Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6608|North Carolina

Pleiam wrote:

I am against homosexuality because I dont understand how its possible to want sexual intimacy with someone of the same sex. It seems unnatural and therefore an invention (see note 1).

I dont hate homosexuals, but I, a democratic voter, wont approve of homosexuals raising children unless there is a study that shows how a majority of children raised by homosexuals become "upstanding", law-abiding, "independent" citizens.

Even if I did approve of homosexuals raising children, it wouldn't mean that I would approve of their sexual lifestyle. Which raises the question; "If homosexuals are allowed to raise children, does that mean their lifestyle is approved of by the govt. and society?"

With that said, many people in the U.S. are becoming more and more accepting of the lifestyles of others that almost makes this debate obsolete.



Note 1; reference http://www.apostolic-churches.net/bible … C21007.HTM Ecclesiastes 7:29
I can see where you're coming from, but honestly, I can't say that homosexuality is revolting to me.  Let's just say that I like watching two women get friendly.  Most of my girlfriends have been bisexual too... 

Anyway, I think you'll find that heterosexual households don't make kids anymore law abiding than homosexual ones.  Parenting is a skill that depends on wisdom, not sexuality.

Nevertheless, I have a feeling that your assumption is wrong about the future.  I actually believe America will become less tolerant of homosexuals in the future -- as far as marriage and kids are concerned.
Des.Kmal
Member
+917|6821|Atlanta, Georgia, USA

the title wrote:

Should Homosexuals be allowed to have kids??
No.

*waits for someone to comment on where im from to denote my answer.*
Add me on Origin for Battlefield 4 fun: DesKmal
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6608|North Carolina
Care to explain your rationale Des?

*looks at your profile*  By the way, I prefer carpet over hard wood, if you know what I mean...  j/k
47man
Member
+46|6627|Cali
I don't think they should, not because I think they would not be capable parents. I think homosexuals should not be allowed to have children, because it IS going to affect the child.
eyesteponbabies
Banned
+13|6634|St.Louis, Missouri
no
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6975|PNW

Can gay people have kids? In the literal sense, no (unless they stop being gay long enough).

Last edited by unnamednewbie13 (2006-11-21 21:34:06)

beerface702
Member
+65|6896|las vegas

JimG wrote:

If it was normal for gays to have kids, it would not be considered abnormal being a child of two gay parents. And there are no facts proving that the majority of people will be against gays having children, and I doubt adults will mob children because their parents are homosexual.
i dunno the little leaqur parents are mobbin coach's over a football game

gay bashing would be out of control imo

but icould careless go ahead and let it be legal. i dont think being gay will suddenly be in the IN thing to do or be. human nature takes over when it comes to knockin boots
Rosse_modest
Member
+76|6979|Antwerp, Flanders

Pleiam wrote:

I am against homosexuality because I dont understand how its possible to want sexual intimacy with someone of the same sex. It seems unnatural and therefore an invention (see note 1).
Homosexuality is 100% natural. If you look at the pure mechanics of species continuation then it is a flaw however. When that species is living under circumstances where every resource is critical for its survival (you know, when we were still drawing pictures on cave walls) homosexuality would certainly be an undesirable quality since homosexuals would consume the food gathered but would not be able to procreate thus not contributing to the survival of the species. Imho this is where general homophobia comes from, a natural defense mechanism to secure continued existense. In such a low level human society it would become quite beneficial to expell the homosexual from the group leaving him or her to die and since humans are herd animals, especially at this stage of their evolution, they would thus be unable to survive on their own. Bear in mind however that human society is not exaclty under the same stress as it was then. The human species is essentially rampaging it's way through the planet. All resources required for the continued survival of the species are plentiful. As such there is no REAL acceptable motivation to expell or condemn homosexuals. If you would do so you would also be logically obliged to condemn the disabled, the handicapped, people of minute intellectual capacity (that may include you, Pleiam),... Because they're also flawed.

Pleiam wrote:

I dont hate homosexuals, but I, a democratic voter, wont approve of homosexuals raising children unless there is a study that shows how a majority of children raised by homosexuals become "upstanding", law-abiding, "independent" citizens.
This is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Seriously.
UNDIESRULES
Member
+4|6884

JimG wrote:

UNDIESRULES wrote:

mr.degman wrote:

Cant u people understnd , TO be Gay is WRONG, atlest something is wrong it their head.

The way of life is that a male fucks a female and not male vs male.

No gay marriage no gays would be allowed to have children and to be honest its absolutely fucking disgusting to be gay.
I have to agree.  These people arent right up top.  And the whole gay thing is vile.
haha im more disgusted by you!
Yuck, you gay lover.
B.Schuss
I'm back, baby... ( sort of )
+664|7044|Cologne, Germany

Agent_Dung_Bomb wrote:

IRONCHEF wrote:

I don't think gay couples (legally married or not) should be parents.  I actually believe homosexual behavior is bad (just as fornication is bad) and to raise a child and condone such behavior is to start a child off poorly.  I believe children should be raised by two loving parents..a mother and a father because each parent performs important, vital roles in the nuturing and growth of the child.  Further, it is a commandment to multiply and replenish the earth.  With gay parents, this shows lack of respect for that commandment as they cannot fulfill this commandment themselves.

I have a pair of lesbians I work with, both have become pregnant and are raising two adorable little girls.  Both these women are excellent people and I treat them as i would heterosexual people, respectively.  But in thinking of the difference in upbringing my little girl will have vs. what their little girls will have, I'm saddened at the thought of those little girls being raised by two homosexual women and the things she will not learn..and of the things she WILL learn.
1. Marriage is not just about having children.  There are many couples who cannot, and many who choose not to have children.  So these people lack respect for the commandment to go forth and be like rabbits?

2. Many children currently grow up in single parent households.  Even when the divorce is amicable, the children are often shuffled around between the parents.  This isn't always the best thing for the child.  When the divorce isn't amicable, things are even worse.

3. Your moral decisions about what you teach your children is just that, your moral decisions.  To think that children of gay/lesbian parents would get lesser morals, or different morals, shows a rather self righteous and moral superiority on your part.

4. You're right that children should be raised by loving parents.  However, not every child will have both parents, even in hetero relationships, so the love of the parent(s) is the important thing.  To say that a child would get less love from a gay/lesbian couple again shows a pretty self righteous and moral superiority on your part.

So, are you going to stop lesbian women from getting pregnant?  Are you going to stop gay men from getting a women pregnant?  Are you going to stop single women who are not married, and don't want to get married from getting pregnant to have a child?  Without some major rights violations the answer is quite simply, no.  There are a lot of kids if foster care and could use a loving family, regardless of their sexual orientation.

As far as children being picked on for their parents sexuality, I don't see the problem.  Children of hetero parents are being picked on.  All of these school shootings that happened, were they children of gay couples, or were they children of hetero couples that got picked on for one reason or another?

Saying that children would be picked on is BS.  Kids of hetero families are already picked on, so what's the point?  Children are already sexually, physically, and mentally abused by hetero parents.  Is this any better than being raised by caring gay/lesbian parents?  Moral values vary, and just because they may vary from some one else's doesn't make them wrong, it just makes them different.
QFE. , +1
realengineerinusa
Member
+0|6570

Turquoise wrote:

realengineerinusa wrote:

Free doesn't not mean living how without responsibility.  Either a person thinks homosexuality is ok and just some one's way of living or you can see it as a perversion of natural law.  I think it is interesting how people will defend something so absurd with no other justification than, "It's my right".  Think about it.  Why is the only response a person can give when someone challenges gay rights is, "you're a homophob"?
Well, we have to define the limitations of law.  For example, if I were Muslim, I could argue that it is not natural for women to have the same rights as men, because Allah says so.  That's just an oversimplification of why Muslims treat women differently than men, but you see what I mean?

I'm guessing you're religious, correct?  Christian, right?  Your religion states that homosexuality is wrong, but as an atheist, I don't agree with that.  Essentially, by saying gay people shouldn't have kids, you have to come up with a rational reason why they shouldn't.  You can't say, "because it's not natural" and expect it to hold much worth.

Give me one good reason why they shouldn't be allowed kids.  Be sure to back it up with a source if it is an observation that is scientific or psychological in nature.
First of all, I appreciate your thoughtful response.  You are correct I am a Christian.  I have not always been a Christian, but what made me a Christian is by looking at all the evidence supporting what the bible says.  But to answer your question about should homosexuals have kids, I personally say no.  Many gay couples start off in heterosexual relationships and then for what ever reason make the choice to live differently.  The sad part is, it is very difficult to find any actual scientific research on how children from these relationships turn out.  The biggest issue from getting the data is there has not been many cases to look at.  Where I am getting my opinion is not necessarily from my religion, but data from my own experience and the overwhelming evidence that children raised with a mother and a father do better in life.  My parents divorced with I was 4 and I only saw my father once since then.  By not having a male role model to look at, I suffered greatly with self-esteem and normal guy stuff.  Too me, not having both an active mother and father in child rearing is absolutely stupid.  I understand "things happen", and a family has to make the best of it, but making the decision to put a child at a disadvantage just because it is an adult's right is just plan self-centeredness.
JimG
Member
+0|6570

beerface702 wrote:

JimG wrote:

If it was normal for gays to have kids, it would not be considered abnormal being a child of two gay parents. And there are no facts proving that the majority of people will be against gays having children, and I doubt adults will mob children because their parents are homosexual.
i dunno the little leaqur parents are mobbin coach's over a football game

gay bashing would be out of control imo

but icould careless go ahead and let it be legal. i dont think being gay will suddenly be in the IN thing to do or be. human nature takes over when it comes to knockin boots
speak english because i dont understand what any of that meant
{MOD}DREW
Member
+26|6868

..teddy..jimmy wrote:

Should homosexuals be allowed to have children through IVF even though the child will probably be bullied and stigmatized at school?

Discuss..
I had to post because your topic made me do the whole "What?" thing in the middle of my living room.


Teddy, I think your topic has its importance, but considering that I am a school teacher I can offer a different side of the coin in this situation. 

The subject of sexuality has no impact on parenting skills whatsoever and it is parenting skills that will be the most impactful determiner on the childs life, not bullies or labels in school.   
I've sat in conferences with students and their parents from all different catagories of society and one thing rings true.  Some parents are involved in their children's lives, and some are not.    When parents are involved in their childrens lives the children are better prepared for what life is going to hand them, and what responsibilities they are accountible for.

As far as economics, health insurance and everything else, none of that really matters if your parent (regardless of gender) isn't active in the child's life.
JimG
Member
+0|6570

UNDIESRULES wrote:

JimG wrote:

UNDIESRULES wrote:


I have to agree.  These people arent right up top.  And the whole gay thing is vile.
haha im more disgusted by you!
Yuck, you gay lover.
haha pathetic
..teddy..jimmy
Member
+1,393|6852

{MOD}DREW wrote:

..teddy..jimmy wrote:

Should homosexuals be allowed to have children through IVF even though the child will probably be bullied and stigmatized at school?

Discuss..
I had to post because your topic made me do the whole "What?" thing in the middle of my living room.


Teddy, I think your topic has its importance, but considering that I am a school teacher I can offer a different side of the coin in this situation. 

The subject of sexuality has no impact on parenting skills whatsoever and it is parenting skills that will be the most impactful determiner on the childs life, not bullies or labels in school.   
I've sat in conferences with students and their parents from all different catagories of society and one thing rings true.  Some parents are involved in their children's lives, and some are not.    When parents are involved in their childrens lives the children are better prepared for what life is going to hand them, and what responsibilities they are accountible for.

As far as economics, health insurance and everything else, none of that really matters if your parent (regardless of gender) isn't active in the child's life.
Thanks for your input but im over this debate.
{MOD}DREW
Member
+26|6868
lol hey no problem...


1st time reading this part of the site.  Great question though.  Hell it got 10 pages. 

NJ,

Drew
..teddy..jimmy
Member
+1,393|6852

{MOD}DREW wrote:

lol hey no problem...


1st time reading this part of the site.  Great question though.  Hell it got 10 pages. 

NJ,

Drew
+1..using up karma and u seem like a nice guy
=Dagriz=
Member
+3|6706

JimG wrote:

Of course gay people should be allowed to have children. They have the same rights as every other human being.
sorry but an homosexual is not a human beeing...human beeing can actually make love together and make child

            NOT GAY
JimG
Member
+0|6570

=Dagriz= wrote:

JimG wrote:

Of course gay people should be allowed to have children. They have the same rights as every other human being.
sorry but an homosexual is not a human beeing...human beeing can actually make love together and make child

            NOT GAY
1)they are
2)they can make love but cant get a child from it
bigot.
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6608|North Carolina

realengineerinusa wrote:

First of all, I appreciate your thoughtful response.  You are correct I am a Christian.  I have not always been a Christian, but what made me a Christian is by looking at all the evidence supporting what the bible says.  But to answer your question about should homosexuals have kids, I personally say no.  Many gay couples start off in heterosexual relationships and then for what ever reason make the choice to live differently.  The sad part is, it is very difficult to find any actual scientific research on how children from these relationships turn out.  The biggest issue from getting the data is there has not been many cases to look at.  Where I am getting my opinion is not necessarily from my religion, but data from my own experience and the overwhelming evidence that children raised with a mother and a father do better in life.  My parents divorced with I was 4 and I only saw my father once since then.  By not having a male role model to look at, I suffered greatly with self-esteem and normal guy stuff.  Too me, not having both an active mother and father in child rearing is absolutely stupid.  I understand "things happen", and a family has to make the best of it, but making the decision to put a child at a disadvantage just because it is an adult's right is just plan self-centeredness.
Thanks for your thoughtful response as well.  I can see where you're coming from, and yes, it is hard to find much scientific research on this topic.  It's just that, as another person put it, how is letting a single person adopt a kid any different from letting a gay couple do so.  If you're going to let single parents adopt kids, I don't see how you can logically prevent a gay couple from doing the same thing.

I also agree with your last sentence, but I've seen heterosexual couples put themselve before the interests of their children just as often as anyone else.  We live in a dysfunctional world, but what defines us as a free country is the freedom we each enjoy as adults.  I consider adoption and parenting to be rights just as much as the freedom of speech is....
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6608|North Carolina

JimG wrote:

UNDIESRULES wrote:

JimG wrote:


haha im more disgusted by you!
Yuck, you gay lover.
haha pathetic
Yeah...  I agree.  Just because someone is open minded about gay rights, it doesn't make him/her gay themselves.  I'm definitely straight, but I believe in supporting the rights of every law-abiding citizen.
Sydney
2λчиэλ
+783|7046|Reykjavík, Iceland.
Homosexuals don't have any disadvantages at all here I believe, they can even get married by the Free Church of Iceland, and I think they should have the same right to have children as heterosexuals.

Last edited by PBAsydney (2006-11-23 12:29:10)

Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6608|North Carolina

=Dagriz= wrote:

JimG wrote:

Of course gay people should be allowed to have children. They have the same rights as every other human being.
sorry but an homosexual is not a human beeing...human beeing can actually make love together and make child

            NOT GAY
I'd be interested in knowing how this fool regards the "human" status of people that are infertile.
Ratzinger
Member
+43|6595|Wollongong, NSW, Australia

realengineerinusa wrote:

I have not always been a Christian, but what made me a Christian is by looking at all the evidence supporting what the bible says.
Um, OK.....Nah, too easy.
realengineerinusa
Member
+0|6570

Turquoise wrote:

realengineerinusa wrote:

First of all, I appreciate your thoughtful response.  You are correct I am a Christian.  I have not always been a Christian, but what made me a Christian is by looking at all the evidence supporting what the bible says.  But to answer your question about should homosexuals have kids, I personally say no.  Many gay couples start off in heterosexual relationships and then for what ever reason make the choice to live differently.  The sad part is, it is very difficult to find any actual scientific research on how children from these relationships turn out.  The biggest issue from getting the data is there has not been many cases to look at.  Where I am getting my opinion is not necessarily from my religion, but data from my own experience and the overwhelming evidence that children raised with a mother and a father do better in life.  My parents divorced with I was 4 and I only saw my father once since then.  By not having a male role model to look at, I suffered greatly with self-esteem and normal guy stuff.  Too me, not having both an active mother and father in child rearing is absolutely stupid.  I understand "things happen", and a family has to make the best of it, but making the decision to put a child at a disadvantage just because it is an adult's right is just plan self-centeredness.
Thanks for your thoughtful response as well.  I can see where you're coming from, and yes, it is hard to find much scientific research on this topic.  It's just that, as another person put it, how is letting a single person adopt a kid any different from letting a gay couple do so.  If you're going to let single parents adopt kids, I don't see how you can logically prevent a gay couple from doing the same thing.

I also agree with your last sentence, but I've seen heterosexual couples put themselve before the interests of their children just as often as anyone else.  We live in a dysfunctional world, but what defines us as a free country is the freedom we each enjoy as adults.  I consider adoption and parenting to be rights just as much as the freedom of speech is....
I believe there is a huge difference between a single parent and a gay couple.  The dynamics introduced in such a structure has to have a major affect on the family.  I think it is safe to say we will disagree on this topic.  I think before the courts start giving gays the same priviledges as regular couples, we need to see how the current bunch of kids growing up with gay couples turn out.  To me, it is not right to experiment with children's lifes just to give someone a chance to adopt a child when there is no data to support the fact that children will lead normal lives.  If it turns out children from gay couples have a harder time adjusting and end up with more problems than children adopted by a regular couple, would you be in favor of stopping the process of letting gay couples adopt children?

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