Pages: 1 2

 

2006-06-22 08:51:11
Mj.Blindfisch
Bulletdrop-Buddha
+338|6907|Germany
Hi!
I've been playing with my mouse settings a bit because all the tips of how to set your dpi and stuff are more or less not based on actual knowledge of the technology rather than just playing with it until it suits you.

I'm not even sure if my theory about it is correct,but it is based on the tech demo of the Razer boomslang(it's been a few years since I saw that,can't seem to find the flash on the net anymore) and what I understand under the definition Dots per Inch(resolution,not speed).

But just read this and tell me what you think about it,I'm gonna give it a proper testing tonight.

So,here we go:
Everybody says that switching your DPI to 400 for sniping is awesome and you can push it back to 2000 DPI when in a tank...but with 400 or even 800 DPI you get what I like to call "skipping pixels"-effect.(At least I got it on several computers with several different games on several different screen resolutions,sometimes really annoying,sometimes not really dramatic.)
See Fig 1.1 :
https://x2.putfile.com/6/17210222029.jpg
This is what happens on long range with a low DPI setting,you want to aim for the head and it's not possible to exactly place your crosshairs right on it without moving(using the keyboard).That's because the head is between 2 steps(dots!).
So more dots per inch = more steps for the mouse(more resolution).
See Fig 1.2 :
https://x2.putfile.com/6/17210213754.jpg
This is basically how the boomslang tech demo explained it.
The black dot represents the player with his rifle(top view).
The black lines are the aiming-steps of the mouse with 800 DPI,the black and red lines represent the aiming-steps of the mouse with 2000 DPI.(Does everybody understand this?It's hard to make it even simpler than that. )

So a lot more precision with the 2000 DPI......then why would I turn down my DPI to 400 for sniping rather than leaving it on 2000 and just turning the speed down?
There's no reason to buy a freaky 2000 DPI mouse if I use it on 400 DPI anyway,or is there?
That means that all you guys with copperheads or G5s are wasting money if you are running it on low DPI settings,believing that this is precision.


So,that's my idea about this.

Discuss,flame,appreciate,research further,love or hate it....

Last edited by Mj.Blindfisch (2006-06-22 16:11:38)

2006-06-22 08:58:08
uber73
Member
+188|6962|Brisbane
decent mice let u change dpi/sensitivity "on the fly"....  ie, u can switch from really accurate, really slow, precise sniper settings instantly to tanky-tanky fast movement.  thats where a good mouse comes in.
2006-06-22 09:10:06
Mj.Blindfisch
Bulletdrop-Buddha
+338|6907|Germany

uber73 wrote:

decent mice let u change dpi/sensitivity "on the fly"....  ie, u can switch from really accurate, really slow, precise sniper settings instantly to tanky-tanky fast movement.  thats where a good mouse comes in.
Yeah,I know,I have a Razer Copperhead myself.

But when my idea of how DPI work is correct the usual method of turning down your DPI to 400 for sniping is basically giving the mouse less points to aim at(which leads to bad precision,see skipping pixels effect).

The question I still have is why it gets slower with less DPI,if I set my Razer to 2000 DPI and make the pointer speed totally slow it even gets slower when I switch to 400 DPI,although I just change the resolution.

When you are working with photoshop or 3DMax you quickly see why low DPI are not good,it's impossible to hit single pixels because the cursor always jumps over it.
So why this false belief that turning DPI down equals better accuracy?
Every cheap mouse with 400 DPI could do the job as well....
And what are you actually changing with sensitivy?
In my Razer setup I have sensitivity,pointer speed and DPI.....

I think my theory is right,if I get no more skipping pixels effect while long range sniping it should be true...

Last edited by Mj.Blindfisch (2006-06-22 09:11:04)

2006-06-22 09:23:31
max
Vela Incident
+1,652|6778|NYC / Hamburg

let me explain it.

even when at 400 dpi the "resolution" of the mouse is much higher than the screen. So in order to move my pointer on the screen by 1 pixel (which would be the smallest unit of movement here) the mouse actually moves several "dots".

So any skipping i would get is purely due to a too low resolution of the game (i had that problem when i was sniping with my new G5 on 800x600 screen resolution).

then i can up my resolution to 1000 or so for normal ground pounding and 2000 for tanks and similar.

Furthermore the resolution is not really turned down. in fact only the software in the mouse changes the speed of the pointer to 1/5th (for 400dpi) of the actual measured speed. (check it by putting the mouse on your leg - it's basically impossible to use a 400 dpi mouse on my legs, but it's no problem (same speed, characteristics,... as on desk) when the G5 is set at 400 dpi)

Last edited by max (2006-06-22 09:26:01)

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2006-06-22 11:14:34
Mj.Blindfisch
Bulletdrop-Buddha
+338|6907|Germany

max wrote:

let me explain it.
.....(lot of stuff to read)....
Hmm,sounds reasonable....but it doesn't explain exactly why the G5 is better than the standard mouse with 400 DPI if they have the same settings...I don't understand why it should differ.(My mom's cheap microsoft mouse works on my leg. )

I have set my mouse to 2000 DPI now and the ingame settings are quite low(0.2 for infantry) and it feels a lot smoother than skipping between 2000 and 400 DPI(how I used to do it).My monitor is set to 1024x768,but I got the skipping pixel effect on 1600x1200 with a cheap mouse too...

Any explanation for that?
2006-06-22 11:20:49
LivelyToaster
Member
+60|6930|Sacto, CA
I'm running bf2 at 1280 x 1024 with everything on high and 2x aa and at 400 m with my mouse on the lowest dpi setting it'll go, I can line up a head shot. (Note the resolution and setting aren't meant to brag, just posting the info in case it makes a difference to anyone) The only time I have a problem getting a headshot is when I leave my mouse on the higher settings and I bring up the scope and it starts swinging all over the place because I'm not used to the higher speed yet.

btw - I believe the difference between the cheap mouse and the expensive mouse has to do with the laser (assuming that the mouse you have is laser not optical) and it's sensitivity. Both mice on the same dpi would show that the mouse with the laser reacts quicker and more precisely than the cheap $5 mouse that came with the computer. Not sure about this. Just a guess.

Last edited by LivelyToaster (2006-06-22 11:23:20)

2006-06-22 11:22:57
SargeJp
Member
+87|6960|Canada
low dpi settings is mostly for low sensitivity gamers.
2006-06-22 11:29:02
Mj.Blindfisch
Bulletdrop-Buddha
+338|6907|Germany

SargeJp wrote:

low dpi settings is mostly for low sensitivity gamers.
Hmm,then I can be considered a high sensitivity gamer.
All my buddies can't handle my mouse because it's too sensitive(not fast,it's a moderate mouse speed).

But when you all say that it doesn't matter which DPI you use the high tech laser mice would be just a scam...
But anyways,I'm happy with my settings now,2000 DPI,max sensitivity and a decent pointer speed.
2006-06-22 11:38:43
Lucien
Fantasma Parastasie
+1,451|6863
The whole DPI thing is rediculous, I've kept detailed records of what my mouse sensitivity is. I value my 'snap aiming' ability and don't intend to lose it when i royally f*ck up my reflexes by changing my mouse sensitivity. Play at one sensitivity and get used to it!
https://i.imgur.com/HTmoH.jpg
2006-06-22 11:43:11
Rev0
Member
+6|6865
with my G7 i use 1600DPI for everything and it does me fine
2006-06-22 14:52:54
Mj.Blindfisch
Bulletdrop-Buddha
+338|6907|Germany
I just had some nice rounds on Wake,my new settings are awesome!!

The in-game sensitivity is set very low(0.2 for infantry,much higher for vehicles),my Copperhead is set to 2000 DPI,max sensitivity and a pointer speed which I find is just right for me(for the "snap aiming" ability,like SargeV1.4 called it.).

There's no real need for a on-the-fly sensitivity control now,it's always set to highest DPI (=precision?),the in-game settings for vehicles are what's different.
For infantry I have a relatively slow movement(I snipe a lot),in a tank or humvee I have very fast movement,but it's set to 2000 DPI all the time,no need to switch anything if you have set it through the settings in BF2.
Aiming at long range is a lot smoother now compared to 400 DPI settings,too bad I didn't test this earlier.
For me this setting seems to be a lot better than the usual on the fly changing crap.

If you are just using 400 DPI for sniping because you read somewhere that people do it this way - try my method to see the difference...maybe you get a positive surprise.

Last edited by Mj.Blindfisch (2006-06-22 15:50:54)

2006-06-22 16:17:09
ssonrats
Member
+221|6855
Here's my 2 cents,

*DPI- Dot's Per Inch

*2000dpi = 2000 dot's in 1 inch of your screen, so i would assume that more dots - more precise, but that just isn't the case, maybe you can have 2000 DPI and adjust  the acceleration so it is still at 2000 DPI but smoother to control.
2006-06-22 16:20:56
Mj.Blindfisch
Bulletdrop-Buddha
+338|6907|Germany

ssonrats wrote:

Here's my 2 cents,

*DPI- Dot's Per Inch

*2000dpi = 2000 dot's in 1 inch of your screen, so i would assume that more dots - more precise, but that just isn't the case, maybe you can have 2000 DPI and adjust  the acceleration so it is still at 2000 DPI but smoother to control.
Yes,the way I've set it now is way smoother,it's hard to describe what has changed but it's definitely better this way.
I just can tell everybody to give it a try yourselves.
2006-06-22 18:18:10
Todd_Angelo
Leukocyte
+336|6837|Warlord
Good topic Mj.Blindfisch. I'm thinking of getting a G5 and I was bothered by the low-DPI-for-sniping thing, didn't ring true and what you describe is what I was worried might be the case. I'll have to try things for myself, see how it 'feels' but other than perhaps changing up for speedy turret swivels I think it'll be set at one resolution.
2006-06-22 19:16:13
Cursed You
Member
+64|6798|Idaho
K since I snipe a lot and it does me good... I'll just post my opinion...

First off settings...
Resolution: 1024x768
Mouse: Logitech Trackman FX  (they dont make that shit anymore.)

Its about 20 dpi since its a roll ball.  I feel I have a better control over it, but it gets kind of stuck and skips pixels.  I cant really make a shot without moving (on the keyboard) to adjust and realign my shot.  If the sniper thinks he sees you, the last thing you want to do is move and make him sure.  Which is why I do LT paranoid squats.

When I replace this mouse, I will have a Copperhead, and I will use high 1600-2000 settings because Ive used one before, and once I got a hang of it, I was able to take control and line up shots.  I didnt feel a skipping pixel effect as I do with my current mouse.

I do believe in the skipping pixel effect, because Im a victim of it. 

Good topic, +1


P.S. I would add more to my post but my brain is still a little fried from being around my stinky friend today.
2006-06-23 03:00:35
Mj.Blindfisch
Bulletdrop-Buddha
+338|6907|Germany
Thx for the karma and the positive replies...
It seems that nobody is really sure about how the technology exactly works and what determines the accuracy of the mouse movement...but my idea seems to be really close,my mouse movements now are absolutely precise and super-smooth.
And even the box of the Copperhead agrees with me :
https://x2.putfile.com/6/17304562072.jpg
2006-06-23 11:29:00
SargeJp
Member
+87|6960|Canada

SargeV1.4 wrote:

The whole DPI thing is rediculous, I've kept detailed records of what my mouse sensitivity is. I value my 'snap aiming' ability and don't intend to lose it when i royally f*ck up my reflexes by changing my mouse sensitivity. Play at one sensitivity and get used to it!
Yes but sensitivity and DPI is not the same thing
2006-06-23 11:36:00
Lucien
Fantasma Parastasie
+1,451|6863
X CM mouse movement = Y CM on screen

that stays the same when you change the DPI?
https://i.imgur.com/HTmoH.jpg
2006-06-23 11:37:39
Nyte
Legendary BF2S Veteran
+535|6962|Toronto, ON
Here's the real lowdown:

The DPI term is used loosely for the high end mice (It is an adoption from the older days of mousing).

In reality, there is NO skipping of pixels in the high end mice.  The pixel skipping is limited to the refresh rate of your mouse (USB Mice go as high as 125 Hz which is sufficient).

What most of you are referring to with regards to DPI is ancient.  Back in the days of Microsoft Intellimouse, this was the case, a 400 DPI mouse will actually skip pixels.  But these days, with laser mice, there is no noticeable skipping because the mouse will always operate at the highest refresh rate.

At least on the G5, the "precision" of 400 DPI versus 1600 DPI is EXACTLY the same.  The difference is essentially the pointer speed.


Just remember, DPI is an ancient term that is used only for marketing.  When you see DPI these days, it means "pointer speed".
Alpha as fuck.
2006-06-23 11:50:28
Not
Great success!
+216|6787|Chandler, AZ
And Nyte beat me to it.
2006-06-23 14:45:00
Mj.Blindfisch
Bulletdrop-Buddha
+338|6907|Germany
Does anyone have a website link where they explain that?Or should I just blindly believe Nyte?

Anyways,I like my settings now,I've got one high-sensitivity setting and the differences are set in the bf2 ingame settings,no need to change anything on the fly.

And as I already said,I wasn't sure about the whole DPI issue,but for me 2000 DPI settings feel a lot smoother than 400 DPI....
2006-06-23 15:22:25
iamtheoneneo
Member
+16|6880
i have a microsoft comfort 3000 mouse, it cost a fair bit but i feel it is worth it, plays are easier to fly now than my old mouse (logitech laser) and sniping feels so much more natural. its 1000 dpi - and its good enough for me

Last edited by iamtheoneneo (2006-06-23 15:24:25)

2006-06-23 16:25:51
DoubleSidedTape
Member
+8|6899|New York

ssonrats wrote:

Here's my 2 cents,

*DPI- Dot's Per Inch

*2000dpi = 2000 dot's in 1 inch of your screen, so i would assume that more dots - more precise, but that just isn't the case, maybe you can have 2000 DPI and adjust  the acceleration so it is still at 2000 DPI but smoother to control.
It's not per inch of screen, but per inch of mousepad.
2006-06-27 06:40:23
Tunacommy
Member
+56|6831|Massachusetts, USA

Mj.Blindfisch wrote:

Does anyone have a website link where they explain that?Or should I just blindly believe Nyte?

Anyways,I like my settings now,I've got one high-sensitivity setting and the differences are set in the bf2 ingame settings,no need to change anything on the fly.

And as I already said,I wasn't sure about the whole DPI issue,but for me 2000 DPI settings feel a lot smoother than 400 DPI....
Hey Blindfisch.....I am struggling with the same thing with my Copperhead.....glad to have found your post.

I would like to try and copy what you did.  I am going to turn up all the settings on the mouse....and then you change the "sensitivity" settings in the options/control part of the game right?  I would want to turn the sensitivity DOWN as low as possible in the in game settings for non vehicle movement right?  This will, in effect, slow my pointer down, but keep my dpi up? 

Then for vehicle movement in the in game settings, I would turn the sensitivity up?  I guess I am a little confused on the "sensitivity".

In the Razor setup....there were also some settings (forget them now) that you could turn up or down.....not knowing what they were, I turned them all the way up too.....I wish I remembered them right now....
2006-06-27 07:20:02
Mj.Blindfisch
Bulletdrop-Buddha
+338|6907|Germany

Tunacommy wrote:

I would like to try and copy what you did.  I am going to turn up all the settings on the mouse....and then you change the "sensitivity" settings in the options/control part of the game right?  I would want to turn the sensitivity DOWN as low as possible in the in game settings for non vehicle movement right?  This will, in effect, slow my pointer down, but keep my dpi up? 

Then for vehicle movement in the in game settings, I would turn the sensitivity up?  I guess I am a little confused on the "sensitivity".

In the Razor setup....there were also some settings (forget them now) that you could turn up or down.....not knowing what they were, I turned them all the way up too.....I wish I remembered them right now....
Ok,here's my setup:
Razer options:1000Hz polling rate,2000 dpi,sensitivity 10 (max),windows pointer speed 2.1
Battefield options: Sensitivity for infantry 0.2,all the others a bit higher(gotta find out for yourself)

Personally I think it's a lot smoother than with 400 dpi,but opinions are like assholes,everybody's got one.

 

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