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2021-06-20 16:35:21
SuperJail Warden
Gone Forever
+635|3715
Some black relatives are moving from New Jersey to South Carolina. The husband and wife are both nurses and complain about taxes and cost of living in NJ. They have 4 young daughters. Interestingly, they are going from the state ranked #1 for education to the state ranked #44.

https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/rankings

Dummies don't realize how shitty services are in those low tax states. I warned them also that racism is bad down there. I tried to explain to them why black people left the south in the first place but they resent having to pay taxes to the point where they are willing to go to deliverance land.
https://i.imgur.com/xsoGn9X.jpg
2021-06-20 19:04:14
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6768|PNW

Dilbert sends his regards to your black relatives, with criticisms against the four daughters for living in the first rebel state when they could obviously just move out.
2021-06-21 02:09:54
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6102|eXtreme to the maX

SuperJail Warden wrote:

Some black relatives are moving from New Jersey to South Carolina. The husband and wife are both nurses and complain about taxes and cost of living in NJ. They have 4 young daughters. Interestingly, they are going from the state ranked #1 for education to the state ranked #44.
Right so a black family is moving from a multicultural democrat state not built on slavery to a deep south republican state literally built on slavery because "muh taxes"

With the establishment of rice and indigo as commodity export crops, South Carolina became a slave society, with slavery central to its economy. By 1708, African slaves composed a majority of the population in the colony
It really can't be such a central problem to the life of every black person eh.
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2021-06-21 03:07:06
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6768|PNW

Four kids, transfer from a place with good schools to a place with generally poor. I'm going to need something other than "taxes" to not just write that off as just a really poor decision. I wouldn't even want to live in SC.

House prices?
2021-06-21 03:45:16
SuperJail Warden
Gone Forever
+635|3715

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

Four kids, transfer from a place with good schools to a place with generally poor. I'm going to need something other than "taxes" to not just write that off as just a really poor decision. I wouldn't even want to live in SC.

House prices?
They are homeowners. They resent the fact that they pay nearly as much in property taxes as they do their mortgage. But those property are how you get the #1 ranked schools and other stuff. A lot of low tax places require you to buy garbage collection service, pay a fee for fire protection, etc. A lot of people from those low tax places probably look at it as 'freedom' to choose which garbage service you want to sign up for but I see it as wasted mental energy.
https://i.imgur.com/xsoGn9X.jpg
2021-06-21 04:40:19
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6102|eXtreme to the maX
Yeah why live in a high tax area when you can live somewhere with poor services, stagnant wages and property prices.

Even Jay took the sensible decision.
Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!
2021-06-21 05:19:49
uziq
Member
+492|3448

Dilbert_X wrote:

SuperJail Warden wrote:

Some black relatives are moving from New Jersey to South Carolina. The husband and wife are both nurses and complain about taxes and cost of living in NJ. They have 4 young daughters. Interestingly, they are going from the state ranked #1 for education to the state ranked #44.
Right so a black family is moving from a multicultural democrat state not built on slavery to a deep south republican state literally built on slavery because "muh taxes"

With the establishment of rice and indigo as commodity export crops, South Carolina became a slave society, with slavery central to its economy. By 1708, African slaves composed a majority of the population in the colony
It really can't be such a central problem to the life of every black person eh.
dilbert: black people are genetically incapable of higher-level intelligence and the stable social organization necessary to 'progress'. this is why they have never had a middle-class.
also dilbert: LOL wow check out these black people trying to minimise their tax expenditure hahahah, so much for slavery ever being a problem!
2021-06-21 06:40:07
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6102|eXtreme to the maX

uziq wrote:

dilbert: black people are genetically incapable of higher-level intelligence and the stable social organization necessary to 'progress'. this is why they have never had a middle-class.
also dilbert: LOL wow check out these black people trying to minimise their tax expenditure hahahah, so much for slavery ever being a problem!
The point is they can't be too offended by slavery if they're prepared to move to SC where the whole state was built up by slaves - they'll have their work cut out pushing over statues and burning down buildings.

It would be like a jew deciding there were some great real estate opportunities at Auschwitz - the land is cheap, a great place to raise a family.
Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!
2021-06-21 07:47:06
SuperJail Warden
Gone Forever
+635|3715
They are probably going to have a rude awakening when they get called the N-word for the first time by someone like this guy.
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/C3ZzwlVJwoU/hqdefault.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/xsoGn9X.jpg
2021-06-21 09:58:14
uziq
Member
+492|3448

Dilbert_X wrote:

uziq wrote:

dilbert: black people are genetically incapable of higher-level intelligence and the stable social organization necessary to 'progress'. this is why they have never had a middle-class.
also dilbert: LOL wow check out these black people trying to minimise their tax expenditure hahahah, so much for slavery ever being a problem!
The point is they can't be too offended by slavery if they're prepared to move to SC where the whole state was built up by slaves - they'll have their work cut out pushing over statues and burning down buildings.

It would be like a jew deciding there were some great real estate opportunities at Auschwitz - the land is cheap, a great place to raise a family.
what a horribly fatalistic and restrictive conception of life.
2021-06-21 10:07:51
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6768|PNW

I think one of the obvious points is that if the US had a better social safety net, people might feel less pressured to move due to onerous taxation.

It's strange though, SC's sales tax is higher than NJ and they also have an income tax. Your black friends must really be saving on property tax for that house down there.

WA has a beefy sales tax, but no income tax. I would be happier if that were flipped. Sales tax punishes the poor.
2021-06-21 10:34:18
uziq
Member
+492|3448
remember, hypotheticals are stupid but we can use an incomplete anecdote from macbeth about one black family to prove that the legacy of slavery is overblown.

SCIENCE !!!
2021-06-21 11:35:25
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6768|PNW

"Hypotheticals are fine if they serve my purposes."

Bumped into this exchange on a thread talking about a microbiology "intern" refusing to wear a mask at the lab building for the usual reasons (blocks oxygen, etc.).

In the comments:

rmsrmsrms38 via Android884 pts6 hr
This kinda' sounds like a made up story... i know thst would happen on the internet but...

smax410 via iPhone22 pts3 hr
I work just outside Johnson Space Center. Highly educated engineers come in all the time. They bitch about masks all the time.

Collapse
sleepinggreenidea8 pts2 hr
Engineers are a hotbed of wild beliefs. They exist in that dangerous area where they know enough to argue convincingly, but not always know
Reply

Collapse
sleepinggreenidea9 pts2 hr
what the limits of their knowledge is. Lawyers end up in a similar place for different reasons (less knowledge, but better at arguing).
To think that person was kind enough to give engineers a nod for making good arguments.
2021-06-21 20:38:00
SuperJail Warden
Gone Forever
+635|3715
Engineers are basically just people good at math. Liberal arts and social science majors are people good at writing essays.

An individual can be or not be a pig person in whatever major they choose. It's only the engineers who are salty at other majors though. The liberal arts majors aren't even thinking about them.
https://i.imgur.com/xsoGn9X.jpg
2021-06-21 21:33:52
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6768|PNW

Disdain for liberal arts extends beyond engineers. Blue collar circles and low income America are rife with it. There is probably a misleading reputation for liberal arts degrees working at Starbucks, when STEM majors can also send you to a joe job. Your server could as easily be an architect as a lit major.

What's funny is that engineers consider themselves at the pinnacle of blue collar profession (we do stuff with our hands too!) and the king of peons below. But blue collar contractors (particularly experienced veterans of their field) use engineers as the butt of many jokes: pencil pushers who have never so much as bought a bag of cement from Lowe's trying to micromanage a job site. As much if not more derision for them as for "librul arts." There's even some legitimacy for the disdain.

An engineer who thinks they're 100% right and nothing will change their mind, but the print they're using is from the 1970s before about a dozen revisions. Spec they wrote is physically impossible for the site to attain without a six figure remodel. Problem actually originating on city property is wrongfully blamed on a local business based on a cursory inspection, which could cause them to shut down if fined. lawl
2021-06-21 22:05:46
uziq
Member
+492|3448

SuperJail Warden wrote:

Engineers are basically just people good at math. Liberal arts and social science majors are people good at writing essays.

An individual can be or not be a pig person in whatever major they choose. It's only the engineers who are salty at other majors though. The liberal arts majors aren't even thinking about them.
agree 100% setting people into a cast or mould based on what they read and studied for 3 years between 18-21 is incomprehensibly stupid.

what a limited idea of human intelligence and adaptability. nevermind that people can have aptitude for multiple disciplines and possess more than one body of knowledge or skillset.

a scientist has never written a sci-fi novel? a philosopher has never contributed to logic or math?

literally newton and leibniz, who invented modern mathematics, both had a huge interest in 'liberal arts' and wrote essays, treatises, speculative books.

thinking the entire world can be delimited to your own narrow specialism, and, further, that your own professional training gives you some unique and elevated insight into 'reality', is fatuity itself. and, yes, only engineering master-race autists go around with this delusion. which seems to largely be an invention of post-2000s reddit culture and some sort of 'engineering has the best job prospects' trope.

the whole thing is so fucking silly and doesn't pertain to 90% of university subjects. that's because those subjects seldom involve a direct translation into a job or industry, and people are used to learning new skills and taking on further training in their (now multi-chapter) careers.

Last edited by uziq (2021-06-21 22:14:49)

2021-06-21 22:35:01
SuperJail Warden
Gone Forever
+635|3715
I don't know what goes on in the world of undergrad college but I have seen a tremendous lot less "Liberal arts have no jobs" on the internet in the past few years. I think that was very much a millennial thing since and that group really internalized "go to school or flip burgers'.

Gen Z may not be too crazy on education/job as identity since their concept of identity is one where you pick and choose.
https://i.imgur.com/xsoGn9X.jpg
2021-06-22 01:24:20
uziq
Member
+492|3448
ironic that no amount of job statistics or actual data can disabuse engineers of that notion.

average graduate starting income is higher, absolutely, but the job market is not dramatically different. and most people in leadership positions have humanities backgrounds.

dilbert, a 50-something live at home lifer in non-management, of course has a big problem with this.

Last edited by uziq (2021-06-22 01:24:38)

2021-06-22 02:28:39
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6102|eXtreme to the maX

uziq wrote:

SuperJail Warden wrote:

Engineers are basically just people good at math. Liberal arts and social science majors are people good at writing essays.

An individual can be or not be a pig person in whatever major they choose. It's only the engineers who are salty at other majors though. The liberal arts majors aren't even thinking about them.
agree 100% setting people into a cast or mould based on what they read and studied for 3 years between 18-21 is incomprehensibly stupid.

what a limited idea of human intelligence and adaptability. nevermind that people can have aptitude for multiple disciplines and possess more than one body of knowledge or skillset.

a scientist has never written a sci-fi novel? a philosopher has never contributed to logic or math?

literally newton and leibniz, who invented modern mathematics, both had a huge interest in 'liberal arts' and wrote essays, treatises, speculative books.

thinking the entire world can be delimited to your own narrow specialism, and, further, that your own professional training gives you some unique and elevated insight into 'reality', is fatuity itself. and, yes, only engineering master-race autists go around with this delusion. which seems to largely be an invention of post-2000s reddit culture and some sort of 'engineering has the best job prospects' trope.

the whole thing is so fucking silly and doesn't pertain to 90% of university subjects. that's because those subjects seldom involve a direct translation into a job or industry, and people are used to learning new skills and taking on further training in their (now multi-chapter) careers.
Yawn

Its really funny that "liberal arts graduates" think they're the be all and end all of everything with no rigourous or in depth experience of anything at all, or ever doing anything which carries a risk of failure.

You wouldn't catch a doctor thinking they can design or manage the construction of a bridge, a civil engineer thinking they should be in charge of an aeroplane factory, or an aeronautical engineer thinking they should be running a virology lab.

Humanities morons on the other hand think that because they got a gold star for an essay on a painting or whatever that everyone is interested in their pontificating and they should be in charge of everyone else.

Look at how that turns out, time after time.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/imageserver/image/%2Fmethode%2Ftimes%2Fprod%2Fweb%2Fbin%2Ff73f829c-251f-11eb-bb49-9a393f31c7ae.jpg?crop=3725%2C2095%2C0%2C101&resize=1180

Of course there's overlap between disciplines but while most STEM people quietly get on with building the world its people like you who are offensive and insufferable prats who never actually create or produce anything at all and certainly never take responsibility or a risk.

uziq wrote:

i missed my own goodbye announcement last week, in the wider company meeting. because of the time difference i was already out getting drinks. forgot about the meeting. woops. my managing editor was bigging me up to a conference call full of people and i wasn't even in on the call.
Ha ha what a genius, timezones are complicated I guess - you'll forever be remembered as the asshole who didn't attend his own leaving do.

Last edited by Dilbert_X (2021-06-22 02:37:05)

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2021-06-22 02:34:50
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6102|eXtreme to the maX

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

What's funny is that engineers consider themselves at the pinnacle of blue collar profession
Not really no.

But blue collar contractors (particularly experienced veterans of their field) use engineers as the butt of many jokes: pencil pushers who have never so much as bought a bag of cement from Lowe's trying to micromanage a job site. As much if not more derision for them as for "librul arts." There's even some legitimacy for the disdain.
There is no blue collar contractor on earth who wouldn't rather be an engineer and doesn't have a chip on his shoulder as a result.

Obviously there are mediocre engineers here and there, there are certainly mediocre contractors who ignore the specifications because they think they know better and ruin projects as a result.

The people who say "I've been doing this job for XX years and I know how to do it" rarely enjoy "You've been doing it wrong for XX years", managing that is always fun.
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2021-06-22 02:40:34
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6768|PNW

I think we've been over this plenty of times. Writers create stuff, editors create stuff, artists create stuff. Weighing the merit behind a good novel or scientific journal, and a floating bridge or some throwaway IC design for a dead-end niche item that will be outmoded in two years: pointless.

Nobody in my art classes sat around shooting the shit about how pointless computer engineering was. Snubbing the arts was fairly common in my computer engineering classes.
2021-06-22 03:00:05
Larssen
Member
+99|1883
How can you all still have this discussion. Everyone here left secondary or tertiary education YEARS ago. 

Dilbert I don't know what your point is. Yes, you won't see someone who spent his life in the bureaucracy try and design a bridge. Similarly, I wouldn't prefer seeing someone who designs bridges for a living suddenly switch to running a government.

These are entirely different specialties. You yourself know jack shit about economics, the law, city planning, nature preservation, crisis management, let alone what regional, national or international policy development in these fields looks like here.

How is your experience with matlab or physics going to help? Is it useful that you know the diameter of different types of pipes? Does a PM need to be intimately familiar with different types of concrete? Or how to calculate the maximum load of a bridge?

If your qualms are with elected leadership then you obviously don't understand the purpose of democracy either.

Last edited by Larssen (2021-06-22 03:04:36)

2021-06-22 03:09:23
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6102|eXtreme to the maX

Larssen wrote:

How is your experience with matlab or physics going to help? Is it useful that you know the diameter of different types of pipes? Does a PM need to be intimately familiar with different types of concrete? Or how to calculate the maximum load of a bridge?

If your qualms are with elected leadership then you obviously don't understand the purpose of democracy either.
I think people trying to run things should have just a little experience of doing something rigourous, and at least be willing to consult with and defer to experts.

Meanwhile Britain has been run by obnoxious opinionated morons like uziq who assume they're experts on all things for much of its history and look at the result.

Anyway, once again it was the arts nerds who brought up the discussion again, not me.

Last edited by Dilbert_X (2021-06-22 03:11:46)

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2021-06-22 03:19:39
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6102|eXtreme to the maX

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

I think we've been over this plenty of times. Writers create stuff, editors create stuff, artists create stuff. Weighing the merit behind a good novel or scientific journal, and a floating bridge or some throwaway IC design for a dead-end niche item that will be outmoded in two years: pointless.
The issue really is the level of responsibility and risk and consequences of failure - the "arts crowd" take none.
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2021-06-22 03:21:11
Larssen
Member
+99|1883
Well in a healthy democracy the leadership does defer to experts on lots of things. If we look at the last 10-20 years of democracy in much of the anglosaxon sphere you can obviously say something is amiss. From Australia to the UK to the USA, it's not really working as it should.

As for rigour, I'm not a fan of Boris but I imagine he's been plenty rigorous in his path to becoming PM. The man is a dunce but that's not an easy feat and an achievement that entirely overshadows whatever he may have studied in his early 20s. Though I wouldn't consider classics all that easy either.

 

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