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2006-08-14 15:57:02
HURLEY
Ima Crunchatize you.
+170|6926|The Lou

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

God did it!
No he didn't!


(Just thought I'd get it out of the way for ya...)

now on with the serious discussion...
i really want to beat the shit out of you for quoting yourself 3 times, but.... seeing as how your an abortion survivor i feel bad for you.

edit: 2 times.

Last edited by HURLEY (2006-08-14 15:57:38)

2006-08-14 16:09:52
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|6825|SE London

UnOriginalNuttah wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:

The most effective way of looking at this problem is concerning the entropy of the universe as a system. Which unfortunately cannot explain anything prior to the Big Bang. There are theories about what happened before the Big Bang, but they are not based enough in fact for me to consider them valid.
But that's exactly what string theory attempts to do.  It just puts it down fluctuations with a 'parallel dimension'.  It adds an unnecessary level of complexity in my opinion:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/1270726.stm wrote:

The action of the Universe takes place in five-dimensional space. Before the Big Bang occurred the Universe consisted of two perfectly flat four-dimensional surfaces.

One of these sheets is our Universe; the other, a "hidden" parallel universe.

According to the Princeton researchers, random fluctuations in this unseen companion universe caused it to distort and reach towards our Universe.

The floater "splatted" into our Universe and the energy of the collision was transformed into the matter and energy of our Universe in a Big Bang.
All that talk of splatting floaters sounds like a load of shit to me

If there are random energy fluctations occuring between the two flat 4-dimensional spaces then why could the same fluctuations not occur within a single flat 4-dimensional space?  Why could fluctionations not reach the density required to create matter, which would draw more matter/energy due to gravity?  Why is a parallel universe needed?  Occam's Razor leads me to believe that 'parallel universe' part of string theory is a scam to make it all sound a lot more interesting and get some lovely funding.
It doesn't sound very plausible to me either, but then I'd have to see something more solid about it, with some maths involved.

That's exactly what I don't like about a lot of string theory, it's extremely complicated and doesn't seem quite right (although there are a lot of very appealing bits in it), although thats exactly what Einstein said about quantum theory, which has been pretty much conclusively (in as much as it is possible to, it is now unanimously accepted amongst physicists) proven.

*edit*

I don't like the fact you need 26 dimensional spacetime to make quantum equations balance in String theory either - what I DO like is the idea of supersymmetry.

Last edited by Bertster7 (2006-08-14 16:19:55)

2006-08-15 03:48:11
.:XDR:.PureFodder
Member
+105|7073

AllmightyOz wrote:

Did the bang create the different elements or were they all compressed into one ball of matter?
I'm not very up to date with the string theory, but from the big bang model;

Initially there were no elements. everything was so hot that the electrons and protons were all flying around independently. As things expanded and cooled they were able to form Hydrogen atoms. It was really only till clumps of hydrogen had formed under gravitational attraction to form stars that the other elements appeared. In stars Hydrogen is converted to helium then to other elements and releases vast amounts of heat. The abundance of heavier elements on Earth is due to the solar system being formed out of the remains of a huge star that made heavier elements via these nuclear processes and eventualy went supernova, the violent death of a huge star. The reminants then re-condensed to form the planets and our sun.
2006-08-18 00:58:27
buttersIRL
Member
+17|6841
In the beginning there was Nothing....then it exploded !
at that moment all history for this universe was written, every atom was set on it's course and things are unfolding in the only way they ever could.

nah don't really beleive that but though it sounded good.  If we ever found out how the universe was created people would just be going round making universes every where.  Finding parking is hard enough already I don't want a whole universe moving in next door, taking our jobs and our women and our strawberry smoores !
2006-08-18 01:22:57
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|7015|PNW

UnOriginalNuttah wrote:

I'll start this thread with a theory: Is assuming that time began with the Big Bang a legitimate supposition, or an assumption born of the human ego?
I'd have to say that the origin of the first set of time is a completely different topic. However, if time as experienced is to be directly associated with our universe, then it would still have to be older than the 'Big Bang'. Of course, you would have to accept the theory of multiple universes or, at least, exo-universal space.

Last edited by unnamednewbie13 (2006-08-18 01:26:07)

2006-08-18 01:28:14
KuSTaV
noice
+947|6755|Gold Coast
No idea, and i'll put my money on it that we will never know...
noice                                                                                                        https://static.bf2s.com/files/user/26774/awsmsanta.png
2006-08-18 01:53:01
schakl
Member
+21|6932

AllmightyOz wrote:

I think the big bang theory is much more believeable than creationism, but there are some things I cannot have not found the answers too:

Where does one assume the energy came from to start the initial bang?

Where was the matter located before the bang?

Did the bang create the different elements or were they all compressed into one ball of matter?

"matter is neither created or destroyed", so where did everything come from?

+1 to anyone that can answer all of those questions.
Boah, hard questions, I'll give a try.

1) Where does one assume the energy came from to start the initial bang?
OK, I fail at the start (lol). One might say all energy was concentrated on a singularity, but that is not possible. Mr. Hawkings once tried to explain it with imaginary time, so if space = 0, time is endless. Read the book 'a short history of time', maybe you understand it better than me (lol).

2) Where was the matter located before the bang?
It was energy. On quantum level matter can be 'made out of energy' i.e. matter is generated in vacuum if there is a big amount of energy on that location. I don't know the english word, the german is 'spontane Paarbildung' where an electron and a positron is build out of nothing (i.e. energy).

3) Did the bang create the different elements or were they all compressed into one ball of matter?
Just Hydrogen and Helium was build after the big band (one or two protons), all other elements were breed in stars. So we all were part of a sun once.

4) "matter is neither created or destroyed", so where did everything come from?
Thats wrong, ENERGY can't be created/destroyed. Matter can be transformed to energy. It happens in a nuclear bomb, where 3% of matter is converted to energy.

Hope that is quite correct.
Hawk

 

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