Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5350|London, England
...
But there is a real “citizen legislature” idea that might soon be circulating as an initiative for the November 2012 ballot. The Neighborhood Legislature Reform Act is counterintuitive: It dramatically increases the number of Assembly members and state senators. The initiative would provide thousands of new neighborhood legislators, who would elect a smaller group that would actually go the capitol and do the normal business of legislating. It sounds wacky, but pay attention to the details before rendering judgment.

As the initiative explains, “Our state Legislature does not serve the interests of the citizens. The Legislature only serves the special interests. Prior attempts at reform have all failed. The problem is that our Legislative districts are too big and cost taxpayers too much money. Our Legislators represent too many constituents. The average assembly district in the other 49 states has approximately 50,000 citizens. The average assembly district in California is nearly 10 times larger...”

California’s districts are so large that regular citizens do not have the hope of influencing their legislator. Winning elections in such large districts means raising lots of cash and candidates can only do that by becoming beholden to special interests. The initiative idea—funded initially by former GOP presidential candidate and venture capitalist John Cox—would flood the state with citizen legislators/representatives who represent smaller numbers of Californians.
...
http://reason.com/archives/2011/12/19/f … egislature

This is actually rather brilliant. We all bitch about being under-represented and most of that has to do with the sheer number of people each representative is supposed to nominally represent. My two state senators are supposed to hear the voices of 18,000,000 or so people. Not gonna happen.

In 1903 this country had 76,000,000 residents and 325 members of the House of Representatives. (233,000 citizens per representative)

Today, we have 307,000,000 residents and 435 Representatives (706,000 citizens per representative)

Over time, we've gotten further and further away from the seat of power and our voices have been even more diluted. If that bill passes in California, I think it would be a step in the right direction towards proper representation.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
Macbeth
Banned
+2,444|5577

I like how you will talk shit about a Huffington Post link but you and Haibai gobble up Reason.com like the bible.

Anyway that smaller system would just clog up the whole thing and our government already has a complex enough system that adding more people to it would only screw things up more. Too many cooks
https://www.indecisionforever.com/files/2010/06/howlawsmade.jpg
Ty
Mass Media Casualty
+2,398|6766|Noizyland

The US electoral system has way more problems than just "too many citizens per representative".
[Blinking eyes thing]
Steam: http://steamcommunity.com/id/tzyon
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5350|London, England

Ty wrote:

The US electoral system has way more problems than just "too many citizens per representative".
Not really, no. Way better than your silly system of voting for one person and the votes ending up with another
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
m3thod
All kiiiiiiiiinds of gainz
+2,197|6663|UK

Macbeth wrote:

I like how you will talk shit about a Huffington Post link but you and Haibai gobble up Reason.com like the bible.

Anyway that smaller system would just clog up the whole thing and our government already has a complex enough system that adding more people to it would only screw things up more. Too many cooks
https://www.indecisionforever.com/files/2010/06/howlawsmade.jpg
Blackbelts are just whitebelts who have never quit.
13urnzz
Banned
+5,830|6489

i liked the cartoon version better.
m3thod
All kiiiiiiiiinds of gainz
+2,197|6663|UK
Lol on my phone that info graphic turns into a shot of some ginger chick
Blackbelts are just whitebelts who have never quit.
Cybargs
Moderated
+2,285|6708

Jay wrote:

Ty wrote:

The US electoral system has way more problems than just "too many citizens per representative".
Not really, no. Way better than your silly system of voting for one person and the votes ending up with another
well I can see the reason why



but australians are all criminals we dont deserve to vote BUT WE MUST VOTE OR GET FINED.
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DrunkFace
Germans did 911
+427|6673|Disaster Free Zone

Jay wrote:

Ty wrote:

The US electoral system has way more problems than just "too many citizens per representative".
Not really, no. Way better than your silly system of voting for one person and the votes ending up with another
Nah


Ty
Mass Media Casualty
+2,398|6766|Noizyland

Jay wrote:

Ty wrote:

The US electoral system has way more problems than just "too many citizens per representative".
Not really, no. Way better than your silly system of voting for one person and the votes ending up with another
I'm from NZ, we use MMP rather than FPP or preferential voting. FPP is shit though, that's why we ditched it in 1996.
[Blinking eyes thing]
Steam: http://steamcommunity.com/id/tzyon
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6098|eXtreme to the maX

Jay wrote:

Ty wrote:

The US electoral system has way more problems than just "too many citizens per representative".
Not really, no. Way better than your silly system of voting for one person and the votes ending up with another
Except the US system inevitably results in a two party plutocracy, as does first past the post everywhere else.
Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5350|London, England

Dilbert_X wrote:

Jay wrote:

Ty wrote:

The US electoral system has way more problems than just "too many citizens per representative".
Not really, no. Way better than your silly system of voting for one person and the votes ending up with another
Except the US system inevitably results in a two party plutocracy, as does first past the post everywhere else.
No it doesn't. If you were to expand the number of representatives you would get more variety. It's the money behind campaigns which dictates two candidates. They aren't going to split their resources and fund a third candidate. It would be a bad investment. If elections were to suddenly become cheaper, you'd find more people willing to support third party candidates financially.
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
eleven bravo
Member
+1,399|5251|foggy bottom
really bad idea
Tu Stultus Es
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5350|London, England

eleven bravo wrote:

really bad idea
Why do you think so?
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
Cybargs
Moderated
+2,285|6708

Jay wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

Jay wrote:


Not really, no. Way better than your silly system of voting for one person and the votes ending up with another
Except the US system inevitably results in a two party plutocracy, as does first past the post everywhere else.
No it doesn't. If you were to expand the number of representatives you would get more variety. It's the money behind campaigns which dictates two candidates. They aren't going to split their resources and fund a third candidate. It would be a bad investment. If elections were to suddenly become cheaper, you'd find more people willing to support third party candidates financially.
They tried Alternative Vote in Aussie to change the two party system... but we still ended up with a huge Labour and Liberal government, greens and independents control very little in parliament, but now since its neck and neck their votes matter quite a bit now
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HITNRUNXX
Member
+220|6701|Oklahoma City
It would be similar to neighborhoods becoming districts and feeding into City Council's Wards, Councilmen feeding into the Mayor, Mayor Feeding into the Governor, Governor Feeding into the Senator, the Senator feeding into the White House...

Like a chain of command... It could work... But ideally, that is what we have now, and it obviously doesn't. State Senators don't care what the governor thinks, the governor doesn't care what you think. They just need votes, and votes come from advertising, not actually from taking care of the citizens.

Ideally, you should be able to go to your City Councilman and get the same results.
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6403|'Murka

Will it kill their penchant for budget-killing referenda?
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein

Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
KEN-JENNINGS
I am all that is MOD!
+2,973|6624|949

Who's penchant?
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6403|'Murka

KEN-JENNINGS wrote:

Who's penchant?
Californians'
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein

Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5350|London, England
I believe the states conservatives earned credit for that one, no?
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6403|'Murka

I don't care who gets credit. Bad ideas are agnostic.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein

Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
Jay
Bork! Bork! Bork!
+2,006|5350|London, England
“When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic.”
- Benjamin Franklin
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat

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