tindari
Member
+0|6605
I'd like to point out something everyone has overlooked.

The M95 states in its description that it is known to be able to shoot through the glass of a helicopter.

This isn't just an interesting real-life fact that EA was teasing us with; IT IS TRUE IN-GAME!

However, it ONLY works with a head-shot. If you head-shot someone in any aircraft or helicopter, it will kill the pilot, leaving the aircraft spinning out of control. Obviously, it's nearly impossible to do against a moving target, but I have sniped people out of the helicopter while they were hovering. I've also camped the places that helos and jets spawn, and pre-aimed my shot for a head-shot, waiting for the pilot to enter. The instant they enter, I can make the head-shot before their engines are warmed up enough for them to move.


If you miss your head shot, it will NOT damage the pilot though. Instead, the M95 does a small amount of vehicle damage (about 2 bars).

Long story short, the L96A1 is still a superior sniper rifle, but if you get bored at the Dalian Plant, it can be fun to sit up on top of the crane and kill unsuspecting helo pilots as they try to enter the chopper.

While we're on the topic of headshots; for non-sniper rifles, headshots can still be lethal with one hit, IF they are close enough to you. The F2000, for example, can insta-kill with a close-range headshot, as can the AK-101. I'm not sure what other weapons are capable of a close-range one-shot kill (besides shotguns), but beyond a certain range, the F2000 won't insta-kill, even with a headshot. Or perhaps the deviance is just so great that I've never made a headshot at a longer range. I should test it more, but it's darned hard to know where you hit someone with anything but a sniper rifle.
The_Jester
Member
+52|6687|Italy
Owl support requested, over
psycokiller05
Jihad God
+18|6789
the range i see on that you should not need bullet drop only time i use bullet drop is when the person is over 200meters away
psycokiller05
Jihad God
+18|6789

tindari wrote:

I'd like to point out something everyone has overlooked.

The M95 states in its description that it is known to be able to shoot through the glass of a helicopter.

This isn't just an interesting real-life fact that EA was teasing us with; IT IS TRUE IN-GAME!

However, it ONLY works with a head-shot. If you head-shot someone in any aircraft or helicopter, it will kill the pilot, leaving the aircraft spinning out of control. Obviously, it's nearly impossible to do against a moving target, but I have sniped people out of the helicopter while they were hovering. I've also camped the places that helos and jets spawn, and pre-aimed my shot for a head-shot, waiting for the pilot to enter. The instant they enter, I can make the head-shot before their engines are warmed up enough for them to move.


If you miss your head shot, it will NOT damage the pilot though. Instead, the M95 does a small amount of vehicle damage (about 2 bars).

Long story short, the L96A1 is still a superior sniper rifle, but if you get bored at the Dalian Plant, it can be fun to sit up on top of the crane and kill unsuspecting helo pilots as they try to enter the chopper.

While we're on the topic of headshots; for non-sniper rifles, headshots can still be lethal with one hit, IF they are close enough to you. The F2000, for example, can insta-kill with a close-range headshot, as can the AK-101. I'm not sure what other weapons are capable of a close-range one-shot kill (besides shotguns), but beyond a certain range, the F2000 won't insta-kill, even with a headshot. Or perhaps the deviance is just so great that I've never made a headshot at a longer range. I should test it more, but it's darned hard to know where you hit someone with anything but a sniper rifle.
This is not nesicerily true ak101 and f2000 you can head shot any one within viewing distance you just need to know your bullet drop
Nino-Uk
Member
+1|6600|London, UK
This is very informative, especially for a budding Sniper like me, good job
Trouble69
Member
+1|6830|WA, Australia

tindari wrote:

If you head-shot someone in any aircraft or helicopter, it will kill the pilot, leaving the aircraft spinning out of control.
I've managed to do that about half a dozen times on moving targets and there is nothing better than seeing a heli spin all over the place and getting two kills for one shot (in fact once it was four kills for the one shot on a transport heli pilot).
Trigger_Happy_92
Uses the TV missle too much
+394|6845

Trouble69 wrote:

tindari wrote:

If you head-shot someone in any aircraft or helicopter, it will kill the pilot, leaving the aircraft spinning out of control.
CLEAR!!! Alright buddy, your good to go.
why must you revive threads
oSKo
Member
+0|6559
Hello everyone, I´ll just revive the thread to give a link to my findings

Those are:
-There is bullet drop.
-bullet velocity is 1000 m/s for all handguns, with the exception of the support guns, who have 500 m/s.
-At ~350m you have to aim about 60 cm above the enemy´s head to get a headshot.
-the bullet drop is consistent with a acceleration due to gravity of about 10 m/s^2 (or 9.81 m/s^2).
-this all of course must be seen in the context with the cone of fire, which makes the whole mess a probabilistic thing.

You can read it all here:
http://www.totalbf2.com/forums/showthread.php?t=35977
Jemme101
M24 Abuser
+99|6696|Valley of the Dragons
Allready knew this for a year now, but some people still live in denial. Txs for posting that thread again I guess.
oSKo
Member
+0|6559
I know , actually I did those tests over a year ago. The cool thing is, that all the deniers can test it themselves and get visual confirmation of bullet drop, as I removed all deviation and recoil modifiers on the M24, added a better zoom, and tracers. This way, everyone can see the round flying and dropping live on their screen.

Everyone who wants to see it with their own eyes "just" have to change the usrif_m24.tweak in the \weapons\handheld directory of their \Battlefield 2\mods\bf2\Objects_Server.zip file to reflect those changes (search for "damage 95" and replace everything including that line with the text below):

GeometryTemplate.setMaterialReflectionScale 0 0 0 0.4
GeometryTemplate.setMaterialReflectionScale 0 0 1 2
GeometryTemplate.setMaterialReflectionScale 1 0 0 0.25
GeometryTemplate.setMaterialReflectionScale 1 0 1 2
GeometryTemplate.setMaterialReflectionScale 1 1 0 1
GeometryTemplate.setMaterialReflectionScale 1 1 1 0.25
GeometryTemplate.compressVertexData 1
GeometryTemplate.maxTextureRepeat 16
ObjectTemplate.activeSafe GenericFireArm usrif_m24
ObjectTemplate.creator TDA-1:tda
ObjectTemplate.modifiedByUser nfe
ObjectTemplate.saveInSeparateFile 1
rem ---BeginComp:WeaponHud ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent WeaponHud
ObjectTemplate.weaponHud.weaponIcon Ingame\Weapons\Icons\Hud\USRIF_M24.tga
ObjectTemplate.weaponHud.altWeaponIcon Ingame\Weapons\Icons\Hud\USRIF_M24_mini.tga
ObjectTemplate.weaponHud.selectIcon Ingame\Weapons\Icons\Hud\Selection\USRIF_M24.tga
ObjectTemplate.weaponHud.hudName "KILLMESSAGE_WEAPON_m24"
ObjectTemplate.weaponHud.guiIndex 0
ObjectTemplate.weaponHud.altGuiIndex 52
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp:SingleFireComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent SingleFireComp
ObjectTemplate.fire.addFireRate 0
ObjectTemplate.fire.fireInCameraDof 1
ObjectTemplate.fire.busyUntilButtonRelease 1
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp:DefaultAmmoComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultAmmoComp
ObjectTemplate.ammo.magSize 5
ObjectTemplate.ammo.nrOfMags 7
ObjectTemplate.ammo.reloadTime 6
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp:SoldierBasedRecoilComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent SoldierBasedRecoilComp
ObjectTemplate.recoil.hasRecoilForce 0
ObjectTemplate.recoil.recoilForceUp CRD_UNIFORM/5.2/4/0
ObjectTemplate.recoil.recoilForceLeftRight CRD_UNIFORM/-1/1/0
ObjectTemplate.recoil.zoomModifier 0.25
ObjectTemplate.recoil.recoilGraphFrameCount 14
ObjectTemplate.recoil.recoilGraphExponent 7
ObjectTemplate.recoil.recoilGraphTotalMovement 0.1
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp:HelpHud ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent HelpHud
ObjectTemplate.HelpHud.helpStringKey "HUD_HELP_WEAPON_HANDHELD_SNIPERRIFLE_CONTROLS_switchToScopeView"
ObjectTemplate.HelpHud.helpSoundKey "USRIF_M24"
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp:SoldierDeviationComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent SoldierDeviationComp
ObjectTemplate.deviation.setFireDev 0.0 0 0.0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.minDev 0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.setTurnDev 0 0 0 0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.setSpeedDev 0 0.0 0.0 0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.setMiscDev 0.0 0.0 0.0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.devModStand 0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.devModCrouch 0.0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.devModLie 0.0
ObjectTemplate.deviation.devModZoom 0.00
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp:DefaultSoundComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultSoundComp
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp:DefaultAnimationComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultAnimationComp
ObjectTemplate.animation.useShiftAnimation 1
ObjectTemplate.animation.shiftDelay 1.8
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp:DefaultZoomComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultZoomComp
ObjectTemplate.zoom.zoomDelay 0.125
ObjectTemplate.zoom.zoomLod 1
ObjectTemplate.zoom.addZoomFactor 0
ObjectTemplate.zoom.addZoomFactor 0.01
ObjectTemplate.zoom.changeFovDelay 0.08
ObjectTemplate.zoom.zoomOutAfterFire 1
ObjectTemplate.zoom.disableMuzzleWhenZoomed 1
rem ---EndComp ---
ObjectTemplate.geometry usrif_m24
ObjectTemplate.setCollisionMesh usrif_m24
ObjectTemplate.mapMaterial 0 Collision_Material 68
ObjectTemplate.floaterMod 0
ObjectTemplate.hasMobilePhysics 0
ObjectTemplate.hasCollisionPhysics 1
ObjectTemplate.physicsType Mesh
ObjectTemplate.aiTemplate usrif_m24AI
rem -------------------------------------
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_Fire1P
ObjectTemplate.setPosition 0/0.0251192/0.617667
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_Fire1P_Outdoor
ObjectTemplate.setPosition 0/0.0259557/0.620327
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_Fire3P
ObjectTemplate.setPosition 0/0.0248084/0.616961
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_BoltClick
ObjectTemplate.setPosition 0/0.0228307/-0.165919
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_TriggerClick
ObjectTemplate.setPosition 0/-0.0405023/-0.183669
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_SwitchFireRate
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_Reload1P
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_Reload3P
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_Deploy1P
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_Deploy3P
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_Zoom
ObjectTemplate.setPosition 0/0.0284011/-0.141757
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate e_muzz_sniper
ObjectTemplate.setPosition 0/0.0271032/0.612798
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate e_shellejection_rifle
ObjectTemplate.setPosition -0.00302492/0.0299253/-0.0828321
ObjectTemplate.setRotation -3.4436/3.75679/1.22417
rem -------------------------------------
ObjectTemplate.animationSystem1P Objects/Weapons/Handheld/USRIF_M24/AnimationSystem1p.inc
ObjectTemplate.animationSystem3P Objects/Weapons/Handheld/USRIF_M24/AnimationSystem3p.inc
ObjectTemplate.projectileTemplate usrif_m24_Projectile
ObjectTemplate.velocity 1000
ObjectTemplate.itemIndex 3
ObjectTemplate.delayToUse 1.6

ObjectTemplate.create GenericProjectile usrif_m24_Projectile
ObjectTemplate.modifiedByUser nfe
ObjectTemplate.createNotInGrid 1
ObjectTemplate.createdInEditor 1
rem ---BeginComp:DefaultCollisionComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultCollisionComp
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp:DefaultDetonationComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultDetonationComp
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp:DefaultProjSoundComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultProjSoundComp
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp:DefaultRicochetComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultRicochetComp
rem ---EndComp ---
rem ---BeginComp:DefaultPenetrateComp ---
ObjectTemplate.createComponent DefaultPenetrateComp
ObjectTemplate.penetrate.allowSolidPenetration 1
ObjectTemplate.penetrate.allowLiquidPenetration 1
rem ---EndComp ---
ObjectTemplate.floaterMod 0
ObjectTemplate.hasMobilePhysics 1
ObjectTemplate.hasCollisionPhysics 1
ObjectTemplate.physicsType Point
ObjectTemplate.collisionGroups 8
ObjectTemplate.material 38
rem -------------------------------------
ObjectTemplate.addTemplate S_usrif_m24_Projectile_Looping
rem -------------------------------------
ObjectTemplate.timeToLive CRD_NONE/1/0/0
ObjectTemplate.material 38
ObjectTemplate.tracerScaler 30
ObjectTemplate.maxTracerScaler 30
ObjectTemplate.minTracerScaler 1
ObjectTemplate.tracerSizeModifier 5
ObjectTemplate.tracerTemplate p_tracer_g
ObjectTemplate.tracerInterval 1
ObjectTemplate.hasOnTimeEffect 1
ObjectTemplate.minDamage 1
ObjectTemplate.damage 95
Of course, I highly recommend a backup of the original files before messing with them.
KORdaemon
Member
+2|6567
im not sure how this would help but theres a video on youtube about bullet drop....

http://youtube.com/watch?v=kV0p32Wv1Io
Ryan
Member
+1,230|7039|Alberta, Canada

Whoa, bad graphics. And to think I had graphics like that before.
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6968|PNW

Todd_Angelo wrote:

Mj.Blindfisch wrote:

And sniping in BF2 is very different to other games,sometimes really frustrating(M95,uuaargh!!)... But hey,sometimes I hit stuff,sometimes I don't...
Yeah, that's the problem in a nutshell
Sometimes you do hit stuff. Sometimes it doesn't even count. I don't even remember how many times I've seen dust puffs from a supposed M95 head shot, resulting in no kill or even damage, when a shot from an L96, M24 or even an SVD would've finished it.
Marinejuana
local
+415|6781|Seattle
There is definitely bullet drop, for a 300 meter shot I aim maybe 3-4 pixels above.

i can tell you that how good your video card is makes a huge difference for the long shots because i just upgraded and suddenly 200-300 meter sniping is remarkably easy (6800xt to 7900gt). Don't even try to snipe unless you have a good computer and connection.

Last edited by Marinejuana (2006-12-25 01:26:03)

Skorpy-chan
Member
+127|6541|Twyford, UK
Maan, don't you have anything better to do than calculate bullet drop in a somewhat buggy online game?

No? Fine. Good work on it, I will attempt to +1 you for following proper experimental procedure.
Jemme101
M24 Abuser
+99|6696|Valley of the Dragons
If you want to do some long distance snipering in BF2 it is important to understand the game dynamics and how to use them in shots over distances greater than 150 meters.
Skorpy-chan
Member
+127|6541|Twyford, UK
I don't doubt that, but it's still slightly sad that he put so much time into it.

Of course, I can't really criticise. I can recognise most of the equipment by silhouette and by ear pretty much instantly.
Jemme101
M24 Abuser
+99|6696|Valley of the Dragons
Eh ........ you completely lost my with that last reply.
Todd_Angelo
Leukocyte
+336|6823|Warlord

Jemme101 wrote:

Eh ........ you completely lost my with that last reply.
Me too.

Skorpy-chan wrote:

I don't doubt that, but it's still slightly sad that he put so much time into it.
I did the tests to try to sort things out for myself, went a bit further and posted it here in hopes it would help other players ...if you want to talk sad, what's really sad is the 800 or so hours I've played BF2, and the thousands of hours we all play it, don't you think? Although at least it's not an MMORPG.

At the time there was a lot of debate/confusion about this issue. Bullet drop is long proved now but there's other important stuff here for those who snipe regularly; believe me, it sure as hell helps to know that sometimes when you 'miss' it's not your aim that's at fault, so you don't need to adjust it to try to compensate in future encounters, which might make you actually miss. Ditto with other classes too really, since this is one of the first threads here as far as I know that clearly shows deviation, as well as crappy hit detection so we don't have to go by, "I swear this one time I shot a guy and..."
recklr
Member
+0|6526
Look, any half decent sniper knows that there is bullet drop. And it differs depending on what angle you’re shooting from. But if you really want some good info here it goes, "Don't go back and look for the sniper that just killed you" he already knows the your gonna come back and position yourself for a retaliation shot. And if he's good then he knows where those spots are at. So save yourself some time from getting PO-ed after getting killed 3-4 times in a row .

Thats my contribution to the sniper community.
Todd_Angelo
Leukocyte
+336|6823|Warlord

recklr wrote:

Look, any half decent sniper knows that there is bullet drop.
You think so? Do a search for threads around the time I did this (and before, lots of chuckles to be had from much older threads) and see all the debate about whether there is bullet drop at all and whether it's more for rifle X than rifle Y.

recklr wrote:

And it differs depending on what angle you’re shooting from.
Roger that.

recklr wrote:

But if you really want some good info here it goes, "Don't go back and look for the sniper that just killed you" he already knows the your gonna come back and position yourself for a retaliation shot.
Nah. My main job on the field, after defending flags, is to kill enemy snipers. You don't have to go to the same spot to get 'em back (in fact unless you're really good, or cocky, it's a mistake to).

One decent sniper on a team can take out an entire squad of snipers on the crane in Sharqi, along with their medic supports, singlehandedly. And what's more you can do it from two or three places where you cannot be countersniped (by the guys on the crane)

recklr wrote:

Thats my contribution to the sniper community.
Given that you appear to have joined specifically to make post could we see your sniper stats? See how you put your wisdom into practice.
some_random_panda
Flamesuit essential
+454|6586

I miss Call of Duty 2's sniper rifles.  There is no bullet drop, bullet time or wind and the scope is spot on.  People made insane headshots with those.
recklr
Member
+0|6526

Todd_Angelo wrote:

You think so? Do a search for threads around the time I did this (and before, lots of chuckles to be had from much older threads) and see all the debate about whether there is bullet drop at all and whether it's more for rifle X than rifle Y.
Quit living the past dude, It wasn't so long ago when people drilled a hole in your head to rid the evil spirits causing your headache. We (humans) get smarter as the time progresses by so let natural selection do its job by allowing them to get conquered for there stupidity.


Todd_Angelo wrote:

Nah. My main job on the field, after defending flags, is to kill enemy snipers. You don't have to go to the same spot to get 'em back (in fact unless you're really good, or cocky, it's a mistake to).
Thats what I said, don't go back to retaliate. Your only gonna get killed again and then PO-ed and find yourself stalking this 1 sniper for who knows how long.


Todd_Angelo wrote:

Given that you appear to have joined specifically to make post could we see your sniper stats? See how you put your wisdom into practice.
What is it a crime to join so i can post something?? Look me up if you please PID 61324465. Not like I said I was gods gift to snipers, but can sure as hell hold my own. I play at Mashtuur City 24/7 Insomnia365. Come gets some if your crazy!!!
Jemme101
M24 Abuser
+99|6696|Valley of the Dragons

recklr wrote:

Look, any half decent sniper knows that there is bullet drop. And it differs depending on what angle you’re shooting from.
Apparently a lot of the people, not just "snipers", still live in denial. I have been repeating the same post about bulletdrop for 11 months now. That was ever since the official word on drop was mentioned in that article/interview with one of the developers of BF2.
Bulletdrop does NOT differ with the angle you are shooting from btw. Bulletdrop differs from the DISTANCE and HEIGHT DIFFERENCE you have to your target.
recklr
Member
+0|6526

recklr wrote:

Quit living the past dude, It wasn't so long ago when people drilled a hole in your head to rid the evil spirits causing your headache. We (humans) get smarter as the time progresses by so let natural selection do its job by allowing them to get conquered for there stupidity.
This quote also applies to you Jemme101.
Christ sake 11 months ago and people still ask the same question, its your fault if you decide to entertain there comments. I know people still question this theory, who cares let them wonder about this while we kill them and improve our stats. Its like saying that prisoners don't get anymore violent while they are incarcerated. We know that they do (statistics prove it) so while fags hard liners say they don't and argue with the world about it. We are off finger banging there girls while they debate.

Piont is let them live in denial and wonder all they want. I'll just keep popin em!!

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