After stealing the idea from unnamednewbie, I decided to make a thread about it...
My vote goes to....
Sierra Leone
My vote goes to....
Sierra Leone
The Principality of Wisconsin
In theory: DPRK
In practice: Somalia
I make that distinction because Somalia (if you can even call it some kind of coherent entity), unlike the DPRK never professed to be some kind of utopia.
In practice: Somalia
I make that distinction because Somalia (if you can even call it some kind of coherent entity), unlike the DPRK never professed to be some kind of utopia.
Republic of Alberta
United States
Last edited by Inspect@hDeck (2006-10-22 18:20:39)
I'm living just fine here in the states.Inspect@hDeck wrote:
United States
everywhere that looks normal? but since were in the age of information, nowhere.
Anywhere in africa.
Anywhere in Africa except a country such as South Africa. Add the DPRK and then you got your countries to pick from.
Exactly. Dystopia doesn't mean anarchy, necessarily. The US is supported by a well defined class system, where those on the bottom support those on the top without any hope of ever escaping.JG1567JG wrote:
I'm living just fine here in the states.Inspect@hDeck wrote:
United States
Depends on what you define as a dystopia. Based on a few examples of what can be considered dystopia's here is a list:
So depending on how you define dystopia, is who you will find closest to a dystopia society.
The United States of America is really starting to show this aspect of a dystopia. The corp world in the US have a lot of effect on our government. Large companies, "support" people in the government that assist their company. Also, the average person is losing some of their rights because of the companies, look at the Net Neutrality proposal, phone companies want to limit the average person by persuading the leaders of the US to by "supporting" said leaders.A totally or near-totally socially privatized world without a democratic republican state or with a state that only serves the business sector - business and private contractors own and control all of society and social organization.
German is a good example of this when it was under Nazi control. Hitler made the people think that their government was better because it was based on the Aryan race. Also, USSR (most communist states) could also fall into this description. The USSR tried to say that communism was working, and everyone was doing better then before the communist took over. Doctor Zhivago is a good movie that shows this aspect. To summarize the movie in a few sentences, Doctor Zhivago was a wealth man before the revolution, but after the revolution he has to tear down a fence on the street just to say warm all the while the communist leaders are saying live is better then before.State propaganda programs and educational systems that scare most citizens into worshiping the state and its government, in an attempt to convince them to believe that life under the regime is good and just.
This description reminds me of most third world nations. Most of these nations would be better, and citizens would not lack key essentials, if the government would support new methods to solve their problems. Some of this nations are even getting support to create, adapt, or invite new ways to deal with their issues, but this funding is spent in other places instead of engineering.A lack of the key essentials of life for many citizens, as with food shortages. If the cause of this is clear, it is not natural disaster or crop failure, but deliberate engineering.
The USA again full fills this description. There are stories, countless stories, where people try to get off of Welfare, but they are held back. When they get a job, their welfare support is reduced or cut off. They then leave their job, because it is more profitable to stay on welfare. A lot of people who are on welfare in the US, choose to have more kids as a way to get a raise instead of getting an educations and a good paying job.A bloated welfare state, in which total freedom from responsibility has encouraged an underclass prone to any form of antisocial behavior, and productive contributors to society, particularly those trying to escape the underclass, are burdened with taxes punitive in effect, if not intent.
USSR, DPRK, Rome, USA and a lot more fall into this description. In Rome, the Cesar was considered a god, USSR put Lenin and Stalin's body on display, in the US people worship the president (Bill Clinton is a good example of this). Egypt's pharaohs are another example of this type of dystopia.A state figurehead that people worship fanatically through a vast personality cult.
So depending on how you define dystopia, is who you will find closest to a dystopia society.
That is a very dangerous point of view when higher classes pay a higher tax percentage.Bubbalo wrote:
Exactly. Dystopia doesn't mean anarchy, necessarily. The US is supported by a well defined class system, where those on the bottom support those on the top without any hope of ever escaping.JG1567JG wrote:
I'm living just fine here in the states.Inspect@hDeck wrote:
United States
*sigh* such ignorance.Bubbalo wrote:
Exactly. Dystopia doesn't mean anarchy, necessarily. The US is supported by a well defined class system, where those on the bottom support those on the top without any hope of ever escaping.JG1567JG wrote:
I'm living just fine here in the states.Inspect@hDeck wrote:
United States
I was waiting for some fucktard to say that.Inspect@hDeck wrote:
United States
I don't mean to pick words, but:Bubbalo wrote:
Exactly. Dystopia doesn't mean anarchy, necessarily. The US is supported by a well defined class system, where those on the bottom support those on the top without any hope of ever escaping.JG1567JG wrote:
I'm living just fine here in the states.Inspect@hDeck wrote:
United States
dys‧to‧pi‧a
–noun
a society characterized by human misery, as squalor, oppression, disease, and overcrowding.
A country with suburbs, hospitals, golf courses, "affirmative action," immigrant doctors and Mexican janitors doesn't necessarily fit that bill.
Last edited by unnamednewbie13 (2006-10-22 20:13:27)
china
China is doing alright for itself right now.
It's hard to pick what countries are but I'd say that Iraq is doing bad, nothing beats a sectarian civil war to show the world a dystopia, same with Somalia.
North Korea is a dystopia as well, I spose North Korea would take the prize.
It's hard to pick what countries are but I'd say that Iraq is doing bad, nothing beats a sectarian civil war to show the world a dystopia, same with Somalia.
North Korea is a dystopia as well, I spose North Korea would take the prize.
Phantom, did you do any research or do you know what the definition of a dystopia is? Depending on how you define it, the US is a dystopia, read my former post. In the US, people on welfare are encouraged to stay on welfare, because the system does not assist those who are trying to get off of it.Phantom2828 wrote:
I was waiting for some fucktard to say that.Inspect@hDeck wrote:
United States
I bet that you are probably a well to do middle class resident in the US. I came from a very welfare dependent single parent family. I lived rent free in government housing, we got food stamps, and we got a welfare check each month. My brother and my health care was paid for by the government. I remember once, when my mother tried to get off welfare. She got a job, the government stated that they would provide my mother with child care during this time. The first day on the job, they told her that our income from the welfare check would be reduced. She did the math, and saw that the amount of money she was going to make at the job was far less then what we were getting at the time on welfare. We would have be disqualified for assisted living, our food stamps would be reduced (then completely removed), and the amount of money from the welfare check would start to decline. Due to this, she quit her job, it was not possible for her to support two kids (both of us were under 12) and work.
I have another example of how the US government does not help those who are trying to help themselves. At 12, I moved to live with my dad, step mom, step brother, and step sister. My stepmother could not work due to health issues when I lived with them. So my dad was the only person who brought income into our house, other then the less the 100 dollars a month that my stepmother got from Social Security. He and my step mother tried to get some government assistance, they applied for food stamps. The government stated that my father was making to much money. At the time my dad was making enough yearly to support a household of only 2 or 3 people. We had a total of 5 people in the house. On top of this, my stepmother's check from Social Security was being reduced because of my dad's wages. It got to the point that the Social Security office was saying that they were over paying my stepmother, and that my dad and she had to repay that money, and they would take a certain amount of the money out each month. This went on for years.
There are countless stories like this all across the nation. You could go into any ghetto, or government assisted living area in the US and find them. I know personally, other people who like my mom, choose to try to get off welfare, but found out that it would hurt their family in the long run.
Personally, I think that if you are on welfare, you are given a certain amount for your family based on size. You are also given a percentage of this money each month until it is gone. Once it is gone, it is gone, you do not get any more government assistance (there would be some exception to this). Also, those people that are trying to remove themselves from the system, should get extra benefits, and have different phases where this benefits start to fade away. Well that is my 2 pieces of copper alloy.
Edit:
The US fits at least two of those. The lower class is oppressed. Remember Katrina, the lower class stated they were depressed, along with a certain race. Most urban areas are overcrowded. It may not be as dense as India or China, but the US has the third largest population behind the fore mentioned nations. The US does have some disease that can not be cured at this time. Cancers, Aids, certain STDs. Depending on where you at, you can live in a squalor neighborhood. The upper class may not see a filthy nation, but what about those people who live in the ghetto. Those who are in the lower class, who live in areas where they do not have grass in their front yard, just dirt, they see those conditions.unnamednewbie13 wrote:
I don't mean to pick words, but:
dys‧to‧pi‧a
–noun
a society characterized by human misery, as squalor, oppression, disease, and overcrowding.
A country with suburbs, hospitals, golf courses, "affirmative action," immigrant doctors and Mexican janitors doesn't necessarily fit that bill.
I know it is long, but read my first post. There are different types of dytopia nations. The US does fall under some of those descriptions.
Last edited by dubbs (2006-10-22 20:25:00)
Venezuela
lolMECtallica wrote:
Venezuela
oooo so im an unnamed newb now huh well **** u get your own ideas asshole, not only do you get ideas of my threads but then u call me a unnamed noob?!?
and i have to say ethopia
and i have to say ethopia
Granted, but all countries have some level of dystopic living. However, I just can't view American society as a whole to be a dystopia. It wouldn't be fair to other countries who are characterized by misery.dubbs wrote:
yada yada yada yadaPhantom2828 wrote:
I was waiting for some fucktard to say that.Inspect@hDeck wrote:
United States
http://forums.bf2s.com/viewtopic.php?pid=896980#p896980
What? I don't get it.rob777 wrote:
oooo so im an unnamed newb now huh well **** u get your own ideas asshole, not only do you get ideas of my threads but then u call me a unnamed noob?!?
[edit]Oh. He was referring to this post. However, after some thought, you are a noob. lol[/edit]
Last edited by unnamednewbie13 (2006-10-22 20:20:44)
ooo nvm i thought he was just doing opposite idea of my which country is closest to havng a utopia thread
i apolgize
i apolgize
According to what dictionary?unnamednewbie13 wrote:
dys‧to‧pi‧a
–noun
a society characterized by human misery, as squalor, oppression, disease, and overcrowding.
Regardless, dictionaries tend to fail on ideas/ideals and other words which go beyond a simple definition. There are varying interpretations of dystopia. Mine is a society in which inherently bad things (e.g. racism, sexism, classism etc.) have become systematic (the world of Gattaca springs to mind, probably because I'm currently studying it)
And are the golf courses accessible by all?unnamednewbie13 wrote:
A country with suburbs, hospitals, golf courses, "affirmative action," immigrant doctors and Mexican janitors doesn't necessarily fit that bill.
Let me emphasize that I stated, it depends on how you define dystopia. My first post list different ways to define a dystopia, and it list examples of how nations fall into these examples. I even put historical nations into the examples.unnamednewbie13 wrote:
Granted, but all countries have some level of dystopia living. However, I just can't view American society as a whole to be a dystopia. It wouldn't be fair to other countries who are characterized by misery.dubbs wrote:
yada yada yada yadaPhantom2828 wrote:
I was waiting for some fucktard to say that.
Let's take your dictionary.com definition and compare it to m-w.com definition.
In America a lot of people live fearful lives, they may not be dehumanized, but they are fearful. They are fearful of terrorist. They are fearful of the stock market dropping like it did in the 30's. They are fearful of war. The list can go on.m-w.com wrote:
1 : an imaginary place where people lead dehumanized and often fearful lives
M-w.com also defines dystopia as ANTI-UTOPIA. By the taking the definition of anti (opposite, not, no, etc) and utopia (a place of ideal perfection especially in laws, government, and social conditions). We see that every nation is a dystopia, because there is not one nation that is a utopia.
As I have stated in my first two post, it depends on how you define a dystopia. If you want to define it as a nation where it citizens are dehumanized, then I agree the US in a whole is not a dystopia. But if we define it as a nation that oppresses lower classes, but not upper classes, yes the US is a dystopia.