BF2S Forums Teamkilling with mines

I couldn't agree more! I've stopped using mines because of this, I'm getting punished for "teamkilling" just because 50% of my teammates are blind and run stright into my  mines....

I don't think you should be excempt from TKP when using these things, since that would lead to the smacktards deliberately teamkilling with the mines. It should, however, be a delay period for the TKP on stuff like this, with nice red text going across his screen as he waits for respawn. "The red skulls are NOT powerups!".

On one hand, TKP abuse on mines is massive. On the other, I don't want to see a world where I can't punish fuckers who throw mines in front of my tank so they can start camping for it again.



FaustEdit: How about a "report mine" button? If you have planted the mine, and reported it, you'll get a three or five second waiting period before you're immune to TKP on that particular mine. Your teammates will know the damn mine is there, since you've reported it. It also makes it hard to TK for hardware using mines, since you'll either have time to react, or the ability to punish.

Last edited by faust82 (2005-12-06 05:20:29)

I agree with the timer idea.  It would prevent people from abusing claymores and mines by throwing them in front of friendly units.   After 5 seconds, if they get blown up, it's their own fault for ignoring the little red skull.  The main reason I've stopped using AT mines and claymores is that I wind up with a negative score because people are too stupid to know that the red skulls appear on things other than C4.

well wat i think about mines is this..
i really hate it when ur teammates put mines blocking all the roads and u can't get out of the base with ur tank i think that u should be albe to like disable the mines if someone from ur team mate put them there

Why not have different symbols for each item, that way you don't drive over a mine thinking it is a C4.  Have different symbols for Claymore, C4, and Mines!!! Then there is no excuse.

The biggest thing I hate about this...  well, it used to be the mines.  People will abuse the hell out of this, primarily to get you booted.  One game in particular some whiny people wanted me mutinied as cmdr even though I was doing a bangup job, and some dude actually intentionally ran over mines I laid and punished on the teamkill.  since this was before they patched artillery tk's out, that was the "last straw" and I got autokicked due to teamkilling.

But, my biggest pet peeve now is dipshits that run over clearly visible claymores I've set up to protect my ass when I'm set up trying to snipe an area.  I will agree that the different explosive types need different custom icons so they can be clearly identified, but if you see a red skull and crossbones at the base of a ladder or on a platform, don't be a dillweed and run over it assuming it's not a claymore or out of petulance cus you wanted to climb that building too.   It costs the sniper teamwork  points even if you don't punish (and most of the morons I'm typing about here do punish regardless) AND one of the only two claymores they get.

Last edited by Tangy Meat Sauce (2005-12-18 22:42:44)

Yeah, there's no way you can dissociate tk'ing from the explosives...  the game would be a disaster.  All I ask (which is completely unreasonable, I realize) is that people be conscientious about the damn skull and crossbones.  If you're driving a vehicle and you see the way further down the past is covered in the skull and crossbones, the way is mined.  Don't try to squeeze your buggy through, die, and punish.  There's probably a REASON those mines are there and not only do you cost your team a ticket when you die, you cost a teammate points AND you free up the path for an enemy vehicle to come strolling in. 

I was on Leviathan the other day at the start of the round and quickly mined the round in.  Of course, some pinhead decided he was going to hop in a buggy and just start driving suicidally right for the fully populated MEC base with another guy in the vehicle.  His suicide happened earlier than he expected as he drove right over my mine, killing both of them and costing me 12 teamwork points.  Seconds later, the parade of MEC vehicles came pouring in and the Fuel Depot quickly went down. 

I could write up hundreds of stories like these.  Don't get me started. 

There's not much point to mining in a such a way as to allow access, because access out also means access in, meaning enemy vehicles that can see your mines will just drive through the holes and your time is wasted.  I don't mine often, but when I do it's almost always covering an entire path, usually for a very good reason (I know a fleet of vehicles is en route, i.e.).  It's one thing if it's the only way out, but more often people are either ignorant or impatient and just drive over them anyhow.

I absolutely agree with the OP, if one does not look where he drives, that is ignore the red skull warning signs of AT-mines, he should be punished, and NOT the engeneer who placed them.

If you ignore the red signs of a train/road crossing : would you drive through anyway even though a train is about to smash you  ? 

And if you insist on driving in that direction, there are usually MORE roads that are not mined to go there, so its easy to avoid TKs and still go where you want; if only the impatient ones would THINK  about this ....!

The easy solution would be the program would give a  -2  points penalty for ANY friendly car running over a friendly mine to the driver of that car. No "voting"or page up/down possible for that. 

To avoid engeneers laying mines all over the place for no reason at all but to hinder teammates, the software-program could restrict mine-laying to those engeneers  for 5 minutes, if more than X penalties are given in Y seconds/minutes for placing those mines.

As it is now, laying AT-mines is discouraged, and "blind"drivers  have no incentive to care about it.

This was the same problem in BF1942, so maybe EA/DICE could try programming some of our suggestions about this problem ?

Last edited by MajorHoulahan_MASH (2005-12-20 08:06:03)

topal63 wrote:

No way man!

I "punish" everytime a teammate kills me with a worthless mine. They're worthless - because if a guy is heading for flag - most of the time the battle hasn't gotten supra-hot - he sees it - he shoots it - it blows up.

If I see any mine while casually moving around in a tank/apc I blow them up - no matter which team placed them - if I don't see them it is because I am engaged with the opposing team - and trying to stay alive.

But teamates who place mines in front-of/behind-of team-vehicles are morons - they might have placed them there when things weren't NOT hot but now they ARE! Do you think I don't need to back up and avoid that AT missle? That I am backing up and shooting at a C4 tosser and avoiding him so I can run over an ILL placed mine - set by a moron-teamate? 

Every time I have killed by claymore/mine - it is always his fault:
a.) I needed a supply crate the battle got hot - and a mine was set - BOOM!
b.) Avoiding damage - and then end up getting blown up by a team-mates mine.
c.) Driving fast to an enemy base in a transport see the mind hit the brakes to late boom!
d.) A sniper sets a claymore thinking that he owns that roof/that no one else wants to use that posistion.
e.) Etc.

I only place mines in the heat of battle - when I can - and if it fails to blow them up - I toss a grenade at it - to blow the ILL placed mine up.

In fact I have jumped out of a burning tank - placed a group of mines down quickly - ran back as a sqaud moved onto my position - threw a grenade at the mines and killed the whole squad.

POINT is if you kill your team-mates by leaving live mines around - it is your fault! You are the one assuming they could easily avoid the placement.

its thinking like this that pisses me off. i play engy alot, i lay mines down along likely aproaches to a flag, i leave room for friendlys to pass the well marked mines.  i even type out MINES when a friendly is going where they are laid and yet those tards just ignore them, run over them and punish.  its my fault you ignored the mine warning????  how is that?  mines give you TWO warnings, a skull and cross bones ON the mine and a red box on the right side of your screen telling you your in a mined area?  youre so special you can ignore that? its my fault you have to turn slightly to avoid them?  you come on my server and do that, your gone.
i agree however that mining every open space where friendlys cant go by is stupid, but you can as you say, blow them up.  you lay mines in a very spread out line DOWN the road, not across it.  one every  30 virtual feet.  in shadows, crests, somplace where the enemy cant see them well.
i get alot of kills using mines, the enemy dosnt see them where i put them but friendlys can.  yet there are tards galore who love to have engy's kicked cause they cant fly full speed the whole way.  mines are defensive, not made for the "heat" of the battle zone. they are used to protect flags NOT in the immediate battle area. why allow an enemy to run full speed to you back flag when you can stop that by some well placed mines?  and if the enemy can see them so damn well and blow them up why cant your teamates?????  people who punish for ignoring the warning's should be kicked/banned. 
it irritates me when i see a whole line of mines crossing a road, they are easily seen by EVERYBODY and wont kill ANYBODY except tards who want to get the engy kicked for TK's.
mines on some maps can change the whole game if used properly, too bad there are way too many people with your view of the game.
the TK punish system is out of whack anyway.  people dont even think, they just punish. they chase the nade you tossed in the room with 4 enemy, you kill all 4 and your teamate, and they punish. your in a tank, they come flying head on into you in a jeep and die by crashing into you, they punish.  everybody in this game TK's it happens when FF is ON!  think about why you punish people. if they TK you for equipment, or just to be a butthead they SHOULD be punished, but for every accidental TK?  NOBODY is that good! and those that punish every TK should be locked out of the game.

QUOTE : topal63

No way man!

I "punish" everytime a teammate kills me with a worthless mine. They're worthless - because if a guy is heading for flag - most of the time the battle hasn't gotten supra-hot - he sees it - he shoots it - it blows up.

If I see any mine while casually moving around in a tank/apc I blow them up - no matter which team placed them - if I don't see them it is because I am engaged with the opposing team - and trying to stay alive.

But teamates who place mines in front-of/behind-of team-vehicles are morons - they might have placed them there when things weren't NOT hot but now they ARE! Do you think I don't need to back up and avoid that AT missle? That I am backing up and shooting at a C4 tosser and avoiding him so I can run over an ILL placed mine - set by a moron-teamate? 

I only place mines in the heat of battle - when I can - and if it fails to blow them up - I toss a grenade at it - to blow the ILL placed mine up.

In fact I have jumped out of a burning tank - placed a group of mines down quickly - ran back as a sqaud moved onto my position - threw a grenade at the mines and killed the whole squad.

POINT is if you kill your team-mates by leaving live mines around - it is your fault! You are the one assuming they could easily avoid the placement.

END QUOTE


1st. Most enemies DONT see enemy mines is my experience
2nd. becouse YOU are engaged in a  fight with the enemy, so you blow up strategic defenses of your teammate  ?
3rd. you ONLY place mines in the heat of the battle ??  Mines are strategic assets, although BF1942 and BF2 reduced them to throw away pizzas...

NOW , IF (big IF) i would follow your kind of logic , topal63:

1. if YOU are playing commander, and i was engeneer in your team, i would NOT repair your "dumb and ill-placed" assets if they are destroyed, if and  when you are not around to rapair them or have no supplies.
2. ïf you place your "worthless" tank in the wrong spot and the enemy damages it , it is "your fault it got damaged", i would NOT repair YOUR tank at the risk of getting shot while you sit nice and cosy inside it. (analogy: why should i care, you blow my mines away regardless)
3.  you just blow friendly mines that hinder you away with your tank or grenade ? What about a  little respect for teammates (engeneers) , or does the RED SKULL not appear in your view ?
4. you seem to use AT-mines yourself as some kind of throw-away-C4 pack, so what about strategic use of mines ?

btw. you also sound to me like the type of commander that gives supply crates to himself and says to his teammates "sorry (morons), supplies not available now"..

Thats what bothers me a lot lately, its all about : score, medals, points  , but only a small minority realizes this game could be about strategy and TEAMWORK !

Last edited by MajorHoulahan_MASH (2005-12-21 11:24:42)

MajorHoulahan_MASH wrote:

SECTION A
1st. Most enemies DONT see enemy mines is my experience
2nd. becouse YOU are engaged in a  fight with the enemy, so you blow up strategic defenses of your teammate  ?
3rd. you ONLY place mines in the heat of the battle ??  Mines are strategic assets, although BF1942 and BF2 reduced them to throw away pizzas...

NOW , IF (big IF) i would follow your kind of logic , topal63:

SECTION B
1. if YOU are playing commander, and i was engeneer in your team, i would NOT repair your "dumb and ill-placed" assets if they are destroyed, if and  when you are not around to rapair them or have no supplies.
2. ïf you place your tank in the wrong spot and the enemy damages it , it is "your fault it got damaged", i would NOT repair YOUR tank at the risk of getting shot while you sit nice and cosy inside it. (alanogy: why should i care, you blow my mines away regardless)
3.  you just blow friendly mines that hinder you away with your tank or grenade ? What about a  little respect for teammates (engeneers) , or does you RED SKULL not appear in your view ?
4. you seem to use AT-mines yourself as some kind of throw-away-C4 pack, so what about strategic use of mines ?

btw. you also sound to me like the type of commander that gives supply crates to himself and says to his teammates "sorry (morons), supplies not available now"..

Thats what bothers me a lot lately, its all about : score, medals, points  , but only a small minority realizes this game could be about strategy and TEAMWORK !

To pont #1 and #2 (SECTION A)
You are an inexeperiend player.

To point #3 (SECTION A)
Mines are worthless - they ARE NOT STRATEGIC ASSETS! (The patch made them worthless not me.)


To point #1  (SECTION B)
I dont expect you to fix them - I am already doing that - if I am commander - I am an engineer. It's a waste of a supply crate - especially if there is an enemy C4 spec-ops guy waiting for just such to happen (a crate drop).

To point #2  (SECTION B)
I don't expect you to fix a damaged tank - nor want you too.  9 times out of 10 I will need to back up even further and you will be standing behind me thinking you are doing good - then I back up and you punish me for a teamkill - DAMAGE occurs significantly faster then A REPAIR does. I would rather have you killing the enemy.

To point #3  (SECTION B)
Often inexperienced players mine the only base exit - thinking they are doing good by stoping incomming vehicles - but what they have done is bared the necessary exit. YES I always blow up the mines - because the are worthless and in the WAY!

To point #4  (SECTION B)
Mines are in NO WAY strategic - your inexpereince is showing here. And yes I have tossed grenade off of a roof at them (the mines I placed) - destroying an APC that would not have run over the mine(s). By the way C4 is way more effecitve in BF2 for destroying enemy assests - than mines are.

Your idea of teamwork and mine are different.
1.) The punish - does not bother me - it is an indicator that I need to be more careful about my play (if I can be). You are not learning from you punishes and you are taking the word "punish" personal - it is just a word used in a GAME! Those are your problems not mine.
2.) If you decide to take the word "punish" personal and not help out the team - that is your choice.
3.) Getting the oppenent ticket count to ZERO before yours is the object of the game - whatever leads to that is TEAMPLAY (and the team wins).
4.) etc . . .

Last edited by topal63 (2005-12-21 11:28:42)