you don't think that makes my or the US behaviour more respectable but, we did nothing and more of my counrtymen died.
Those things were done by bad foreign policies taken by US government.  Don't blame the terrorists.  If you point a guy with your gun and his standing between you and a cliff, he won't jump, he will try to kill you.
2006-09-07 17:39:24
13rin
Member
+977|6479

IG-Calibre wrote:

Really? I hope some day you aren't torn away from your family and held in some prison under god only knows what circumstances, or treated in a manner where you are in constant fear of losing your life, while you are tortured (humanely - see American definition of torture lmao) with no contact with the outside world.   you would wake each day with a song in your heart and a smile on your lips grateful that you a "potential mass murder" (cause a CIA man said so thats good enough to merit it) are being kept from doing any harm
JAH REELY.  I do trust my government.  I can't write any more here.  Ain't gonna happen to me, not sure about you though. J/K HA!
I stood in line for four hours. They better give me a Wal-Mart gift card, or something.  - Rodney Booker, Job Fair attendee.
2006-09-07 18:00:42
13rin
Member
+977|6479

CameronPoe wrote:

1. I think you'll find that governments very rarely represent the true will of the people. Money usually overrides everything. If there is something from which both France and USA can profit from through alliance they do so. France is an arrogant self-sufficient little country and that probably riles you Americans. Get over it. They had their decision, you had yours on the Iraq issues. On a GREAT MANY other issues they cooperate and are in complete agreement. International relations are not based solely around ONE issue. Sheesh. Same goes for Germany. BTW, are you disgruntled that these countries chose to do otherwise with respect to Iraq when it was their right to do so? That's not very democratic.

2. Well they didn't kill me when I was in Palestine, Jordan or Morocco and they probably won't kill me when I'm in Istanbul at the end of October. Maybe they mistake my red hair and pale skin for that of a typical muslim. LOL. I got the warmest of welcomes from all Arabs. Did you know that in Tehran they have a street named after Bobby Sands, the Irish Republican hunger striker?

3. Newsflash: nobody is defending true terrorists. People are defending due process and the concept: Innocent Until Proven Guilty. Maybe that isn't part of your vision for a just and moral America.
I must admit that I do enjoy conversing with you man...

1.  No.  I tried to like France.  I really did.  I even did my best to learn the language.  Maybe it is their arrogance at which I am so disgusted.  Maybe it was the paper tray liners in the Subway restaurants depicting hamburgers crashing into the twin towers... Maybe them opposing the Iraq war was the last straw for me.  I wonder how fast they would have been calling Bush if it was the Eiffel tower that got taken out...  Also it is their right to refuse/protest the Iraq war.  I think they are nuts though.  I guess they thought Saddam was so great.  Maybe your right those countries protesing the war were in bed with Saddam (your money ally theory).

2.  I think its great that you can go to those countries without fear.  I'm sure there is a lot of cool stuff to see there.  However I doubt you are a muslim.  Right now muslim extremists are killing other muslims.  As a non-muslim -Why do you think that your people are exempt from them?

3.  I do believe that there is an innocent until proven guilty, for those that are US citizens and those that have adopted a constitution like our own.  I could care less about a extremist that wants you and me dead and I doubt other extremists have show that same courteousy to the US people.  Hell, they never have in the past.

If this is too off topic, just pm me with a response.
I stood in line for four hours. They better give me a Wal-Mart gift card, or something.  - Rodney Booker, Job Fair attendee.
2006-09-07 18:04:18
13rin
Member
+977|6479

CameronPoe wrote:

BBC wrote:

Mr Bush said the CIA had used an "alternative set of procedures", agreed with the justice department, once suspects had stopped talking.
Maybe Al Qaeda are using "an alternative set of procedures" in Iraq and Afghanistan. LOL. This'll be the new bullshit phrase to try and water down torture by 'allied nations'. Previous bullshit phrases used to alter the meaning/gravity of a term or water it down include:
- Negative Patient Output: in other words - deaths - used during the Vietnam war
- Homicide bomber: OMG we better catch the guy who did it!!! Oh wait a second - he's dead... LOL
- Regime Change: often equates to 'screw their democratic choice, we don't like it' - used in Palestine (Hamas), Iran and Venezuela
- Rendition: Illegal transporting of prisoners, WTF does rendition mean to anyone?
- Terrorists: Anyone oppposed to the will of another more powerful force or political entity
I'll add more as I think of them...
Throw some in from Baghdad bob and Saddam too!  And some from that crazy bastad' running Iraq please Mr. Fair and Balanced. 
Cool pic though.
I stood in line for four hours. They better give me a Wal-Mart gift card, or something.  - Rodney Booker, Job Fair attendee.
2006-09-07 18:40:49
deeznutz1245
Connecticut: our chimps are stealin yo' faces.
+483|6493|Connecticut

aardfrith wrote:

deeznutz1245 wrote:

I fought for in the US Marines (hhhmmmmm I wonder if you ever did?) and I will exercise it freely. What I did do is openly applaud those who keep us safe every day and approve of their methods no matter the cost. Terrorists being secretly tortured will never hinder our liberties, just theirs, and I am ok with that. And seing how these acts are not being committed on U.S. soil, and are being performed by men who are not members of our armed forces then it is not illegal. People ( like you) forget that CIA, NSA, and FBI are not uniformed members of the armed forces, therefore any act they commit cannot and will not be considered an act of war. Watch Munich....they are paid by the box. So to conclude, fuck terrorists and fuck you for sympathizing for them. You may not have said it but this is war, your with us or them.
So you're happy shipping your fellow soldiers home in boxes because your Commander-in-Chief lied to your government and people about the need to go to war in Iraq?  Your brothers and sisters in the military are dying because you went in to fight a war under false pretences and you're applauding the President for it?

Give me strength.
You have a valid point, but not to anything I said . I said nothing about the war in Iraq or the soldiers and sailors coming home in boxes. I talked about our under cover operatives who operate without our knowledge. They are not armed forces members so what the hell are you talking about. If you want to tell me you hate the war, then I agree  with you. But if you if you are bitching like a little girl about you not knowing the CIA's every move then save your breath, I think your an asshole. Pick a side and read my fucking post in full before you critizize me like the typical liberal you are. Theres your fucking strength.
Malloy must go
2006-09-07 18:58:58
deeznutz1245
Connecticut: our chimps are stealin yo' faces.
+483|6493|Connecticut

oug wrote:

deeznutz1245 wrote:

Listen, things happen every day that we never know about. We don't want to know them. I like it that way. If they are keeping us safe by torturing disgusting, civilian killing terrorists then I am ok with that. I am pretty sure that if the terrorists were not being terrorists then they would not be in their current torture prediciment. The CIA are the guys out there doing things in the shadows that allow us to sleep safe EVERY night and I wont be a faggy little baby and complain about them......I applaud them.
You are sure the prisoners are guilty simply because they are prisoners. That is very nice.

The only way you and all those who think like you will ever learn is if you were to become targets.

Oh how I will laugh with the sheer irony of retribution when you will be crying out about your innocence and everyone will be like: Wtf? He's in there so he must be guilty. The CIA people can't be wrong!

All totalitarian regimes rely on their peoples' ignorance and naivete. That is you.
I was an infantry Marine for 4 years. I have a Purple Heart and a Combat Action ribbon. I know what it is like to be a target, do you? I didnt think so. Dont you dare sit there behind your monitor and keyboard and criticize me and all the others who fought for your right to do so like your some kind of prophet. The only way YOU will ever learn is if YOU become a target. Maybe then you might have a fucking clue.
Malloy must go
2006-09-07 19:05:38
jonsimon
Member
+224|6495

deeznutz1245 wrote:

oug wrote:

deeznutz1245 wrote:

Listen, things happen every day that we never know about. We don't want to know them. I like it that way. If they are keeping us safe by torturing disgusting, civilian killing terrorists then I am ok with that. I am pretty sure that if the terrorists were not being terrorists then they would not be in their current torture prediciment. The CIA are the guys out there doing things in the shadows that allow us to sleep safe EVERY night and I wont be a faggy little baby and complain about them......I applaud them.
You are sure the prisoners are guilty simply because they are prisoners. That is very nice.

The only way you and all those who think like you will ever learn is if you were to become targets.

Oh how I will laugh with the sheer irony of retribution when you will be crying out about your innocence and everyone will be like: Wtf? He's in there so he must be guilty. The CIA people can't be wrong!

All totalitarian regimes rely on their peoples' ignorance and naivete. That is you.
I was an infantry Marine for 4 years. I have a Purple Heart and a Combat Action ribbon. I know what it is like to be a target, do you? I didnt think so. Dont you dare sit there behind your monitor and keyboard and criticize me and all the others who fought for your right to do so like your some kind of prophet. The only way YOU will ever learn is if YOU become a target. Maybe then you might have a fucking clue.
If you fought for our right to criticize you, we would be disrespecting you not to.
2006-09-07 19:14:24
deeznutz1245
Connecticut: our chimps are stealin yo' faces.
+483|6493|Connecticut

jonsimon wrote:

deeznutz1245 wrote:

oug wrote:


You are sure the prisoners are guilty simply because they are prisoners. That is very nice.

The only way you and all those who think like you will ever learn is if you were to become targets.

Oh how I will laugh with the sheer irony of retribution when you will be crying out about your innocence and everyone will be like: Wtf? He's in there so he must be guilty. The CIA people can't be wrong!

All totalitarian regimes rely on their peoples' ignorance and naivete. That is you.
I was an infantry Marine for 4 years. I have a Purple Heart and a Combat Action ribbon. I know what it is like to be a target, do you? I didnt think so. Dont you dare sit there behind your monitor and keyboard and criticize me and all the others who fought for your right to do so like your some kind of prophet. The only way YOU will ever learn is if YOU become a target. Maybe then you might have a fucking clue.
If you fought for our right to criticize you, we would be disrespecting you not to.
You are right, sort of. Criticize my beliefs freely but do not tell me HOW I feel like the previous post did. That man does not know where I have or have not been and it is just plain disrespectful to tell a Vetran he has no clue about being a "Target". I respect your point though.
Malloy must go
2006-09-07 22:10:22
(T)eflon(S)hadow
R.I.P. Neda
+456|6829|Grapevine, TX

aardfrith wrote:

(T)eflon(S)hadow wrote:

sergeriver wrote:

He lied before, impeach him.  This is worse than someone getting a blow job.
Lied about what? Secret Prisons? WMD?  GET OVER THIS OLD, SMALL-MINDED THINKING!
We have this little thing, we hold on a very special pedestal. It's called National Security. Ever heard of it?

Clinton was waiting and waiting to hook up with his young intern, missing multiple occasions, when the CIA had him (OBL) in their sights to take him out. For the definition of intelligence, please stop comparing President Bush to President Clinton. Especially if you aren't American. *Pft* My God.
Well, he's lied about torture, he's lied about the secret prisons, he's lied about the reasons for invading Iraq.  What else would you like him to lie about?
You clearly do not have the mental capacity to speak your mind here.
2006-09-07 23:01:11
cpt.fass1
The Cap'n Can Make it Hap'n
+329|6696|NJ

DBBrinson1 wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:

France & Germany have been against the US all along? Maybe that's why the US military ferry soldiers towards the middle east through the two countries with the consent of said countries. Are you saying that JUST BECAUSE France and Germany decided not to support the war on Iraq for retrospectively completely legitimate reasons (although at the time France did have ulterior motives) that they are now no longer US allies? Gimme a break. The US violated the sovereignty of Poland for fuck sake: they SENT troops to Iraq.

PS Muslims have infinitely more respect for Europe than they do for USA, that's for sure.

PPS To legitimise inhumane behaviour you constantly call upon horrific graphic images of the debauchery of the terrorists: that doesn't make your behaviour any more respectable.
1. Yea.  I've been to France and they hate Americans.  Every time America tries to do anything France is there attempting to undermind.  Germany was reight there with it.  Again Russia /Iraq...Oil for night visions/AK's/RPG's ..  Those were used to kill US soldiers.   

2.  Great.  Maybe they'll kill you last then.

3.  I call upon those images to remind other readers that the people who you continually defend and attempt to justify their actions are the same ones that actually DID these things to my country men.  Sorry if you don't think that makes my or the US behaviour more respectable but, we did nothing and more of my counrtymen died.
1. the french hate everyone and that's why the rest of the world makes fun of them... Also the french have a muslim immagration problem, do you not remember the 3 weeks of rioting so they have their reason for not backing us and I don't blame them. Not sure about Germany thou

2. CameronPoe, I can't belive you made a blanket statement like that, it's not Musliems it's their extermist, In the USA we do have a large Muslim population and they are very docile(meaning there is no trouble, and they could cause it) I don't agree on the killing you last either and don't know the innitial context but I can't belvie I read that.
3. Did what things to your countrymen I'm terrible sorry I didn't see the images and am totally lost right now. But if evading Iraq was the right thing to do, you need to go down to NO and put in some volenter work because they are living and need more help then the victoms of 9/11
2006-09-07 23:08:48
cpt.fass1
The Cap'n Can Make it Hap'n
+329|6696|NJ

deeznutz1245 wrote:

jonsimon wrote:

deeznutz1245 wrote:


I was an infantry Marine for 4 years. I have a Purple Heart and a Combat Action ribbon. I know what it is like to be a target, do you? I didnt think so. Dont you dare sit there behind your monitor and keyboard and criticize me and all the others who fought for your right to do so like your some kind of prophet. The only way YOU will ever learn is if YOU become a target. Maybe then you might have a fucking clue.
If you fought for our right to criticize you, we would be disrespecting you not to.
You are right, sort of. Criticize my beliefs freely but do not tell me HOW I feel like the previous post did. That man does not know where I have or have not been and it is just plain disrespectful to tell a Vetran he has no clue about being a "Target". I respect your point though.
Well you were over there fighting bravely for our Freedoms. Right now are you so blind to see that our freedoms are being taken away slowely every day, and they are. Why do you think illegal alliens are being pushed right now it's to make a federal ID which has already been passed(I'll get the link later). Are you ready to fight for what this country is founded on if our current government goes to far? And belive me Secret prisions is already going to far..
2006-09-07 23:10:20
cpt.fass1
The Cap'n Can Make it Hap'n
+329|6696|NJ

(T)eflon(S)hadow wrote:

aardfrith wrote:

(T)eflon(S)hadow wrote:


Lied about what? Secret Prisons? WMD?  GET OVER THIS OLD, SMALL-MINDED THINKING!
We have this little thing, we hold on a very special pedestal. It's called National Security. Ever heard of it?

Clinton was waiting and waiting to hook up with his young intern, missing multiple occasions, when the CIA had him (OBL) in their sights to take him out. For the definition of intelligence, please stop comparing President Bush to President Clinton. Especially if you aren't American. *Pft* My God.
Well, he's lied about torture, he's lied about the secret prisons, he's lied about the reasons for invading Iraq.  What else would you like him to lie about?
You clearly do not have the mental capacity to speak your mind here.
Yes he lied about WMD, and Secret prisions, and the reasons to invade Iraq.. These are all reason that the current Administration is threating our NATION SECURITY..
2006-09-08 02:16:14
oug
Calmer than you are.
+380|6519|Πάϊ

deeznutz1245 wrote:

oug wrote:

deeznutz1245 wrote:

Listen, things happen every day that we never know about. We don't want to know them. I like it that way. If they are keeping us safe by torturing disgusting, civilian killing terrorists then I am ok with that. I am pretty sure that if the terrorists were not being terrorists then they would not be in their current torture prediciment. The CIA are the guys out there doing things in the shadows that allow us to sleep safe EVERY night and I wont be a faggy little baby and complain about them......I applaud them.
You are sure the prisoners are guilty simply because they are prisoners. That is very nice.

The only way you and all those who think like you will ever learn is if you were to become targets.

Oh how I will laugh with the sheer irony of retribution when you will be crying out about your innocence and everyone will be like: Wtf? He's in there so he must be guilty. The CIA people can't be wrong!

All totalitarian regimes rely on their peoples' ignorance and naivete. That is you.
I was an infantry Marine for 4 years. I have a Purple Heart and a Combat Action ribbon. I know what it is like to be a target, do you? I didnt think so. Dont you dare sit there behind your monitor and keyboard and criticize me and all the others who fought for your right to do so like your some kind of prophet. The only way YOU will ever learn is if YOU become a target. Maybe then you might have a fucking clue.
Have you any idea what you fought for? It certainly wasn't defence! You were the aggressor and that is the reason why your country became #1 target. I on the other hand certainly am no aggressor and neither is France like someone said before. The Eiffel tower hasn't been shot down simply because France has not invaded other countries! If they do, rest asured they will be targeted as well.

And don't you dare lecture me simply because you have a purple heart and a goddamn action ribbon. Because I at least have the brains NOT to become a target.
ƒ³
2006-09-08 03:32:53
<[onex]>Headstone
Member
+102|6702|New York
If it wasnt for these SECRET prisons, we wouldnt have gotten the TOP 14 Terrrorists in the world OFF THE STREETS. Do you really think, with the red cross, the humanitarian groups and the likes watching Gitmo like hawks we or ANY other country(yes others were involved) would have foiled ANY of the terror plots that were foiled? Hell no! Christ people, France has gone as far as to say yesterday that theres no such thing as a war on terror(when most of the world KNOWS that Most of the radicals have moved into France and its suberbs). WTf is that shit about? When this WAR is brought to there doorstep, I hope the rest of the free world Pats them on the back and says"welp we told ya so".

PS. OUG  Your and Idiot.  Why dont you just Bury yourself ass up so i have a place to park my bike. Thanks.
2006-09-08 05:51:15
aardfrith
Δ > x > ¥
+145|6792

deeznutz1245 wrote:

aardfrith wrote:

deeznutz1245 wrote:

I fought for in the US Marines (hhhmmmmm I wonder if you ever did?) and I will exercise it freely. What I did do is openly applaud those who keep us safe every day and approve of their methods no matter the cost. Terrorists being secretly tortured will never hinder our liberties, just theirs, and I am ok with that. And seing how these acts are not being committed on U.S. soil, and are being performed by men who are not members of our armed forces then it is not illegal. People ( like you) forget that CIA, NSA, and FBI are not uniformed members of the armed forces, therefore any act they commit cannot and will not be considered an act of war. Watch Munich....they are paid by the box. So to conclude, fuck terrorists and fuck you for sympathizing for them. You may not have said it but this is war, your with us or them.
So you're happy shipping your fellow soldiers home in boxes because your Commander-in-Chief lied to your government and people about the need to go to war in Iraq?  Your brothers and sisters in the military are dying because you went in to fight a war under false pretences and you're applauding the President for it?

Give me strength.
You have a valid point, but not to anything I said . I said nothing about the war in Iraq or the soldiers and sailors coming home in boxes. I talked about our under cover operatives who operate without our knowledge. They are not armed forces members so what the hell are you talking about. If you want to tell me you hate the war, then I agree  with you. But if you if you are bitching like a little girl about you not knowing the CIA's every move then save your breath, I think your an asshole. Pick a side and read my fucking post in full before you critizize me like the typical liberal you are. Theres your fucking strength.
Okay, I shall address the specific points about the CIA etc., instead of the fact that you served in the US Marines and "applaud those [e.g. the President, by implication] who keep us safe every day and approve of their methods no matter what the cost [e.g. lives of soldiers]".

You say that the CIA etc. are not uniformed soldiers and so nothing that they do can be considered an act of war.  Yet after civilians hijacked aircraft and flew them into buildings, didn't President Bush say it was an act of warfare?

As for name calling, don't do it.  It's not big and it's not clever.  "Pick a side"?  Haven't I done that already, haven't you called me an asshole for the side I've so obviously picked?
2006-09-08 05:55:00
Horseman 77
Banned
+160|6837
no wonder we are winning, someone takes war seriously it seems, a refreshing change from the masturbation strategy
2006-09-08 06:05:58
aardfrith
Δ > x > ¥
+145|6792

Horseman 77 wrote:

no wonder we are winning, someone takes war seriously it seems, a refreshing change from the masturbation strategy
What are you winning?  Devaluation of American culture and society?  Destruction of the values held dear by Americans throughout the last two centuries like truth, justice, innovation, embracing cultures, etc.

What I see in America today are lies, internment, torture, regime change and insular thinking.
2006-09-08 06:44:12
13rin
Member
+977|6479

aardfrith wrote:

Horseman 77 wrote:

no wonder we are winning, someone takes war seriously it seems, a refreshing change from the masturbation strategy
What are you winning?  Devaluation of American culture and society?  Destruction of the values held dear by Americans throughout the last two centuries like truth, justice, innovation, embracing cultures, etc.

What I see in America today are lies, internment, torture, regime change and insular thinking.
I'm sorry you view America in that light.  Bush never denied "secret" prisons.  I wish he used the reason of "failure of UN compliance" to remove Saddam.  I also don't agree with your torture accusation.  What Saddam and his sons did to their own citizens I would consider torture.  What the US is doing is protecting itself.  I doubt you would be so critical if your country were to be attacked in a similar manner.  There is no "regime change".  The American people have spoken and they chose Bush.  As to your "insular thinking" how is setting up a democracy in a country that was once controlled by a brutal dictator considered a bad thing.  I'm thinking that unless you liked Saddam and his methods why would you have a problem with what we are doing?  Iraq will be a much better place in the long run.
I stood in line for four hours. They better give me a Wal-Mart gift card, or something.  - Rodney Booker, Job Fair attendee.
2006-09-08 06:49:05
13rin
Member
+977|6479

oug wrote:

Have you any idea what you fought for? It certainly wasn't defence! You were the aggressor and that is the reason why your country became #1 target. I on the other hand certainly am no aggressor and neither is France like someone said before. The Eiffel tower hasn't been shot down simply because France has not invaded other countries! If they do, rest asured they will be targeted as well.

And don't you dare lecture me simply because you have a purple heart and a goddamn action ribbon. Because I at least have the brains NOT to become a target.
A bit harsh there oug.  If he was drafted then he really didn't have the choice of being a target did he?  He was merely performing his civic duty.  How were we the aggressor?  France hasn't been attacked yet because you aren't on the top of their "people to kill today" list.  But you are only fooling yourself if you really believe that you aren't somewhere on that list.

Last edited by DBBrinson1 (2006-09-08 06:49:42)

I stood in line for four hours. They better give me a Wal-Mart gift card, or something.  - Rodney Booker, Job Fair attendee.
2006-09-08 07:10:29
oug
Calmer than you are.
+380|6519|Πάϊ

DBBrinson1 wrote:

A bit harsh there oug.  If he was drafted then he really didn't have the choice of being a target did he?  He was merely performing his civic duty.  How were we the aggressor?  France hasn't been attacked yet because you aren't on the top of their "people to kill today" list.  But you are only fooling yourself if you really believe that you aren't somewhere on that list.
Was he drafted? Ok then. I didn't even know there was a draft. If there is,  its my bad. But I recon he had a choice (it coincides with his distorted view of the world btw). And if still after all those years and all this analysis of the alleged "war on terror" you haven't realized what it is about then I'm sincerely sorry. Hell, even by taking a look at this forum you should be able to get a grasp, no special research is necessary.

There is NO war on terror. And even though my personal opinion is even more extreme*, I'll give you an example you might relate to: What's going on in Afghanistan at the moment? I hear NATO is asking for more troops cause the Taliban are giving them hell since most of the US troops pulled out.

Why doesn't your government give a fuck? Why are they concentrating on Iraq instead? Supposedly when this "war on terror" campaign started, it was all about Afghanistan and the Taliban regime helping Al Quaeda. Again, not that I believe the latter is true, but nonetheless. Why is the alleged mastermind of this whole thing still free? Why is it that getting Osama Bin Laden became from #1 priority to "I don't know where he is, and frankly I don't care" by GWB?


*Personal opinion: Afghanistan and Al Quaeda had nothing to do with this. Osama may have wanted to pull a 9/11 but he never could. It's all an inside job the goal of which is to give the US government an excuse to extend its grasp in the Middle East. It's the implementation of the Northwoods Documents' proposal. The only thing that differs is the target (ME not Cuba).
ƒ³
2006-09-08 07:15:04
BVC
Member
+325|6695
Did any of you anti-Europe people think that maybe there are historical reasons for Europe's unwillingness to send troops anywhere?  Got (sick of) war?

 

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