Dilbert_X
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uziq wrote:

the great war was over food? world war 2 was over food? the cold war and nuclear face-off was over food? really dilbert?
WW2 wasn't about lebensraum?

Most wars are about resources.

Next you'll be telling us revolutions happened because some intellectual published a clever pamphlet, not because people were hungry.
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uziq
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ww2 was quite obviously about germany needing to re-acquire former territories and land, not primarily for food, but for industry and militarization. the allies carved up its choiciest cuts of meat at versailles. 'lebensraum' was the official policy but was just as euphemistic and catch-all as so many nazi principles, like 'the final solution'. hitler's play for the sudentenland probably had less to do with pressing concerns over famine and more to do with the fact that it still had a huge german-speaking population and was hence good for folding back into his nationalist-irredentist program.

any quickly expanding or industrializing nation of course needs supplies, food among them. but ww2 didn't begin because germany desperately needed farmland, dilbert.

Next you'll be telling us revolutions happened because some intellectual published a clever pamphlet, not because people were hungry.
many revolutions have begun off the back of a pamphlet. why separate an animating idea or revolutionary ideology from material circumstances? do you even know what marxism is? why lenin took up his struggle? how are you divorcing 'idea' or 'concept' from 'material reality', here? marxism is a MATERIALIST philosophy, dipshit.

Last edited by uziq (2020-11-12 13:04:33)

Dilbert_X
The X stands for
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I'm sure marxism is many things and hipsters have rationalised revolutions to suit their own worldview.

You don't really need a lot of land to expand industry, german industry could have dectupled in size and would still have barely made a hittable bombing target.
The Germans wanted Russia and a lot of Europe for the farmland and other resources.
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uziq
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yes, right, germany could have just rebuilt the industrial facilities, infrastructure, transport and logistics terminals, etc, of the ruhr in bavaria. all of their expansion was for GRAIN.

Last edited by uziq (2020-11-12 13:15:27)

Dilbert_X
The X stands for
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Whether it was or wasn't as you said that was the line sold to the german people and thats why they got behind the war - more land and more food.
Wasn't it german policy to keep the people well fed with meat and dairy to keep them fat and happy?

But no I'm sure the average german had nationalist-irridentism foremost in his mind.
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uziq
Member
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nobody else looks at world war 2 and concludes it started for malthusian reasons, dilbert. stupid thesis. the rise of hitler and the descent into ww2 was not a dispute over food and famine.
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
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So the germans weren't poor and starving for the decades prior to ww2?
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SuperJail Warden
Gone Forever
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The Germans prior to World War 1 were paranoid about the Russian outpopulating them which definitely had a role in the conduct of World War 1. The Germans violated Belgium neutrality because they hoped to win a quick victory against France in anticipation for a bigger more grueling war against the Russians.
https://i.imgur.com/xsoGn9X.jpg
uziq
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'the decades prior'? what, you mean the great war and the depression? or the 1930s? no, germans were not starving in the 1930s. the farmers did very well out of the nazis, before any aggressive moves were made for new land.

i suppose there's some logic in what you're saying. 'weimar germany had hyperinflation and was having a huge monetary crisis, aggravated by allied remunerations payments and punitive tariffs. this made ordinary goods like bread hard to buy. THEREFORE world war 2 was actually about FOOD!' yes, it was a struggle over famine, and not because of, er, the hyperinflation, monetary crisis, allied tariffs ...

Last edited by uziq (2020-11-12 14:15:38)

Dilbert_X
The X stands for
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No, it was because BMW needed to extend their production line and there wasn't enough space in Baden-Wurttemberg so they had to go east.
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Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,813|6303|eXtreme to the maX
"Letting a well-connected billionaire get away with child rape and international sex trafficking isn't 'poor judgment' — it is a disgusting failure. Americans ought to be enraged," Mr Sasse said.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-11-13/ … l/12879798

No misconduct at all, OK.
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Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,813|6303|eXtreme to the maX
This is interesting

"I come here with a message," Mr O'Toole said.
"I want to tell you that everything is not OK. Real wages have not risen in Canada since the 1970s.
"Millions of workers have lost their jobs. In fact, Canada has the highest unemployment rate in the G7.
"Even before the pandemic hit, half of Canadian families were just $200 away from insolvency.
"Middle class Canada has been betrayed by the elites, on every level: political elites, financial elites, cultural elites."

Private sector union membership has collapsed," he said.
"In the 1950s, one in three private sector workers were union members. Today, it's closer to one in 25.
"It may surprise you to hear a conservative bemoan the decline of private sector union membership.
"But this was an essential part of the balance between what was good for business and what was good for employees.
"Today, that balance is dangerously disappearing.
"Too much power is in the hands of a few corporate and financial elites who have been only too happy to outsource jobs abroad.
"It's now expected of a shareholder to ask a CEO 'why are we paying a worker in Oshawa $30 an hour when we could be paying one in China 50 cents an hour?' and while that shareholder may see gains, Canada gets poorer."

"Full-time employment, a regular, steady salary, a pension. These sound straight out of a bygone era," he said.
"A generation ago, married couples with steady jobs and with homes they paid off before they retired, assumed their kids would flourish.
"Now we've come to accept those as quaint notions from a distant past.
"Many parents I speak with worry that their children, particularly in the Toronto area, will never own their own home.
"It used to be that a job was the gateway into the middle class.

"Increasingly — especially for younger people — a job can be a dead end, an endless cycle of contract work with no benefits, no security, no obligations on the part of the employers.
"Do we really want a nation of Uber drivers? Do we really want to abandon a generation of Canadians to some form of Darwinian struggle? A future without the possibility of home ownership? A sense of inevitability?

"While some benefit, millions are losing hope and resentment is growing."

Mr O'Toole said he was from a traditional conservative background that valued low taxes, small government, personal freedom and responsibility, helping one's neighbour and free markets.

"But I also grew up in a working-class community," he said.
"My hometown of Bowmanville, Ontario, is a [General Motors] town. My dad worked there. Our neighbours were auto workers. There was a sense of loyalty to the hometown. It's ingrained in me.
"Over the last couple of decades, I've seen parts of my hometown and the region hollowed out. Jobs left and never came back for some families."
'It's time to take inequality seriously'
He then spent a few minutes criticising the Trudeau Government for moving too quickly on climate change.

But then he changed tack.

"It's time conservatives and Canadians took inequality seriously," he said.
"We made a mistake in allowing ourselves to de-industrialise totally.
"Thirty years ago, the Western world's political, financial and business elite made a bet — we would allow China to have unfair access to our market while they protected their own.
"Then, China was poor, underdeveloped and largely disconnected from the world.
"Once it became a rich and prosperous country, we hoped it would turn into a good actor who would democratise, take human rights seriously, liberalise, and play by global rules.

"We all know that this has not happened.

"State-owned juggernauts, Orwellian surveillance technology, cyber theft on an industrial scale, hostage diplomacy and increasing human rights abuses within its borders, and increasingly with its wider sphere of influence."
He said he was a firm believer in capitalism and "free enterprise" because they always led to the "most-efficient outcome", but sometimes the most-efficient outcome "does not always perfectly align with our national interest".
"It is more efficient and affordable to make masks, ventilators and gowns in China," he said.
"But as we have learned, to our cost, it is not in our national interest to make those things in China.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-11-15/ … k/12884606

Last edited by Dilbert_X (2020-11-14 22:26:11)

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SuperJail Warden
Gone Forever
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English speaking conservative parties rebranding themselves as the "party of workers" are trying to run a scam on low education/blue collar people. They want them to think they are on their side in a great war against "the elites" which means different things in different imaginations. Most often "The elites" are Social Justice Warriors, the Jews, college students, hipsters, and gay people especially upscale ones.
https://i.imgur.com/xsoGn9X.jpg
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,813|6303|eXtreme to the maX
Well someone has robbed us, always hard to know if a politician is being sincere or has just found an angle.

https://thumbor.forbes.com/thumbor/fit-in/1200x0/filters%3Aformat%28jpg%29/https%3A%2F%2Fblogs-images.forbes.com%2Ftimworstall%2Ffiles%2F2016%2F10%2Fwagescompensation-1200x1093.png

Maybe it is the gay hipsters.

Last edited by Dilbert_X (2020-11-14 23:24:11)

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SuperJail Warden
Gone Forever
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The gays are innocent of this crime of all crimes. The trannies just want to live in peace. But people like Uzique and Newbie won't let them. They want to take them off youtube and force them into hiding to appease
https://www.mabonline.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/Dollarphotoclub_37432339.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/xsoGn9X.jpg
uziq
Member
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SuperJail Warden wrote:

English speaking conservative parties rebranding themselves as the "party of workers" are trying to run a scam on low education/blue collar people. They want them to think they are on their side in a great war against "the elites" which means different things in different imaginations. Most often "The elites" are Social Justice Warriors, the Jews, college students, hipsters, and gay people especially upscale ones.
this is 100% correct.

as for dilbert’s ‘this is cool’ post, wow man. welcome to what every single fucking left-wing thinker and book have been saying for about 50 years. if you weren’t so sniffy about reading then you’d be very au fait with these arguments. the left wing hasn’t shut up about ‘neoliberalism’ and ‘late capitalism’ since the 1980s. but instead you make disparaging remarks about ‘cultural marxism’ and echo the lame dipshit rhetoric of right-wing tabloid pundits instead.

i linked a long LRB essay here about 3 months ago that re-assessed the history of western elites’/big businesses’ relationship with china from the 1980s onwards.
uziq
Member
+492|3649

SuperJail Warden wrote:

The gays are innocent of this crime of all crimes. The trannies just want to live in peace. But people like Uzique and Newbie won't let them. They want to take them off youtube and force them into hiding to appease
https://www.mabonline.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/Dollarphotoclub_37432339.jpg
i’ve spoken against your cheap trolling about gay people and transsexuals on this sub-board for about, what, 3 years? there was a period when you’d mention trans people in public bathrooms once a day. it went against all your fake catholic beliefs.

now, 11 months into a pandemic, you’re so bored and horny that you’ve given in and started watching a lame trans youtuber. you’re developing a bit of a kink. she is raising strange feelings of lonesome lust in you. so now you think you’re the great champion of trans people?

i think you are seriously mentally ill. somewhere between all the medication and the bored borderline personality trolling, you’ve lost all grip.
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,813|6303|eXtreme to the maX

uziq wrote:

as for dilbert’s ‘this is cool’ post, wow man. welcome to what every single fucking left-wing thinker and book have been saying for about 50 years. if you weren’t so sniffy about reading then you’d be very au fait with these arguments. the left wing hasn’t shut up about ‘neoliberalism’ and ‘late capitalism’ since the 1980s. but instead you make disparaging remarks about ‘cultural marxism’ and echo the lame dipshit rhetoric of right-wing tabloid pundits instead.
Rubbish, bourgeois lefties, including you,  have been sniffy about jobs and manufacturing since at least the seventies, shipping factories offshore has been their way of sticking it to the smelly proles and oiks who actually produce things.
Like your average 'concerned conservative' they don't really give a shit.
Now post pics of all your apple products.

i linked a long LRB essay here about 3 months ago that re-assessed the history of western elites’/big businesses’ relationship with china from the 1980s onwards.
Amazingly I still don't have a LRB sub so still can't read it.

Last edited by Dilbert_X (2020-11-15 01:07:30)

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uziq
Member
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it's like talking to jay. neoliberalism was not leftism. it was not directed by left-wing ideologues or politicians. outsourcing factories and de-industrialization, like relaxed monetary and fiscal policy, were directed by neoliberals.

you're on fire with the good arguments today. 'you can't read left-wing books, you own apple products and drink coffee!'
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,813|6303|eXtreme to the maX
Where did I say neoliberalism was leftism?

The point is the elite left has never given a shit about the average person and the country any more than the elite right has.
Would Obama or Biden have started to stick it to China the way Trump has? I doubt it.
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uziq
Member
+492|3649
are you describing obama and biden as 'the elite left'? do you even know what i'm referring to when i talk about left-wing theory and thought? i am not talking about the democrat ticket.

the people you're talking about occupy this strange, mythical land called 'the centre'. i suggest you acquaint yourself with it.

Last edited by uziq (2020-11-15 01:39:11)

unnamednewbie13
Moderator
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OK so who's opening an account on Parler? /s

Conservatives Flock To Mercer-Funded Parler, Claim Censorship On Facebook And Twitter
https://www.npr.org/2020/11/14/93483321 … ok-and-twi
DesertFox-
The very model of a modern major general
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I posted about that maybe a week ago when I saw a few of the conservative leaning people on my FB do the whole "my username is _____ on Parler" thing. I hadn't even heard of it before, and it was somewhat surprising the amount of seemingly reasonable people who would pick up their ball and migrate to a whole new platform because.... they don't want to be fact checked? Moving to one popular with anti-Semites and Saudis sure seemed a strange move.
SuperJail Warden
Gone Forever
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I am surprised they just don't use Telegram. They can hang out with ISIS and AQ who run official Telegram pages.
https://i.imgur.com/xsoGn9X.jpg
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6969|PNW

I can see why people might be looking for a way to emigrate from Facebook apart from partisan politics. There has been a lot of punitive, unexplained moderation from staff including account and group shutdowns for minor reasons, inconsistent to accounts and groups allowed to stay open. Abuse of reports, ex: trolls getting away with finally getting someone to react and then getting them removed for it. Getting back on once you've been removed involves a lot of hoop jumping, and nothing's stopping them from removing you again without explanation. The company treats members like sack-of-garbage, unpaid employees; a bonus for Facebook being that they have no employee rights. A little appreciation for the people who help make the company money could go a long way. I would like to see them continue to exist as a social media company with no membership.

I find Twitter leaving fact-checks to be way more funny than just deleting posts.

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