Race relations thread

2018-09-14 10:40:05

#951

uziq: Member; +495|3691

Shahter wrote:
black, big lips, frizzy hair.

racist?

you are clearly a very poor interpreter of art/imagery. the chin and ears have been exaggerated in that image. he has a strong mouth but the lips are not at all in the style of racist depictions of african-americans. perhaps it's a translation issue, but he doesn't have frizzy hair, either. nothing about his 'blackness' has been emphasised in that cartoon.

Last edited by uziq (2018-09-14 10:40:43)

2018-09-14 10:52:10

#952

Shahter: Zee Ruskie; +295|7014|Moscow, Russia

uziq wrote:
you are clearly a very poor interpreter of art/imagery.

guilty as charged. i do know my music and russian literature - kinda, but deciphering imagery - notta thing.

the chin and ears have been exaggerated in that image. he has a strong mouth but the lips are not at all in the style of racist depictions of african-americans. perhaps it's a translation issue, but he doesn't have frizzy hair, either. nothing about his 'blackness' has been emphasised in that cartoon.

well...
k.

if you open your mind too much your brain will fall out.

2018-09-14 10:58:36

#953

uziq: Member; +495|3691

the racist cartoons have a semiotic ‘code’, basically, and everyone could clearly see that the australian tabloid was using it. even in the name of verisimilitude (and is there any greater fiction in art than appeals to unbiased, objective ‘reality’...), one simply cannot draw a black person with huge lips and an exaggeratedly big mouth without knowing what tradition they are quoting.

2018-09-14 16:49:55

#954

Dilbert_X: The X stands for; +1,815|6345|eXtreme to the maX

Shahter wrote:
right. so, basically, by these standarts it's impossible to draw a caricature of a black person, or jewish person or <put any other group which had been stereotipically pictrured in the past here> that wouldn't be racist of anti-smitic or what not, huh? there's always a context of the kind you described, is there not? serena, for example, is black, brutish, with big lips and has frizzy hair - how do you draw a cartoon of her omitting those features which would still be recognizably about her?

Basically yes.

And she is brutish, she's fucking enormous.

And black people do have big lips, caricaturists do exaggerate everything, this is all retarded.

Fuck Israel

2018-09-14 23:33:53

#955

uziq: Member; +495|3691

2018-09-15 05:16:54

#956

Dilbert_X: The X stands for; +1,815|6345|eXtreme to the maX

People with big lips get caricatured as having big lips.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/cb/67/92/cb67929d0625be1381bc8ccbd4c1ddf7.jpg

People with big ears or lantern jaws get caricatured that way too.

ZOMG the world is ending.

No wait, its been going on a little while now. If blacks and jews could be a bit less sensitive I think we might make it.

https://i2-prod.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article3184097.ece/ALTERNATES/s1227b/Prince-Charles.jpg

Last edited by Dilbert_X (2018-09-15 05:38:21)

Fuck Israel

2018-09-15 08:35:17

#957

uziq: Member; +495|3691

it's almost as if all those people aren't part of a race that has been systematically mistreated and abused with a racist caricature for 300 years.

2018-09-15 17:19:25

#958

SuperJail Warden: Gone Forever; +641|3958

All they had had to do was draw Serena like Terry Crews and everyone would have been fine with it.

2018-09-16 02:30:50

#959

Dilbert_X: The X stands for; +1,815|6345|eXtreme to the maX

Maybe Australian cartoonists aren't familiar with all the chips blacks carry around on their shoulders?

Fuck Israel

2018-09-16 02:31:23

#960

Dilbert_X: The X stands for; +1,815|6345|eXtreme to the maX

uziq wrote:
it's almost as if all those people aren't part of a race that has been systematically mistreated and abused with a racist caricature for 300 years.

All caricatures are insulting, why should anyone get special treatment?

Fuck Israel

2018-09-16 02:49:52

#961

uziq: Member; +495|3691

Dilbert_X wrote:
uziq wrote:
it's almost as if all those people aren't part of a race that has been systematically mistreated and abused with a racist caricature for 300 years.
All caricatures are insulting, why should anyone get special treatment?

uuuuuuh . . .

i literally just said the exact same thing less than a page ago and you're acting like you are making a point. you are not as smart as you think, evidently.

Last edited by uziq (2018-09-16 02:51:22)

2018-09-16 03:19:34

#962

Shahter: Zee Ruskie; +295|7014|Moscow, Russia

Dilbert_X wrote:
All caricatures are insulting, why should anyone get special treatment?

if i'm getting zeek's opinion right, the point is some groups of people have been exposed to so much insulting crap for no reason (or worse - for purposes of discrimination) in recent past that it does warrant some special care in dealings with them - and i kinda agree tbh. there is of course a problem with this particular case: the criteria for identifying what's okay and what's not is very subtle and requires specialized knowledge to spot - "he has a strong mouth" whatever the heck that means... - all that makes it seemingly impossible to do any kind of satire targetted at members of certain groups of people, imo.

Last edited by Shahter (2018-09-16 03:21:57)

if you open your mind too much your brain will fall out.

2018-09-16 03:32:48

#963

uziq: Member; +495|3691

exactly. all cartoons are caricatures -- exaggerated and unrealistic depictions of someone. well done, dilbert. you should consider becoming the observer's art critic. the point is that all art forms also have a context and social history, and the exact same negative depictions of african americans (which, let's face it, were used as physical manifestations of their human/genetic/intellectual inferiority, 'apes', subhuman, etc) have appeared for about 250 years. there is an actual museum of this stuff with 100,000s of examples ranging from the most hateful and nasty to the frankly bizarre. for e.g., this is why you shouldn't call black men (or women, for that matter) 'brutes'. it's a horrible old stereotype that has been used to justify the worst sorts of racism:

https://ferris.edu/jimcrow/brute/

again, if there was an equivalent thing for 'unfair depictions of australian politicians', then i'd be all ears. when satire is used by the weak against the powerful, i.e. to ridicule politicians, it is aimed well. when a satirical depiction quotes racist propaganda to put someone down, it is not only fucking weak humour, it is abusive. if people like dilbert examined their own social attitudes a little more closely, maybe they'd start to wonder just who is satirising whom, here, and where the real power lies.

and no, serena is not 'beyond satire'. just like obama wasn't, again. all cartoonists know their trade: they know what they are drawing and what they are choosing to exaggerate. satirise serena's unsporting behaviour, sure. but don't draw her with giant lips throwing an ape tantrum.

Last edited by uziq (2018-09-16 03:35:53)

2018-09-17 02:13:59

#964

Dilbert_X: The X stands for; +1,815|6345|eXtreme to the maX

She did throw an ape tantrum. What does she expect, special treatment?

Maybe the umpire should have let her cheat 'because slavery', this victim-claiming thing is getting annoying.
I blame the jews for starting it.

Fuck Israel

2018-09-17 07:43:35

#965

uziq: Member; +495|3691

she threw a tantrum. you’re a grown man, get a grip.

2018-09-17 15:30:50

#966

KEN-JENNINGS: I am all that is MOD!; +2,979|6871|949

Dilbert_X wrote:
She did throw an ape tantrum. What does she expect, special treatment?

Maybe the umpire should have let her cheat 'because slavery', this victim-claiming thing is getting annoying.
I blame the jews for starting it.

she didn't cheat. I watched that whole match live. Tennis coaches coach from the box all the time, and it virtually never gets called. In no circumstance should a chair ump have the ability to take a whole game away from a player. Sad ending to an amazing match.

dilbert is a racist

2018-09-17 16:56:34

#967

coke: Aye up duck!; +440|6948|England. Stoke

KEN-JENNINGS wrote:
dilbert is a racist

Crux of the issue tbh

2018-09-18 01:09:34

#968

Dilbert_X: The X stands for; +1,815|6345|eXtreme to the maX

KEN-JENNINGS wrote:
Dilbert_X wrote:
She did throw an ape tantrum. What does she expect, special treatment?

Maybe the umpire should have let her cheat 'because slavery', this victim-claiming thing is getting annoying.
I blame the jews for starting it.
she didn't cheat. I watched that whole match live. Tennis coaches coach from the box all the time, and it virtually never gets called. In no circumstance should a chair ump have the ability to take a whole game away from a player. Sad ending to an amazing match.

Being coached from the box is cheating, this time it did get called out.
She was already losing, was cheating, threw a tantrum then insulted the umpire and played the sexism card, bad luck for her.

dilbert is a racist

Maybe Serena Williams is racist and sexist, expecting special treatment because of who she is.

Sad end to a reasonable career, I don't care as tennis ceased to be a sport and became a business long ago.
I wonder if she was more concerned about her record or her income as the match trailed away.

Fuck Israel

2018-09-18 02:16:15

#969

uziq: Member; +495|3691

her tantrum had nothing to do with her being racist/sexist or expecting 'special treatment'. the (extremely conservative and hardly faddish) women's tennis association agreed with her general point ffs. her conduct on court was not sporting but her frustration was legitimate.

why do you think 'the blacks' want special treatment? how was race even involved in this furore? you seem to be the only person bringing it up -- you and the tabloid cartoonist you so staunchly defend, that is. no one saw this through a racial lens except for people like you, who see a person getting frustrated on a court due to poor refereeing and have an inner monologue that no doubt begins, 'these blacks, you know...'

2018-09-18 02:26:24

#970

Dilbert_X: The X stands for; +1,815|6345|eXtreme to the maX

Well apparently no-one can criticise anyone who is black or female, or make anything of what people look like or how they behave any more.
Its a shame other players don't have a trope to fall back on when a refereeing decision doesn't their way.

Not sure how you managed to work in anti-semitism either - well played.

Fuck Israel

2018-09-18 02:42:51

#971

uziq: Member; +495|3691

do you even understand her complaint? shame 'other players' don't have a trope? she was complaining about the levels of refereeing in women's and men's tennis. loads of women tennis players came out in support of her. why do you think she was trying to be play a 'special' race card? she wasn't at any point. only your parochial aussie tabloid (and parochial aussie mind) made it about blackness.

it's almost as if you haven't been reading for the last 3 pages. lots of black public figures and lots of women get caricatured in the media.

2018-09-18 02:54:19

#972

Dilbert_X: The X stands for; +1,815|6345|eXtreme to the maX

She was complaining about sexism, although she was the one who broke three rules in succession, and on court during a match isn't the time or place to be making complaints or hurling abuse, then tried to claim it was a women's rights and equality issue. If she had a running grievance over uneven refereeing in general then before or after the match are the times to do it. If she had won would she have brought it up? She would just have taken her cheque and stayed silent.
Since then her husband has complained about racism and misogyny, over a cartoon which isn't really far off what his wife looks like.
https://www.sbs.com.au/news/serena-will … st-cartoon

https://cdn.images.dailystar.co.uk/dynamic/63/photos/242000/620x/Serena-Williams-728501.jpg

https://cdn4.i-scmp.com/sites/default/files/styles/980x551/public/images/methode/2018/09/17/caec5b38-ba42-11e8-8bc4-fc59ff6846aa_1280x720_195256.JPG?itok=FqmfdYxq

I think the cartoonist was quite generous TBH, and she does have frizzy hair so I don't know why people are griping about that.

Last edited by Dilbert_X (2018-09-18 03:05:35)

Fuck Israel

2018-09-18 04:54:39

#973

uziq: Member; +495|3691

straw man argument by a shoddy tabloid that promises on its front cover that it is 'for you'. lmao. can it get any more redneck.

2018-09-18 05:29:16

#974

Dilbert_X: The X stands for; +1,815|6345|eXtreme to the maX

https://www.minuteman-militia.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/triggered-people-triggered.jpg

Fuck Israel

2018-09-18 08:07:19

#975

uziq: Member; +495|3691

i am literally one of the last people who will ever use 'triggered' or 'safe space' in any context. i spent a large amount of my teens mercilessly flaming people online ffs. the cartoon was racist as fuck. sorry that you're too 'hurr durr liberals' and 'these violent blacks' in your beliefs to perceive other's viewpoints and possible offence.

Last edited by uziq (2018-09-18 08:07:40)

BF2S Forums Race relations thread

Shahter wrote:

uziq wrote:

Shahter wrote:

uziq wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

uziq wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

KEN-JENNINGS wrote:

KEN-JENNINGS wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

Board footer