BF2S Forums Christianity

Daysniper wrote:

Go ahead, try to challenge me. I have evidence to support me. You don't. Come on, I dare you...

I'm confused.

Try to challenge you on what, exactly?  That you get annoyed when Christians give you grief about being Jewish?  Or that you're Jewish?  Or your definition of creationism?  I believe you on all counts because I don't have any reason not to, but if you have evidence to support yourself, post it. 

*NOTE*  DO NOT POST A PICTURE OF YOUR CIRCUMCISED PENIS!

Maybe some shots from your Bar Mitzvah would be proof enough that you're Jewish.  And a link from wikipedia about creationism should suffice on that front.

Sorry, I think I overreacted. I deleted my post. I will be withdrawing from this argument.

Thanks

JaMDuDe wrote:

Almost everything about earth shows that it did not happen by random chance. Read a good book like The Privileged Planet and they explain through pure science how earth shows the signs of intelligence.

So if there are 1000 random chances, and only one of them ends up being the final result, what are fairly dumb bald apes going to think about it? For ages we thought it was destined to be like it always is (and might be) but we soon grew out of the dark ages and learned better.

Sorry chum, game over. Continue? (Y/N)

agreed...need I say more? btw, the article is kinda scary...

Anfidurl wrote:

JaMDuDe wrote:

Almost everything about earth shows that it did not happen by random chance. Read a good book like The Privileged Planet and they explain through pure science how earth shows the signs of intelligence.

So if there are 1000 random chances, and only one of them ends up being the final result, what are fairly dumb bald apes going to think about it? For ages we thought it was destined to be like it always is (and might be) but we soon grew out of the dark ages and learned better.

Sorry chum, game over. Continue? (Y/N)

I dont even get what your trying to say. Maybe you could reword it for me so i can understand.

10 random chances of what? I dont get how 10 random random chances could be the end result of something then we wouldnt know the other 9. Are you talking about religion or earth or how we "evolved" ????????

JaMDuDe wrote:

10 random chances of what? I dont get how 10 random random chances could be the end result of something then we wouldnt know the other 9. Are you talking about religion or earth or how we "evolved" ????????

Err. If 10 chances of something happening, each chance being something completly different, would we know of the other nine if one happened? I think not. Bah. I hope you get my drift.

Skruples wrote:

We already knew we weren't on an average planet. We know of 9 planets, and ours is the only "good" one, thus in the 'known universe' of planets ours is very unaverage. However, you seemed to be trying to use that video as evidence that life should not exist naturally, and that is an error. At best, even if we accept for the moment that everything it says is true, it only provides evidence that we should be the only life in this galaxy. As I said before, if we include the entire universe and still say that the odds of life are 1x10^-15, life is still likely to happen somewhere. It just happened to happen here.

It's true in a sense, we only have found life on Earth at the moment.


******* Not a flame against Skruples, more likely a support of his theories *********

Both Mars and Venus are pretty much equal good as Earth to have life on it, being within the right distance from this type of star.
The problem is that Venus have a really bad case of Global Warming at the moment, it's too hot there for us.
And Mars is the opposite, not enough Greenhouse Effect to keep it warm enough for things like us to live there.

And then we have the problem with the composition of the atmosphere there, but then again, life that would grow and live there would probably be adapted to that environment.
Just look at harsh environments on earth, we have stuff living in superheated sulfer-laden water, and they will die if we move them to plain water.

It’s all about adaptation, or a God with a good sense of humor.
Or whatever you believe created and still mutates or maybe upgrades the different types of things that exist on earth.

The bottom line is that all three planets could have life on them if the conditions on the actual planets would be acceptable.
Keep in mind that Earth can be the next Venus if the Global Worming continues, a change of climate for a planet can go pretty quickly, and it’s more or less reversibly.


3 out of 9 is pretty good in my point of view, then again our solar system might be a really weird one compared to all the millions millions millions solar systems out there…..


/Toxic

Make the distinction, please.

We are arguing against decrepit, illogical theories put out by you and others.

Vub wrote:

We are all born naive and sinful

We are born as sinners???? WTF? Where did that come from? What sin have we committed fresh from the womb?

Vub wrote:

Think about these questions. Being a believer you've got nothing to lose. However, if you are not a believer, and it happened to be true, then what have you set yourself up for?

So if we don't believe in your God, but follow another religion like the majority of the world, we're also screwed?

Vub wrote:

DoctorFruitloop wrote:

Vub wrote:

We are all born naive and sinful

We are born as sinners???? WTF? Where did that come from? What sin have we committed fresh from the womb?

Vub wrote:

Think about these questions. Being a believer you've got nothing to lose. However, if you are not a believer, and it happened to be true, then what have you set yourself up for?

So if we don't believe in your God, but follow another religion like the majority of the world, we're also screwed?

I meant firstly that we're born sinful because we would commit sin without knowing it. I'm not saying that we've sinned in the womb. I don't want to answer the second question because for those who won't accept the answer it's an attack on their freedom of belief.

Fair enough, and on the second point I thought the whole "Your religion is wrong thing was just that" but I'll leave it at that, don't want to turn this into a flame war.

Thanks for answering.

Anfidurl wrote:

Chuckles wrote:

There are lots and lots of people that are converted as an adult, so I don't think you can lay it all on the feet of impressionable youth.

Ah, but if it wasn't for the youth, who would age and then take in those handfuls who decided to join up? You see the quandry?

I know a few who were converted: they were all converted in times of dire need, where they needed something to believe in.
For me, it's pretty much case closed

T0xicboy wrote:

Skruples wrote:

We already knew we weren't on an average planet. We know of 9 planets, and ours is the only "good" one, thus in the 'known universe' of planets ours is very unaverage. However, you seemed to be trying to use that video as evidence that life should not exist naturally, and that is an error. At best, even if we accept for the moment that everything it says is true, it only provides evidence that we should be the only life in this galaxy. As I said before, if we include the entire universe and still say that the odds of life are 1x10^-15, life is still likely to happen somewhere. It just happened to happen here.

It's true in a sense, we only have found life on Earth at the moment.


******* Not a flame against Skruples, more likely a support of his theories *********

Both Mars and Venus are pretty much equal good as Earth to have life on it, being within the right distance from this type of star.
The problem is that Venus have a really bad case of Global Warming at the moment, it's too hot there for us.
And Mars is the opposite, not enough Greenhouse Effect to keep it warm enough for things like us to live there.

And then we have the problem with the composition of the atmosphere there, but then again, life that would grow and live there would probably be adapted to that environment.
Just look at harsh environments on earth, we have stuff living in superheated sulfer-laden water, and they will die if we move them to plain water.

It’s all about adaptation, or a God with a good sense of humor.
Or whatever you believe created and still mutates or maybe upgrades the different types of things that exist on earth.

The bottom line is that all three planets could have life on them if the conditions on the actual planets would be acceptable.
Keep in mind that Earth can be the next Venus if the Global Worming continues, a change of climate for a planet can go pretty quickly, and it’s more or less reversibly.


3 out of 9 is pretty good in my point of view, then again our solar system might be a really weird one compared to all the millions millions millions solar systems out there…..


/Toxic

You are absolutely right. But if life could develop and adapt to Venus or Mars (well, it already has adapted and died on mars ), then theoretically it could adapt anywhere, comets, asteroids, the gas giants, even the TNOs like Pluto, Xena, Quaoar, and Sedna! If it can a adapt to a harsh condition of heat, what is there to say it can't evolve to be resistant of cold as well. This is why astrobiology is such a hot topic right now.We keep proving ourselves wrong on where things can and can't live.

Oh, and just because I'm a nerd, its either 8 planets, 10, or unknown. if pluto counts, then so does "Xena" (2003 UB313), if it doesn't, then there are only 8. If "Xena" counts, then there are likely larger TNOs out there. This is what the IAU is debating at this very moment. We should have an answer by next year, but don't get your hopes up.

Last edited by Daysniper (2006-07-20 05:20:46)