BF2S Forums serious question

R3v0LuT!oN wrote:

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

Why protest the war in Iraq. Human beings are selfish animals by nature and NOBODY has lost a cunt hairs worth of their quality of life since 2003.  why do i see a bunch of kids waving their signs  in front of recruiting stations and doing protest walks blocking traffic.  I have more respect for the insurgent that detonates an IED than for all these new wannabe hippies.  I have an open mind though, so I wonder.  If you have felt the need to protest the war in Iraq, why?  I understand that there are sincere people out there against the war, but I think thats the minority.  Th majority of people I have come across that have participated in these types of events are for the most part ill inform and ignorant of the actual goings on of the war.  They base all their opinions on totally biased and inaccurate media sources.  it seriously makes me fucking sick.  I think its abunch of bored shit heads who wanna feel like they are a part of a new generation of hippies.  they dont really feel strong against the war, just rage against the machine if you will.

seriously the only people effected by this war in an adverse way are the citizens of Iraq and the soldiers/sailors/airmen/marines of our armed forces.  no draft.  no rationing. no black outs.  GET REAL FUCKOS!

heres your oppurtunity to change my mind about all the anti war sentiment.

I think you make a lot of unfair generalizations.  Sure there are a lot of people who are just anti-war because it's fashionable and not because they're informed.  There are just as many people (in fact, probably more) in this country who SUPPORT the war for even sketchier reasons.  I mean FFS how many people are there in this country who still believe Saddam Hussein had something to do with 9/11?  Or that we actually found the WMDs?

Also, what makes you so certain that the sources YOU get your information from aren't biased and inaccurate?  Which sources ARE FREE of biases and innaccuracies?  Can you name any?

My problem with the war in Iraq, besides the obvious loss of life on both sides (which I think should matter a great deal to any decent human being) is the fact that we're only furthering the hatred felt by Middle-Easterners toward the United States.  This hatred can and most likely will lead to more terrorists, and hence, more terrorist attacks, which is SUPPOSED to be what we're trying to prevent by intervening in the Middle-East in the first place.

fair enough and a pretty decent response.  True, I am making unfair generalizations, but you know what? I was shocked to see what young people are being fed at home.  city college is full of a lot of stupid people who think they know whats going on in the world and they really dont.  Im talking ofcourse about the people i see in my day to day life (and on this forum as well).


my sources:

left eye
right eye
left ear
right ear
both nostrils

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

GetSplit wrote:

well since ur so unselfish, how bout letting me borrow money to pay rent, and get a new car and pay my school loans.  No?  Well fuck you.  People worry too much about other countries suffering, we have plenty of poverty, crime, drugs and violence here on our own soil. I think Dog the bounty hunter is the only one doing anything about it.

we should fix our problems here before bitching about other peoples problems.  So I say fuck other people, I have to worry about MYSELF first, not people in other countries.  The game I'm playing is called life, if I sacrificed everything for everyone else, i'd be a monk or a saint or some shit.

No thanks.

Long story short, in my world, I'm more important than anyone and everyone.  Other than my friends and family, I could give a fuck if a stranger lives or dies, let alone a fuzzy little foreigner.

so, umm, why protest.  your reply has nothing to do with the OP.  have a super day


and fuck you right back

that post was for ironchef, i'm on ur side....fucker lol

GetSplit wrote:

I think the reason the economy is "good" when a Dem is in office, is because the republican before him puts things into action to fix the economy, and the results are not felt for a while.  So then people hate republicans for a shitty economy, and making them "take their medicine" and elect a Dem.  By that time, the republicans actions are beginning to take effect, and the economy increases.   Then the Dem, gets to reap the benefits, and destroy the economy for the next republican to come and fix.

But that weird theory just stems from an economics class I took where the prof. said "Sometimes politicians have to do things that people will like, such as raise minimum wage, eventhough its bad for the economy, and sometimes politicians have to do things people will hate, but is good for the economy."

I just took that idea coupled with the fact it takes forever for the gov't to do anything, and when they do something it takes awhile for the effects to be felt.

So with that logic, explain to me how current Republican policies (i.e. billions spent on the Iraq War and billions squandered on tax cuts for the wealthy) are supposed to secure a brighter economic future for us all?

GetSplit wrote:

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

GetSplit wrote:

well since ur so unselfish, how bout letting me borrow money to pay rent, and get a new car and pay my school loans.  No?  Well fuck you.  People worry too much about other countries suffering, we have plenty of poverty, crime, drugs and violence here on our own soil. I think Dog the bounty hunter is the only one doing anything about it.

we should fix our problems here before bitching about other peoples problems.  So I say fuck other people, I have to worry about MYSELF first, not people in other countries.  The game I'm playing is called life, if I sacrificed everything for everyone else, i'd be a monk or a saint or some shit.

No thanks.

Long story short, in my world, I'm more important than anyone and everyone.  Other than my friends and family, I could give a fuck if a stranger lives or dies, let alone a fuzzy little foreigner.

so, umm, why protest.  your reply has nothing to do with the OP.  have a super day


and fuck you right back

that post was for ironchef, i'm on ur side....fucker lol

I haven't discounted the obvious care we have not given to our own suffering by mentioning how I care for others, so why would you think that I don't care about our own impoverished?

Your attitude speaks for itself.  Your argument does nothing to counter mine.  Sorry you're so set on yourself.  You'll truly have a happy life, I'm sure.

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

IRONCHEF wrote:

Oh, one more thing about protesters....they are the salt of this country.  If it weren't for them, and the inspiration they leave on complacent citizens, the lesson of free speech and patriotism would surely be lost.

i see what your saying and I pretty much agree except for that last part.  you have to admit that is your opinion as well as my disagreeing with it is mine.  I find the average anti war protester to be an air head, willing to believe the first thing they hear and see and follow the crowd.  CODEPINK right?

Oh, don't get me wrong.  I see the same ass-backwards, overly enraged protesting clown doing it just to be a protester.  Some of these types include feminists, gay rights, anti-gay rights, and other less important groups (peta, etc).  There are protesters that do need a wake up call and there are protesters doing the exact thing our founding fore fathers would want them to do.  I, of course, support that latter.

I wish i didn't have a family sometimes so I could take the risk of voicing my dissent for this government...and eventually, if it got bad enough here, I would even risk the danger to them by doing so.

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

http://okimc.org/photos/albums/userpics … ally~0.jpg

yeah, the salt of the country.  see how stressfull this whole war in iraq is on our protesters

makes me want to vomit.

What exactly is it about that woman's exercising of her First Amendment rights that makes you want to vomit?  If you don't believe in these freedoms for every American, then you don't believe in them at all, my friend.

R3v0LuT!oN wrote:

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

http://okimc.org/photos/albums/userpics … ally~0.jpg

yeah, the salt of the country.  see how stressfull this whole war in iraq is on our protesters

makes me want to vomit.

What exactly is it about that woman's exercising of her First Amendment rights that makes you want to vomit?  If you don't believe in these freedoms for every American, then you don't believe in them at all, my friend.

no no no.  the constitution is my bible.  what I have an issue with is this:

shes sabotaging the seriousness of her dissent as well as pooping on the memories of soldiers that have already died (in my opinion).  holy fuck, shes protesting her anger towards the government or particpating a costume party.  how the fuck can i take vermin like this seriously for their beliefs when all i see at a protest is a bunch of people having GREAT time.  correct me if Im wrong but shouldnt dissent be something one takes serious if one is sincere.  how the fuck could some hold a sign that says 3000 dead troops or whatever and smiling and joking at the same time.  to me it seems like these bastards are using the lives of Iraqis and GI's to keep the good times rolling

im just asking why people protest.  1st amendment all the way

Last edited by GunSlinger OIF II (2006-11-02 10:37:44)

Some points regarding myself:

1) I do not take part in futile demonstrations protesting anything. They are largely pointless. Spending half an hour explaining your viewpoint to one person who doesn't share your view is worth a million hours of protesting.

2) I take on board all viewpoints. I think we're very lucky to have GS on this forum who can give us and has given us valuable insights into what has gone on and what is going on in Iraq.

3) My guess at why Americans are protesting is that they don't want to see their brethren killed engaged in what they see as a futile war initiated on falsehoods. That is noble enough. They may also take issue with their tax money being funnelled into said futile exercise. I'm sure there are a lot of bandwagon know-nothings though, don't get me wrong.

4) Most Europeans are of like mind when it comes to Iraq so the only time I come across opinions opposed to mine are on this forum. I feel strongly about all sorts of issues, even if i haven't 'lost a cunt's hair' as a consquence of events. We are all living in a global village here. We in the west get tarred with the one brush also. The actions of the USA and UK reflect badly on all of us westerners when we visit the rest of the world. That irks me as one of my primary loves in life is to travel. It is a bad day now that I have to explain to people that 'No, I'm not American' or 'No, I'm not British' to avoid being insulted or experiencing unfriendliness and general frostiness. I'm just thankful Ireland has such a good reputation across the entire globe.

5) One thing that drives my interest in conflicts in the middle east are the parallels that can be drawn between the history of Ireland and what is going on today and the empathy that results from that. I won't apologise for being vocal about issues in the middle east when it stirs deap-seated emotions in me even though I am not directly impacted upon by said issues.

6) When the US broke its traditional policy of not pre-emptively striking a target alarm bells rang in my head. Nothing is certain anymore. When the worlds most well armed nation can call any country a target or act unilaterally in what is, as I said, a global village - the effects are felt by us all, not just those in the region receiving the pounding or about to receive a pounding. We are all on edge.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2006-11-02 10:36:28)

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

thats my exact point.  where you see them being the minority of dissent, i see them being the majority of the protesting public.  people that are bored and want to make their voice heard for sake of just having their voice heard, not for sending an important message.  it takes a lot from to stay quit and just agree to avoid a confrontation coming from my side when some dipshit tries to give me the straight dope on Iraq.

Is that an observation based on facts, or just personal experience?  Because all of the people I know who protest are very well educated, informed people, who also have respectable day jobs.  Would it be fair for me to say that ALL protesters are equally educated and informed, just because the ones I've encountered are?  Of course not.  The same applies to your sweeping generalization.

CameronPoe wrote:

Some points regarding myself:

1) I do not take part in futile demonstrations protesting anything. They are largely pointless. Spending half an hour explaining your viewpoint to one person who doesn't share your view is worth a million hours of protesting.

2) I take on board all viewpoints. I think we're very lucky to have GS on this forum who can give us and has given us valuable insights into what has gone on and what is going on in Iraq.

3) My guess at why Americans are protesting is that they don't want to see their brethren killed engaged in what they see as a futile war initiated on falsehoods. That is noble enough. They may also take issue with their tax money being funnelled into said futile exercise. I'm sure there are a lot of bandwagon know-nothings though, don't get me wrong.

4) Most Europeans are of like mind when it comes to Iraq so the only time I come across opinions opposed to mine are on this forum. I feel strongly about all sorts of issues, even if i haven't 'lost a cunt's hair' as a consquence of events. We are all living in a global village here. We in the west get tarred with the one brush also. The actions of the USA and UK reflect badly on all of us westerners when we visit the rest of the world. That irks me as one of my primary loves in life is to travel. It is a bad day now that I have to explain to people that 'No, I'm not American' or 'No, I'm not British' to avoid being insulted or experiencing unfriendliness and general frostiness. I'm just thankful Ireland has such a good reputation across the entire globe.

5) One thing that drives my interest in conflicts in the middle east are the parallels that can be drawn between the history of Ireland and what is going on today and the empathy that results from that. I won't apologise for being vocal about issues in the middle east when it stirs deap-seated emotions in me even though I am not directly impacted upon by said issues.

6) When the US broke its traditional policy of not pre-emptively striking a target alarm bells rang in my head. Nothing is certain anymore. When the worlds most well armed nation can call any country a target or act unilaterally in what is, as I said, a global village - the effects are felt by us all, not just those in the region receiving the pounding or about to receive a pounding. We are all on edge.

great reading your replies cam.  and we are definately on the same page on this one, but on point 3, if you were to feel the atmosphere in one of these protests, youd think they were celebrating a birthday instead of condeming the deaths of innocent lives and military.  I think most of these people are band wagoners or who may just be so god damn polarized in their political views that black and white is all they see.

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

Why protest the war in Iraq. Human beings are selfish animals by nature and NOBODY has lost a cunt hairs worth of their quality of life since 2003.  why do i see a bunch of kids waving their signs  in front of recruiting stations and doing protest walks blocking traffic.  I have more respect for the insurgent that detonates an IED than for all these new wannabe hippies.

True, my quality of life hasn't changed a bit since you guys decided to invade Iraq but then it was the same before too. Whether you're there or not makes no difference to my life, which begs the question; why are you over there at all?

On another note, it appears your politicians agree. At what point do you guys start to question the reason you were sent there? Your presence is compounding the insurgency problem and one could argue your actions WILL start affecting our everyday lives the longer you remain in their country.

Most people are protesting precisely because their lives are unaffected either way. The only ones suffering are the Iraqi people, and your average human being will find issue with this. Call them hippies if you like, no doubt they'll call you a murderer, but remember this: You get to go home after your tour, the Iraqi people don't, and they have to live day to day with murders, bombings, no infrastructure and no security. You only get one pop at life and the majority do their best to make the most of it; why fuck it up for others?

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

R3v0LuT!oN wrote:

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

http://okimc.org/photos/albums/userpics … ally~0.jpg

yeah, the salt of the country.  see how stressfull this whole war in iraq is on our protesters

makes me want to vomit.

What exactly is it about that woman's exercising of her First Amendment rights that makes you want to vomit?  If you don't believe in these freedoms for every American, then you don't believe in them at all, my friend.

no no no.  the constitution is my bible.  what I have an issue with is this:

shes sabotaging the seriousness of her dissent as well as pooping on the memories of soldiers that have already died (in my opinion).  holy fuck, shes protesting her anger towards the government or particpating a costume party.  how the fuck can i take vermin like this seriously for their beliefs when all i see at a protest is a bunch of people having GREAT time.  correct me if Im wrong but shouldnt dissent be something one takes serious if one is sincere.  how the fuck could some hold a sign that says 3000 dead troops or whatever and smiling and joking at the same time.  to me it seems like these bastards are using the lives of Iraqis and GI's to keep the good times rolling

im just asking why people protest.  1st amendment all the way

All I can say is at least this wacky lady in her pink outfit is out DOING SOMETHING.  She could much more easily stay home and argue on internet forums, but what does that accomplish?

Last edited by R3v0LuT!oN (2006-11-02 10:47:14)