Whats that supposed to mean?
Poll
Are you a Christian?
| I would like to be | 50% | 50% - 157 | 50% | 50% - 157 | ||
| I don't want anything to do with that! | 55% | 55% - 174 | 44% | 44% - 140 | ||
| Total: 314 | ||||||
I think he means that it's not very strong evidence.
What is the evidence that Jesus was sent by God, because for any evidence he was sent by God to be credible it relies on there being incontrovertible evidence that God exists, and I think we've already established that's not the case, hence the whole "faith" thing.
What is the evidence that Jesus was sent by God, because for any evidence he was sent by God to be credible it relies on there being incontrovertible evidence that God exists, and I think we've already established that's not the case, hence the whole "faith" thing.
Halelujah!DoctorFruitloop wrote:
I think he means that it's not very strong evidence.
What is the evidence that Jesus was sent by God, because for any evidence he was sent by God to be credible it relies on there being incontrovertible evidence that God exists, and I think we've already established that's not the case, hence the whole "faith" thing.
And this is why there are WARS because of religion [REligious Wars]
Doesnt it sound a little illogical for you to want beings as dumb as humans to be able to "measure" God? Jesus himself is evidence for God, he was/is God. The JESUS INSTITUTE can answer more of your questions if youd like.
Check this out, far more believable than your fiction baesd religious bull...
http://www.venganza.org/
http://www.venganza.org/
Last edited by ashleyhall (2006-07-12 08:27:57)
At the end of the day, no one is right and no one is wrong... It is all about belief and faith, if you have it or if you don't.
I just believe that a person should have the right to believe what they want to and not be condemned for their decision, it is no ones right to force an opinion or belief on to another person.
My father in law (who is a christian vicar) does not sit there and judge people who are not christians - he doesn't force christianity down peoples throats who don't believe or have faith. So why do other people need to force their self opinionated thoughts on to others?
I will leave it there as this debate has been going on for longer than we have been alive and will surely still be going on until after we die, and personnally I'm not educated enough on the subject to make a justified comment.
I just believe that a person should have the right to believe what they want to and not be condemned for their decision, it is no ones right to force an opinion or belief on to another person.
My father in law (who is a christian vicar) does not sit there and judge people who are not christians - he doesn't force christianity down peoples throats who don't believe or have faith. So why do other people need to force their self opinionated thoughts on to others?
I will leave it there as this debate has been going on for longer than we have been alive and will surely still be going on until after we die, and personnally I'm not educated enough on the subject to make a justified comment.
It's beings as dumb as humans who need some fantastical invisible father figure to disguise all their problems and hide them from the drudgery and pointlessness that is the human condition.JaMDuDe wrote:
Doesnt it sound a little illogical for you to want beings as dumb as humans to be able to "measure" God? Jesus himself is evidence for God, he was/is God. The JESUS INSTITUTE can answer more of your questions if youd like.
PS 'Jesus' DOES NOT consitute evidence of 'god' - that is fanciful rubbish. Explain to me in unambiguous language, using absolute irrefutable evidence, how some hyped up jewish freedom fighter constitutes evidence of 'god'.
ev·i·dence ( P ) Pronunciation Key (v-dns)
n.
A thing or things helpful in forming a conclusion or judgment.
Last edited by CameronPoe (2006-07-12 08:30:04)
He was God. He came and fulfilled the prophecies and performed miracles. But of course to you those things are just lies and tricks.
No, you're deluding yourself with circular arguments. "Jesus is proof of God's existence"? How does that work?
You have said that there is a lot of evidence that Jesus was sent by God. Give my one piece of evidence from the "lot".
You have said that there is a lot of evidence that Jesus was sent by God. Give my one piece of evidence from the "lot".
There were prophecies that he was coming hundreds of years before he came. Last i checked normal humans cant do that.
JaMDuDe - All you've done is make a statement. You haven't provided evidence. I even gave you a desciption of what evidence is. He was 'god'. Oh right - I guess he is then!!!! Pretty f*cking lame.JaMDuDe wrote:
He was God. He came and fulfilled the prophecies and performed miracles. But of course to you those things are just lies and tricks.
He performed miracles did he? Wooaah! Cool! That's amazing. I bet that was a hit with the ladies! His wine into water stunt would have been great at parties too. And who needs a surf board when you can walk on water! Your blatant disregard for the 'laws' of logic, common sense and what can and cannot be done is astounding.
PS If Jesus was 'god' then that means he was his own father, which in turn means that he got his own mother up the duff!!!! Incestuous little b*stard!!!
Last edited by CameronPoe (2006-07-12 08:38:38)
So the evidence is the reports of 4 guys (Mathew Mark Luke John) who didn't even write their testimony on it till 20-50 years after it had happened none of which we have original copies of, just a copy of a copy of a copy of a translated copy of a copy..... Oh and the web site also mentions a two other reports which don't say he was the son of/is god or that he was resurrected from the dead. All religions have the exact same second hand unreliable proofs. The evidence for Evolution is just a little more comprehensive.JaMDuDe wrote:
Doesn't it sound a little illogical for you to want beings as dumb as humans to be able to "measure" God? Jesus himself is evidence for God, he was/is God. The JESUS INSTITUTE can answer more of your questions if you'd like.
Last I checked any human could read an ancient prophecy and attempt to mould themselves into fitting the criteria for proving the prophecy correct. Ridiculous. Think before you write man.JaMDuDe wrote:
There were prophecies that he was coming hundreds of years before he came. Last i checked normal humans cant do that.
Show me some evidence, that is all I ask.JaMDuDe wrote:
There were prophecies that he was coming hundreds of years before he came. Last i checked normal humans cant do that.
You have made the statement that there is lots of evidence, I ask for one example of it.
Ok, there is nothing that i can give you that can make a scientific fact that Jesus was God 2000+ years ago. Several sources show that he performed miracles, fulfilled prophecies and rose from the dead after he was crucified. Most of the people who recorded these things wanted to accurately record history and had nothing to gain for lying about it.
Look at these prophecies http://christiananswers.net/dictionary/ … ecies.html Those arent normal vague prophecies and a lot of them couldnt be staged after reading it by any person.
Look at these prophecies http://christiananswers.net/dictionary/ … ecies.html Those arent normal vague prophecies and a lot of them couldnt be staged after reading it by any person.
Last edited by JaMDuDe (2006-07-12 08:46:53)
Lots of people make lots of prophecies and lots of people become obsessed with these prophecies that they see them come true even is they don't.JaMDuDe wrote:
There were prophecies that he was coming hundreds of years before he came. Last i checked normal humans cant do that.
Nostradamus made a whole bunch of crazy predictions that didn't come true, but people still just decided that they were true anyway.
What sources?JaMDuDe wrote:
Ok, there is nothing that i can give you that can make a scientific fact that Jesus was God 2000+ years ago. Several sources show that he performed miracles, fulfilled prophecies and rose from the dead after he was crucified. Most of the people who recorded these things wanted to accurately record history and had nothing to gain for lying about it.
Look at these prophecies http://christiananswers.net/dictionary/ … ecies.html Those arent normal vague prophecies and a lot of them couldnt be staged after reading it by any person.
The beauty of Christianity is that you have to believe in what you can't prove. It's part of the humility of knowing that God is greater than you.
For me this has little to do with science. This has to do with logic, reason and common sense. Have you ever asked yourself questions like this:JaMDuDe wrote:
Ok, there is nothing that i can give you that can make a scientific fact that Jesus was God 2000+ years ago. Several sources show that he performed miracles, fulfilled prophecies and rose from the dead after he was crucified. Most of the people who recorded these things wanted to accurately record history and had nothing to gain for lying about it.
1) Why'd he choose to 'arrive' in the middle east? What was so special about them?
2) Why didn't he wait until there was a means of globally communicating his message, say via the internet?
3) Why'd he overlook Europe, Africa, Australia, Asia and the Americas?
4) Why would a supposedly benevolent 'god' allow famine, natural disasters, poverty to occur?
5) In 2000 years will people be worshipping characters from 'The Lord of the Rings' trilogy of books?
6) What did getting getting the shit kicked out of him and getting nailed to a cross show? That he could take a good kicking? How would something like that absolve people of sin?
7) Why are there myriad versions of bibles and bible scriptures, all with differing accounts of what happened?
8) Why should you trust a document written under the auspices of Emperor Constantine, a pagan, 4 centuries after the supposed incidents occurred?
the cruncher...
9) Why would he leave it possible that people on earth might doubt his divinity?
I could go on but...
Last edited by CameronPoe (2006-07-12 09:16:01)
I'm not disputing that, but JaMDuDe made the mistake of telling us he had lots of evidence and sources to prove this, that and the other.G3|Genius wrote:
The beauty of Christianity is that you have to believe in what you can't prove. It's part of the humility of knowing that God is greater than you.
Each to their own. I'm not trying to say you're wrong, it's just not for me.
But if I say I have proof that my car has four wheels, I'll be haapy to back it up with that proof. If I'd never seen a car before, and wasn't even sure if cars existed, I'd be pretty dumb to make a statement that I've got proof they have four wheels, and I'd look a total idiot if my evidence for the existance of cars was a bike.
Nuff said.
I get it. cool beans cheersDoctorFruitloop wrote:
I'm not disputing that, but JaMDuDe made the mistake of telling us he had lots of evidence and sources to prove this, that and the other.G3|Genius wrote:
The beauty of Christianity is that you have to believe in what you can't prove. It's part of the humility of knowing that God is greater than you.
Each to their own. I'm not trying to say you're wrong, it's just not for me.
But if I say I have proof that my car has four wheels, I'll be haapy to back it up with that proof. If I'd never seen a car before, and wasn't even sure if cars existed, I'd be pretty dumb to make a statement that I've got proof they have four wheels, and I'd look a total idiot if my evidence for the existance of cars was a bike.
Nuff said.
not a magician, lots of the bible was mistranslated (it was translated pretty soon too, so thats why its been wrong for quite some time...) A guy wanted to back up his regime with the bible, and therefore changed bits of it... The original has long since been lost...JaMDuDe wrote:
It all comes down to your choice. If you want to believe he was just an incredibly nice guy and and one of the greatest magicians of all time you can. Theres a lot of evidence he was sent by God, but if you dont want to see it you wont.Konfusion0 wrote:
actually, there is no evidence that Jesus was sent by god... There is evidence that he lived, but that is the only evidence in that direction that we have... Then again, for me to believe that something exists, there has to be evidence for it, not against it...JaMDuDe wrote:
Evolution is science. Thats not what i ment. Ashley said life evolved through science. Life did not evolve through the observation, identification, description, experimental investigation, and theoretical explanation of phenomena.
Cameron, theres not a shred of evidence that shows he doesnt exist. There is evidence that he exists. He sent his son here about 2000 years ago and Jesus was prophecied about hundreds of years before he came. Irreducible complexity, YOUR consciousness, the impossibility of spontaneous generation, the perfection and order of everything and more all point to a creator. He gave you free will and it all comes down to YOUR choice.
Evolution is science and its backed up by a lot of evidence. But spontaneous generation was too and it was just as accepted by scientists.
Please cite your source when you say something so volatile.Konfusion0 wrote:
not a magician, lots of the bible was mistranslated (it was translated pretty soon too, so thats why its been wrong for quite some time...) A guy wanted to back up his regime with the bible, and therefore changed bits of it... The original has long since been lost...
I will try to find it again... I had it, but lost it when I reformatted my computer...G3|Genius wrote:
Please cite your source when you say something so volatile.Konfusion0 wrote:
not a magician, lots of the bible was mistranslated (it was translated pretty soon too, so thats why its been wrong for quite some time...) A guy wanted to back up his regime with the bible, and therefore changed bits of it... The original has long since been lost...