Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6076|eXtreme to the maX
Who said you need to cut your own throat?

You're willing to risk poisoning your water supply and see your house underwater though?

Last edited by Dilbert_X (2012-12-15 18:41:47)

Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!
DrunkFace
Germans did 911
+427|6651|Disaster Free Zone
If Jay can't see instant results there are no results.
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5328|London, England

DrunkFace wrote:

If Jay can't see instant results there are no results.
You're asking the world to accept a lower standard of living for intangible results. If even one country refuses the entire scheme breaks. Hence prisoner's dilemma.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6076|eXtreme to the maX
Or a higher standard of living - advanced engineering of new technology requires qualified and skilled people whereas you can send any redneck out to drill a hole in the ground.

Retooling for new technology is a huge driver of progress whereas sitting on your ass isn't.

Last edited by Dilbert_X (2012-12-15 20:17:56)

Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!
Winston_Churchill
Bazinga!
+521|6709|Toronto | Canada

not really a relevant point - denmark and netherlands are two of the most forward thinking energy countries in the world yet are among the highest standard of living... usually above the US.
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5328|London, England

Dilbert_X wrote:

Or a higher standard of living - advanced engineering of new technology requires qualified and skilled people whereas you can send any redneck out to drill a hole in the ground.

Retooling for new technology is a huge driver of progress whereas sitting on your ass isn't.
Yeah, because that helps a lot when all the parts are made in China, shipped here, and we dig a hole in the ground to erect it. Really does a whole lot to help our economy. The few temporary jobs to build the sites, the even fewer jobs to maintain it. The tradeoff is just accepting a doubling of energy costs
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6076|eXtreme to the maX
So your drilling rigs, gas pipes, power station parts etc aren't made in China?

Don't buy everything in China, duh.


Anyway, you're the proponent of the 'increase our standard of living by buying everything from China and increasing world trade' nonsense.

And if you doubled your energy cost but sold the gas you didn't use to China wouldn't that support your own dumb argument?

Last edited by Dilbert_X (2012-12-15 20:34:29)

Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5328|London, England

Dilbert_X wrote:

So your drilling rigs, gas pipes, power station parts etc aren't made in China?

Don't buy everything in China, duh.

Anyway, you're the proponent of the 'increase our standard of living by buying everything from China and increasing world trade' nonsense.
I am, and I don't have a problem with it. Just pointing out how stupid your logic is.

Did you applaud Europe and their trebling of petrol prices over the last few decades to force people into smaller fuel efficient vehicles? I know I did, because they were effectively subsidizing lower gasoline prices here in the US. Thanks for that. Much appreciated. Saved the world didn'tcha.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6076|eXtreme to the maX
You're not really pointing out anything by contradicting your won arguments.

Yes, if one group of people tries to achieve something and their neighbour does the opposite then not much is achieved.

However tax on petrol in Europe has never really been about the environment, its always been about preventing waste of scarce national resources and clamping imports - you'd know that if you didn't just copy-pasta gibberish from www.ronpaulsenileandbutthurt.com.

Last edited by Dilbert_X (2012-12-15 21:09:20)

Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!
Macbeth
Banned
+2,444|5556

Ron Paul was the worst candidate in 08 and 12.
AussieReaper
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
+5,761|6123|what

Macbeth wrote:

Ron Paul was the worst candidate in 08 and 12.
He's was certainly against some tough competition in '12


https://i.imgur.com/SsK4S.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/maVpUMN.png
Macbeth
Banned
+2,444|5556

And he still managed to pull it off. The guy is an achiever.
A2TG2
Hazbeen
+67|4495|at your six
Roi
Macbeth
Banned
+2,444|5556

Hi ATG.
Mutantbear
Semi Constructive Criticism
+1,431|5935|London, England

roi
_______________________________________________________________________________________________ https://i.imgur.com/Xj4f2.png
AussieReaper
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
+5,761|6123|what

Hi ATG.
https://i.imgur.com/maVpUMN.png
Extra Medium
THE UZI SLAYER
+79|4165|Oklahoma
People can hate on Ron Paul all they want but you have to give the guy respect where respect is due.

The guy has basically campaigned and won on the same platform for nearly 40 years. 
He hasn't changed his agenda hardly at all.
He hasn't been involved in scandal after scandal, (none that I know of).
He championed cutting spending, when spending was cool.
He has opposed both wars, as a Republican.
He wants to kill the Federal Reserve.
When running for Pres. nods, was the only one not slinging shit everywhere about his competition.

How exactly are these bad things?

He sounds like pretty much the kind of politician most of you say doesn't exist and is the opposite of all the things most of you hate about politicians.  The worst thing about him are his fans who spam RON PUAL 2017!!1 everywhere.
AussieReaper
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
+5,761|6123|what

Extra Medium wrote:

The guy has basically campaigned and won on the same platform for nearly 40 years.
I found the flaw in your argument.
https://i.imgur.com/maVpUMN.png
Extra Medium
THE UZI SLAYER
+79|4165|Oklahoma
As a congressman you tard.
KEN-JENNINGS
I am all that is MOD!
+2,973|6602|949

but he hasn't done anything meaningful to change the system he campaigns against.  Maybe all his supporters are the true dumb dumbs because they keep voting him in despite him not doing much more than strenuously objecting to the system in place.
Extra Medium
THE UZI SLAYER
+79|4165|Oklahoma

KEN-JENNINGS wrote:

but he hasn't done anything meaningful to change the system he campaigns against.  Maybe all his supporters are the true dumb dumbs because they keep voting him in despite him not doing much more than strenuously objecting to the system in place.
Why would he have succeded?  If the system worked as he wanted it too there would have been no reason to elect him or for him to run.  If the senators and congressmen he served with felt the same way, the system would have been as previously mentioned.

It's hard to convince people on the gravy train to get off, even if it's headed for the broken bridge over the canyon.  Most people call the guy screaming for them to get off a nut case even as they descend into the abyss.




But please, enlighten me Dear Leader of the liberal gang of faggots, what exactly did Ron Paul stand for that you think was bad?
m3thod
All kiiiiiiiiinds of gainz
+2,197|6641|UK
why do you want to chuck a big ship into a volcano?
Blackbelts are just whitebelts who have never quit.
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5328|London, England
Ron Paul's big thing was always ending the Federal Reserve system. Well...
QE4

So what exactly is this new thin-air money printing program all about?  Well, unlike any prior Quantitative Easing (QE) announcement, this one was tied to a fuzzy and quirky government statistic: the unemployment rate.

QE4 is Just-In-Time Fed Policy to Avoid Calamity

Dec 13, 2012

We got the most thunderous Just-In-Time monetary policy today that is a substitute for the absence of any degree of stimulative fiscal policy.

You might say that QE4 is now going to act as both monetary and fiscal stimulus– another $85 billion worth of Fed accumulations of Treasury bonds and mortgages- that is meant to keep stock prices moving higher and residential home sales climbing briskly.

The goal is to drive economic activity, especially residential home building, so that unemployment drops from 7.7% to 6.5%. The surprise move is meant to signal the Fed’s awareness of the softening economy; it sees the gritty numbers before we do.

Getting unemployment down to 6.5% without inflation rising to a level higher than 2.5% is not expected to happen until 2014 at the earliest. And it could go longer if there is no deal and we go over the cliff.

But, you should know that the only reason unemployment is 7.7% is because hundreds of thousands of males have dropped out of the search for regular work. A very depressing tale.
The key point here is that the Fed is now actively running both monetary and fiscal policy because it will now be in the business of funding nearly 100% of all the new government deficit spending in 2013.  And it is pumping a bit more than $1 trillion of hot, thin-air money into the economy as it does so.

The odd thing here is that by tying their policy to the unemployment rate, we could be in for a very long wait for the stimulus to end.  The reason is that the unemployment rate has a couple of moving pieces, one being the number of people who are unemployed, and the second consisting of people who have given up looking for work, which is tracked in something called the 'participation rate.'

As more people leave the labor force and the participation rate goes down, the unemployment rate goes down, too.  Somewhat confusingly, as more jobs are created, the unemployment rate goes down, too.  As you can see, these numbers work in opposition to each other because as more jobs become available, more people re-enter the work force.

Before the crisis struck, the participation rate was around 66.5%. But now it sits at just 63.6%, meaning that, at roughly 1.4 million jobs for each percent, a bit more than 4 million jobs would have to be created just to absorb the folks who left the labor force but presumably would like to work again. As those 4 million folks come back to work, the unemployment rate will not budge at all.
Plenty more here: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2012-12-1 … atest-move

Basically, the Fed has decided to print money instead of adding our 2013 debt to the deficit. In a normal economy this would cause hyperinflation, and probably still will. The plan here is to print so much money that housing prices return to their pre-crash bubble heights so construction companies get back to work and unemployment drops. Nevermind that the inflation completely offsets the gains in housing prices and everyone will be poorer. This is what passes for good policy from the central planners at the Fed.

Last edited by Jay (2012-12-17 17:28:32)

"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6742|PNW

Extra Medium wrote:

When running for Pres. nods, was the only one not slinging shit everywhere about his competition.
Unless you call telling the truth about opponents "slinging shit."
Extra Medium
THE UZI SLAYER
+79|4165|Oklahoma

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

Extra Medium wrote:

When running for Pres. nods, was the only one not slinging shit everywhere about his competition.
Unless you call telling the truth about opponents "slinging shit."
I stand corrected.

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