BF2S Forums Where are all the whiny peaceful "Enlightened" European now?

KEN-JENNINGS wrote:

I'm personally glad Doner is a street food staple in Germany.

Dilbert_X wrote:

So in 10 years of DST we've come full circle, the only positive aspect of multiculturalism is exotic snacks.

meat and vegetables with garlic sauce wrapped in flatbread makes exotic snack now?
i don't agree with everything uziq throws your way, dilbert, but you do need to get out more. covid-19 permitting, of course.

the truly disgusting thing about the attitudes of dilbert and his ilk is that far-right attacks against turks or muslims living in germany are on the rise. mosques have been vandalized or the sites of abuse something like 300+ times in the last year. there is a widespread surging far-right nativism that wants to undo something like 50 or 60 years of co-existence (turks were even allowed full german citizenship from 2000 onwards, if i recall correctly).



https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ … tacks-plot
https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-germa … KKBN27T1JB
https://www.aa.com.tr/en/europe/arson-a … ny/2007720

dilbert at this point is haranguing and blaming immigrants for taking multiple, presumably tax-paying, jobs at once and overworking and for forming groups in civil society around their religious or community centres to distribute and give charity. i mean, what the fuck? he's accusing turks of 'not assimilating' when many of them now occupy senior and prominent positions in german academia, research, science, business, sport, media, etc.

there is something so completely ugly about the powerful majority behaving in this petulant way. germany's entire economic miracle is thanks in large part to migrant labour: something like 30-40% of all industrial work was migrant labour through the 60s and 70s, with much higher representations in the most dangerous, most dirty, most taxing industries. these people built up the country; they actively do charity and have an outreach into the wider german civil society; and still dilbert damns them. 'still going to a mosque, EH?'

what a hopeless, pitiless worldview.

Last edited by uziq (2020-11-19 01:34:33)

yes, they've adopted the trump-bannon playbook. tell as many lies as you can and never admit to the truth/reality, just push along the narrative with more lies and more scandals so it quickly gets buried under a heap. never admit responsibility and constantly deflect onto some shadowy 'other'.

if you can believe it, the term 'cultural marxism' was used in the houses of parliament for the first time ever recently. conservative MPs are being whipped with messaging and comms from no. 10 telling them that, in the midst of a global pandemic, a huge crisis in exam results, endemic corruption and cronyism, etc, ackshually, the main issue threatening civil society is 'cultural marxists' teaching children in schools/universities that apparently capitalism has flaws and imperialism wasn't all great.

unfortunately the trump era is soon to be forgotten and all the enabled ignoramuses who have spent the last 4 years flaunting their chauvinism are going to be put to bed with their MAGA-branded pacifiers. boris's boorish lot are going to find themselves left out in the cold. the EU are rightfully steering clear of it and a biden-led US would do well to refuse engagement, too.

these are 'your' people, though, dilbert. you've applauded farage and co and the right-wing, non-negotiable brexiteers all along as representing 'real people' and 'the real world'. i see proof of no such thing. farage, cummings, et al have systematically lied and been as mendacious as possible to whip up populist fury (cummings and vote leave were found in contempt of parliament for twisting the rules, if you recall). they've contributed to a widespread culture of dishonesty, misinformation and manipulation.

Last edited by uziq (2020-11-20 05:44:03)

because ministerial discipline ultimately comes down to the PM. the opposition can't dismiss a member of cabinet. that's why they have a shadow cabinet of their own.

the best that can happen is that an official civil service enquiry/cabinet enquiry can find xyz and 'make recommendations' to the PM. the PM can still unilaterally decide to discard them. as he has done here, in this case, to defend his increasingly tiny cabal of helpmeets and sycophants. in this case, the official in charge of said disciplinary-review process has promptly resigned.

you will recall that this is the same no. 10 that illegally tried to prorogue and close parliament to further their own aims. a decision that was ruled as unlawful, and reversed, by the supreme court. like the trump lot, they're not interested in the official levers of power or following the laws: they're interested in finding the cracks and working in the grey areas to get what they want. that was vote leave's, and cummings's, modus operandi.

and 'people' = dominic cummings. all of his unhinged rantings and namedropping occur on his blog. you should read it. it is literally the colour on the inside of dilbert's eyelids.

Last edited by uziq (2020-11-20 06:48:05)

https://www.economist.com/1843/2020/11/ … f-his-life

no he didn't fancy himself as a mcnamara. but rationalism and 'scientific government' is your hobby-horse anyway, isn't it? you just slide and obfuscate with 'no true scotsman' fallacies whenever it has been attempted throughout history and failed. 'not science-y enough', 'not real scientists', 'yes well there were scientists working on it but their managers weren't good', 'it's not the algorithm's fault it's the ministers', etc.

scientific governance has failed in many states and in many contexts. not to say it's an impossibility, or we should ignore science. just that when people start to think that perfect governance is a matter of perfect data (which normally means total surveillance and serious privacy/data protection issues, may i add), they quickly founder on a complex and quicksilver reality. data, no matter how granular, is not enough to guide decision making; science cannot prognosticate the future, no matter how good the statistics.

all of these sites i link give total article access if you just register. i'm sure you have registered accounts with all those right-wing tabloids you read. it takes all of about 15 seconds to put in your email and a password. you might even learn something.

Dilbert_X wrote:

Don't have a sub to that one either.

From the first paragraphs I can read he fancied himself as McNamara - maybe he should have read a history book and seen how that turned out.

In October 1966, he launched Project 100,000, the lowering of army IQ standards which allowed 354,000 additional men to be recruited, despite criticism that they were not suited to working in high stress or dangerous environments.

McNamara grew increasingly skeptical of the efficacy of committing American troops to Vietnam. In 1968, he resigned as Secretary of Defense to become President of the World Bank.

LMAO

That was a good plan. Sending all the dumb people to die in Asia is better than having them here putting defective kids into women.

The problem is, it doesn't matter how many supercomputers you plug into a potato, you're still going to get potato decisions.

Cummings is that potato, but with delusions of not being a potato.

This seems to be a theme amongst certain arts graduates, I don't think it would occur to a microbiologist that they should be in charge of arts policy or a civil engineer that they should direct naval tactics, but twonks like Cummings and Johnson think they should be running and micromanaging everything.

It would be great if we could find the source for this arrogant delusion.

Last edited by Dilbert_X (2020-11-23 00:43:39)

So far I've found PPE, Rural Environment Studies and Law, you're not really helping yourself.
https://www.gov.uk/government/ministers … -state--99

I went to university, did a degree, am fluent in classical and colloquial lorem ipsem etc, I think I'm ideally placed to give the English and History curriculums a good rejigging.

Dilbert_X wrote:

I don't think it would occur to a microbiologist that they should be in charge of arts policy or a civil engineer that they should direct naval tactics.

btw didn't margaret thatcher, a chemist, preside over the biggest change and restructuring of the UK's economy, and the downsizing/privatization of the state that went with it, in the modern era? was she an economist?

Last edited by uziq (2020-11-23 01:38:55)

you do not make any sense.

she was a science graduate from one of the top institutions in the world. it might not be cambridge or imperial for science reputation specifically, but to say that a chemistry graduate from oxford who worked in a graduate role in a chemistry lab is 'not a real scientist' is just sniffiness of the most inane sort. have you ever done original academic research or worked in a lab setting, dilbert? or have you only ever been in vocational work? how very un-intellectual of you, dilbert.

thatcher was a scientist by undergraduate training who took it upon herself to reshape the entire UK economy, with disastrous results for many. she drank the kool-aid on reaganite neo-liberalism and led the country off a cliff of deregulation and sell-offs. she had a BSc degree. that's her undergraduate certificate. it's inarguable. this is the very measure and qualification with which you adjudge just about every one else.

make sense. or perhaps grow up. either way, shouldn't be too hard.

Last edited by uziq (2020-11-23 02:34:48)

the home office is under scrutiny for keeping lots of migrants at old decommissioned army barracks. several have tried to commit suicide or gone on hunger strike. the U.K. is entirely taking tips from australia when it comes to indefinite detention in hushed up shitholes.

migrants fleeing war or persecution or even economic migrants don’t spend months browsing a brochure about their end destination, dilbert. often times they are trafficked or taken advantage of in some border country. often times they travel based on hearsay or rumour. nobody is sitting down and considering thoughtfully the respective benefit packages of france vs. the U.K.

will never understand the world's obsession with british royalty or making celebs out of a monarchy.