Investment

2022-04-02 03:18:58

#1401

unnamednewbie13: Moderator; +2,053|6770|PNW

My point isn't that the video wasn't relevant to the 50s, a decade it was made in. It's that it has limited use in terms of today: modern relevance being the thing you advised your kids to pay attention because of? A bit sanitized even in terms of its own decade, I might add.

Do they even make this kind of video anymore? I feel like the closest analogue would be some lifehacks/tedtalks compilation. Who would you get as the narrator?

Should we start educating kids in advance of desertifications and shoreline loss? Skills for nomads in the 2060s.

2022-04-02 08:59:20

#1402

SuperJail Warden: Gone Forever; +635|3718

The point was that class exist and will affect your life in profound ways though it is possible to better yourself through hard work and a bit of luck. I didn't just put the video on and walk away.

We had a class discussion about class and how it may have affected their lives so far. There was a writing assignment tied to the lesson too that I won't include since it is my own creation.

A TED talk would go so far over their heads. I think that would have lost the class quicker than the relatable story of three high school youth.

You just think it isn't relevant since it is three straight white men and not one white gay guy, a white lady, and Will Smith.

https://media1.popsugar-assets.com/files/thumbor/4M21ZonNgOF5YO1UrxdFs-hA2Ok/350x0:2764x2414/fit-in/2048xorig/filters:format_auto-!!-:strip_icc-!!-/2022/02/16/108/n/46712211/2f989d62620da6871c0ad3.44973456_/i/fresh-prince-bel-air-cast-then-now.jpg

Last edited by SuperJail Warden (2022-04-02 09:01:47)

2022-04-02 10:09:38

#1403

unnamednewbie13: Moderator; +2,053|6770|PNW

I wasn't even pointing out how white the video was. It's less relevant because circumstances have changed. It would be easy to look at that high school educated character with *checks post* his comfy, peak office job and comfy house and figure the lesson is that it's all easy enough to achieve the good enough lifestyle, when these days, you achieve less with more.

I know you do special ed or whatever, but if we're talking economic mobility, but maybe in general high school kids should be respected with the truth. My JROTC instructors were viciously blunt on that stuff and investment/finances, and the kids paid attention. It wasn't a required subject. No other class brought it up, not even civics where that stuff could have had some peripheral relevance.

I have no educator's doctorate but I think students tend to disengage when there is such minimal or dismissive interest in them or their futures. Maybe instead of pointing them towards the army, you could point them to your school's JROTC program. There isn't even an obligation to join the military after graduation, but if you do it could be a neat +1 to enlisted rank.

Be the NPC that points people out to item buffs.

Last edited by unnamednewbie13 (2022-04-02 10:30:37)

2022-04-02 11:24:48

#1404

DesertFox-: The very model of a modern major general; +794|6683|United States of America

Just stay with that line of thinking, Mac. You can illustrate how the desirability of social climbing from working class upbringings, but trying to not lose sight of where one comes from if they do get there.

2022-04-02 13:41:00

#1405

SuperJail Warden: Gone Forever; +635|3718

Newbie must be a parent because he just doesn't understand

2022-04-02 17:21:28

#1406

uziq: Member; +492|3450

class is definitely still a major aspect to all of our lives, but the hierarchies and structuring forces are undeniably different nowadays to 1950. the entire material basis of the economy has changed, for one. it figures that class in a largely Fordist economy, of working-classes on the factory line, middle-managers or technicians, bosses and owners, etc, obviously won’t pertain in the same ways now.

it’s that dread word ‘intersectionality’, certainly. but also so much work has been done on the analytical concept of ‘class’ itself since the 1950s. bourdieu and modern french sociology, for one, which introduced aspects of non-material ‘capital’ in one’s socialisation, culture, manners/habits, etc. these are more nebulous types of class distinction and necessarily shift around more with the times.

it’s one of the great long cons of liberalism/modern democracy to claim that we’ve abolished class and rigid hierarchies: ‘we’re all equal now’ has tended to be a euphemism in the west for ‘we are all just consumers now’, or, to put it another way, your class is what you can afford to wear on your wrist, drive to work, or lay your head in. well, that’s the worst sort of equality of all, in some regards, if you consider we are living in an era of unprecedented wealth gaps. the gap between the traditional university-educated managers and their line hands was much smaller, in comparison.

2022-04-02 18:44:01

#1407

unnamednewbie13: Moderator; +2,053|6770|PNW

class is definitely still a major aspect to all of our lives, but the hierarchies and structuring forces are undeniably different nowadays to 1950. the entire material basis of the economy has changed, for one. it figures that class in a largely Fordist economy, of working-classes on the factory line, middle-managers or technicians, bosses and owners, etc, obviously won’t pertain in the same ways now.

Exactly, which has been low key frustratingly my point. That class is still impactful, but that things like dividing lines and economic climate have changed.

Meanwhile Mac making like I'm chewing him out for it being not diverse enough or something, or for showing a 50s video for a 50s segment.

2022-04-02 19:03:45

#1408

SuperJail Warden: Gone Forever; +635|3718

These kids don't need to know about college because they are going to the military. 🪖

2022-04-03 02:21:19

#1409

Dilbert_X: The X stands for; +1,810|6104|eXtreme to the maX

If there aren't class barriers and strata people will create them, climb as high as they can then pull up the ladder as they go, its human nature.

We've had the discussion before, I'm sure 'The Fresh Prince' caused as many black kids in the relevant generation to self-sabotage as slavery did.
Yes, just dick around, disrespect authority, wear stupid clothes, play basketball, write rap rhymes, pull down anyone else as a sellout and you can be a success too.

Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!

2022-04-03 09:50:11

#1410

unnamednewbie13: Moderator; +2,053|6770|PNW

SuperJail Warden wrote:
These kids don't need to know about college because they are going to the military. 🪖

I think JROTC and some community college experience combined is a double promotion. Probably relevant to people going into the military.

Dilbert_X wrote:
If there aren't class barriers and strata people will create them, climb as high as they can then pull up the ladder as they go, its human nature.

We've had the discussion before, I'm sure 'The Fresh Prince' caused as many black kids in the relevant generation to self-sabotage as slavery did.
Yes, just dick around, disrespect authority, wear stupid clothes, play basketball, write rap rhymes, pull down anyone else as a sellout and you can be a success too.

avocado toast and chai lattes

2022-04-03 10:36:52

#1411

SuperJail Warden: Gone Forever; +635|3718

Dilbert_X wrote:
If there aren't class barriers and strata people will create them, climb as high as they can then pull up the ladder as they go, its human nature.

We've had the discussion before, I'm sure 'The Fresh Prince' caused as many black kids in the relevant generation to self-sabotage as slavery did.
Yes, just dick around, disrespect authority, wear stupid clothes, play basketball, write rap rhymes, pull down anyone else as a sellout and you can be a success too.

I never watched the Fresh Prince but I know Uncle Phil was a judge and had a butler and mansion. Will Smith moved out of the ghetto to live with his rich relatives in Bel Air. I am pretty sure the whole thing was aspirational instead of ghetto gazing. Will Smith was a rapper famous for not putting curse words in his forgettable music.

You couldn't be more off track with this. You sound like a guy in his late 40s who lives in Tennessee and never pays attention to well known pop culture. You want to take a guitar out and play some Lynyrd Skynyrd like it is still the late 70's?

2022-04-03 18:12:19

#1412

uziq: Member; +492|3450

dilbert has always had this weirdly paleolithic belief about rap music and how it's the self-inflicted reason why blacks are on the bottom rung of society.

never mind that like most of the most influential rappers of the last two generations have been white boys addicted to opiates or whatever.

2022-04-04 02:40:10

#1413

Dilbert_X: The X stands for; +1,810|6104|eXtreme to the maX

SuperJail Warden wrote:
Dilbert_X wrote:
If there aren't class barriers and strata people will create them, climb as high as they can then pull up the ladder as they go, its human nature.

We've had the discussion before, I'm sure 'The Fresh Prince' caused as many black kids in the relevant generation to self-sabotage as slavery did.
Yes, just dick around, disrespect authority, wear stupid clothes, play basketball, write rap rhymes, pull down anyone else as a sellout and you can be a success too.
I never watched the Fresh Prince but I know Uncle Phil was a judge and had a butler and mansion. Will Smith moved out of the ghetto to live with his rich relatives in Bel Air. I am pretty sure the whole thing was aspirational instead of ghetto gazing. Will Smith was a rapper famous for not putting curse words in his forgettable music.

You couldn't be more off track with this. You sound like a guy in his late 40s who lives in Tennessee and never pays attention to well known pop culture. You want to take a guitar out and play some Lynyrd Skynyrd like it is still the late 70's?

Well I have watched it, and have no wish to play a guitar.

Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!

2022-04-27 10:11:43

#1414

SuperJail Warden: Gone Forever; +635|3718

National Review had a bunch of articles about how unfair it would be to cancel student loan debt and how it would massively backfire on Democrats. The "it would backfire on Democrats" is such concern trolling. If it would backfire so badly on Democrats, why not just let them do it? I suspect that republicans would see it as a culture war loss since there would definitely be people who studied the gay sciences who would be pretty vocal about how they are now debt free.

I think the student loan forgiveness issue is a good litmus test for how much of a sour bitch you are. The student loan money is owed to the federal government. If it gets erased, all the happens is some numbers change in the government's ledger. Nobody is losing anything or has to give anything up. If you get angry at the idea that some people will catch an "unfair break", investigate why you would feel anger at other people's happiness and ask your doctor if Zoloft is right for you.

2022-04-27 10:21:21

#1415

DesertFox-: The very model of a modern major general; +794|6683|United States of America

My brother, as an accounting nerd, has brought up one thing that I don't hear discussed enough with the loan debt discussion, which is that debt cancellation is viewed as taxable income, which is something that should be noted lest a bunch of those people complain next April.

There is also the fact that, while college education has become way more of the standard requirement akin to a HS degree, it is still attended mostly by people who aren't the poorest of the poor. Education costs are ridiculous, but something should also be done to help out those people who couldn't even afford to entertain the thought of college in the first place.

2022-04-27 10:24:56

#1416

unnamednewbie13: Moderator; +2,053|6770|PNW

I love some of the impossible job requirements out there, such as years of experience with a suite beyond how long it has existed. Employers like that can literally blank up their blank.

Conservatives: "ha ha, useless college, enjoy your debt jerkoff, good luck at the coffee shop"
Job listings: *college experience required*

2022-04-27 10:43:05

#1417

SuperJail Warden: Gone Forever; +635|3718

unnamednewbie13 wrote:
I love some of the impossible job requirements out there, such as years of experience with a suite beyond how long it has existed. Employers like that can literally blank up their blank.

Conservatives: "ha ha, useless college, enjoy your debt jerkoff, good luck at the coffee shop"
Job listings: *college experience required*

National Review has a good chunk of posters who are liberals and willing to actually argue on articles. Anyhow, one guy pointed out that conservatives shut themselves out of academia and high business by taking such a hard line against education, teachers, social sciences, etc. Businesses like using college degrees as proof that you can read, write and keep at something for awhile. Probably also means you know how to get along with people too. That system isn't going to change any time soon. Encouraging social conservatives to get jobs shoveling coal is not only a personal disservice to those people but also a bad bet for the movement.

That said, I totally support them shutting themselves out of society.

2022-04-27 10:44:08

#1418

unnamednewbie13: Moderator; +2,053|6770|PNW

But wait, they're not done. A priority is to strip bare pre-college education as well. Then they'll be making fun of kids who make it out of K-5.

2022-04-27 10:47:12

#1419

SuperJail Warden: Gone Forever; +635|3718

Again, shooting themselves in the foot. Blue states aren't going to destroy their education systems because CRT and gay teenagers holding hands makes some totally straight trust me bro guys uncomfortable 😣🥵

2022-04-27 12:00:12

#1420

unnamednewbie13: Moderator; +2,053|6770|PNW

Real Americans apprentice themselves to sewage divers out of fourth grade. What even is calculus I anyway?

Why is our red state so far behind?

2022-04-27 12:58:15

#1421

SuperJail Warden: Gone Forever; +635|3718

It is other people's fault. Why would the liberals do this?

2022-04-27 14:17:22

#1422

unnamednewbie13: Moderator; +2,053|6770|PNW

I read a "feel good" story somewhere about a guy who broke his back (figuratively) as a janitor to put his five kids through college. He taught them "the value of hard work!" It meant to warm my heart, but turned my stomach.

I'm not going to look down on someone going above and beyond for their family in a country that doesn't provide, or even criticize him for having five kids. But getting into some kind of college (even if it's a trade school) shouldn't have such a monolithic financial barrier. The filter should be ability, competency, and motivation. Not wealth.

2022-04-27 14:49:46

#1423

SuperJail Warden: Gone Forever; +635|3718

Ideally yes but also that would mean we would need to create an educational system that rewards genuine merit and capability instead of social status and wealth. You think somebody like Jay wants his probably average dumplings to compete with kids who were born, for reasons we really don't scientifically understand, with high IQs but into poor families? Don't underestimate the fact that people want the capability to punch down and stack their privileges.

2022-04-27 14:56:27

#1424

unnamednewbie13: Moderator; +2,053|6770|PNW

If Jay was properly "middle class," building a deck wouldn't be worth his value in time. He'd just hire someone to do it for him. Who has time for guys cosplaying middle class.

2022-04-27 15:06:58

#1425

SuperJail Warden: Gone Forever; +635|3718

unnamednewbie13 wrote:
If Jay was properly "middle class," building a deck wouldn't be worth his value in time. He'd just hire someone to do it for him. Who has time for guys cosplaying middle class.

Those are fighting words. I mean he would literally threaten to fist fight you.

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SuperJail Warden wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

SuperJail Warden wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

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