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SuperJail Warden
Member
+169|1310
Earlier this month, Senator Ted Cruz of Texas and Senator Mike Lee of Utah, through his spokesperson, told Buzzfeed they plan to reintroduce an embattled bill that barely gained a House hearing in 2015. But this time around, they said, the First Amendment Defense Act (FADA) was likely to succeed due to a Republican-controlled House and the backing of President-elect Donald Trump.

FADA would prohibit the federal government from taking "discriminatory action" against any business or person that discriminates against LGBTQ people. The act distinctly aims to protect the right of all entities to refuse service to LGBTQ people based on two sets of beliefs: "(1) marriage is or should be recognized as the union of one man and one woman, or (2) sexual relations are properly reserved to such a marriage."
http://www.nbcnews.com/feature/nbc-out/ … ns-n698416

Poor Peter Theil. Trump is going to end up getting him banned from his local country club. People were talking about the GOP turning a new leaf with gay when Trump picked up a rainbow flag on stage but if he signs this bill, it would take nothing short of a SCOTUS case to repeal it.
KEN-JENNINGS
I am all that is MOD!
+2,774|4222|949

You're not allowed to discriminate against people who discriminate!

This part of that bill makes me cry:

Defines "person" as any person regardless of religious affiliation, including corporations and other entities regardless of for-profit or nonprofit status.
Superior Mind
Member
+1,730|4283
Macbeth, why do you assume every trans person is emotionally unstable- anymore than anyone else?
SuperJail Warden
Member
+169|1310
Because not accepting your gender is mental illness. You never hear dogs chewing off their genitals.
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+1,741|4362|Banoi, PNG

Yeah, you are like a walking smorgasbord of imbalances. Really got no place to be all critical and patronizing about other people's problems like that.

Also, dogs have been known to be sexually attracted to their close relatives. Bar's not set very high on that one.
SuperJail Warden
Member
+169|1310
Big difference between attraction and self mutilation
DesertFox-
The very model of a modern major general
+699|4275|United States of America
I don't recall being transgender meaning those people have an urge to self-mutilate. I don't know what people did before gender reassignment surgery and hormone therapy were things (though you can probably find some one-off cases of crazy folk chopping dicks off), but I do know that not every transgender person even wants to do anything different to their genitals. Unsurprisingly, it sounds like blanket statements aren't terribly accurate.
uziq
Member
+138|1043

SuperJail Warden wrote:

Because not accepting your gender is mental illness. You never hear dogs chewing off their genitals.
you are on a level with jay with this shit.

transgenderism basically is the newfangled term for people who don't identify with the binary gender system. seeing as even in biology, not to mention psychology and sociology, that it's uncontroversial to criticise the construction of 'gender' as a strictly x/y thing, transgender people aren't exactly freaks.

transgender people don't want to 'self-mutilate'. wanting to undergo a sex change has always been referred to as transsexualism. there is, putting aside a lot of genetic and evolutionary nuance, a male and female sex. people debate the social construction and psychological makeup of 'manhood' and 'womanhood', however, especially given how one's sex is determined in the early stages of foetal development (not to mention the much deeper questions about how far physiognomy determines identity: there are varying levels of female hormones in dudes with penises, and vice versa; our physical perception and intuition of ourselves is a delicate psychochemical and hormonal balance).

none of this is even controversial. people have been discussing the idea of a 'spectrum' of gender and sexuality since about the 1970s. transgenderism is just a trendy new set of terms and the fact these ideas are now going mainstream, mostly with young people who, let's face it, love adopting new movements and terms in order to distinguish themselves from their elders (not to say 90% of them aren't being genuine and authentic, just that new generations always adopt new ideas with a special fervour; they are, after all, the ones who are most flexible in their ideas and identities).

for the record, self- or auto-castration is a very real thing in men, and the urge normally presents itself in straight people. there are many cases of mentally ill men cutting their dicks off. often men with compulsive issues, porn addictions, drug dependencies, underlying issues with sexual perversion or child molestation, etc. a lot of men are taken in to A&E every year after attacking their own genitals. not many of them do so because they want to be a woman.

by the way i've never identified as anything other than a heterosexual male. cisgender? even that term is probably out of date now. i don't keep up with it and am incurious about my own gender. but the point of the transgender issue has always seemed pretty salient to me. macbeth you should stop casting aspersions. you are the least mentally stable person here and would make a lot of married gay couples ane transgender teenagers look eminently sensible. ditto with jay's bullshit. i'm sure a young guy who feels as though he's a woman by temperament and social identity is a much bigger danger to his self and others than all those white supremacist rednecks who want to blow up government buildings.

Last edited by uziq (2016-12-27 02:49:59)

SuperJail Warden
Member
+169|1310
I can accept that a guy would be interested in the attention and interest a woman receives and would like to experience that dressed like a woman. I can believe a woman would be interested in getting the same sort of respect and authority a guy gets and want to dress like a guy.


So I guess it is like being an actress and playing a role. Anyone wanting to modify their body to change genders is still mentally ill though.
uziq
Member
+138|1043
we're really four pages into a thread you started about transgenderism and you're still missing the ballpark approximation of what transgenderism is by several miles. this is really what's happening, isn't it?

dressing up and roleplaying as the other sex as part of an alternate identity or assumed role is called transvestitism. do you want me to get you a handbook?

Last edited by uziq (2016-12-27 03:17:38)

SuperJail Warden
Member
+169|1310
I said I am fine with people playing dress up and going about their day completely unbothered with full and equal rights.

I am just saying that people wanting to cut out their penises or breast and pump their body full of hormones are sick and need help. Psychologist agree that this is an illness.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_dysphoria
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_dysmorphic_disorder
uziq
Member
+138|1043
so you are fine with transvestites, i.e. people who play dress up, which has nothing to do with this topic whatsoever. good to know they have your eminently sensible and reasonable approval!

again, the cutting off of the penises. i don't think self-mutilation is a widespread issue in the transgender community. certainly no more prevalent than it is amongst mentally disturbed and distressed heterosexual males with no questions about their gender whatsoever. this is a bit of a red herring with you. people who want to physically remake themselves are called transsexuals – see above comments about transvestites. this topic is not about 'transsexuals who join the military'.

and yes, psychologists have formally classified gender dysphoria as a thing ... for people who experience dysphoria (that is, distress and unhappiness resulting in an episode of mental health issues). not all transgender people have dysphoria. can you wrap your head around that one?

Last edited by uziq (2016-12-27 04:08:21)

unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+1,741|4362|Banoi, PNG

SuperJail Warden wrote:

I can believe a woman would be interested in getting the same sort of respect and authority a guy gets and want to dress like a guy.
Do you live in Saudi Arabia? How does a woman even "dress like a guy" in western countries anymore? The vast majority of men's clothing can be considered unisex. Why, what were you thinking of? Jockstraps?
uziq
Member
+138|1043

uziq wrote:

i'm sure a young guy who feels as though he's a woman by temperament and social identity is a much bigger danger to his self and others than all those white supremacist rednecks who want to blow up government buildings.
close, but no cigar
jsnipy
...
+3,272|4113|...

[unisex]
SuperJail Warden
Member
+169|1310
Trannies should not be allowed on Tinder. Thank god I looked at the person's profile before I rejected them. Post-op tranny. Gross.
War Man
Australians are hermaphrodites
+552|4304|Purplicious Wisconsin
They also are no longer allowed in the US military, thank God.
The irony of guns, is that they can save lives.
SuperJail Warden
Member
+169|1310
The trannies already in the military should be grandfathered in and allowed to stay. The ban should only affect new recruits.
KEN-JENNINGS
I am all that is MOD!
+2,774|4222|949

you guys are real pieces of shit.
SuperJail Warden
Member
+169|1310
If we go to war with north Korea, I hope Ken and his tranny friends die first.
War Man
Australians are hermaphrodites
+552|4304|Purplicious Wisconsin

KEN-JENNINGS wrote:

you guys are real pieces of shit.
The military is not a fucking social circle, it is a fighting force. Transgender people add complexity in trying to manage in what to do with them as well as decrease combat effectiveness/morale.

Last edited by War Man (2017-08-15 13:19:59)

The irony of guns, is that they can save lives.
AussieReaper
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
+5,760|3743|what

Are they any less patriotic than you Warman?

Should they not be allowed to fight for the flag of their fathers?
https://i.imgur.com/maVpUMN.png

"coz you a far cry from acclaim nigga ubisoft"
War Man
Australians are hermaphrodites
+552|4304|Purplicious Wisconsin

AussieReaper wrote:

Are they any less patriotic than you Warman?

Should they not be allowed to fight for the flag of their fathers?
Not a matter of patriotism, but of practicality and effectiveness.

Which physical standards would you put man-to-woman and woman-to-man trannies at? Which barracks do we put them in? Do we a create 1-2 more separate facilities for them? How do you think other soldiers' morale would be like fighting alongside them? How effective would a unit with at least one tranny be compared to say, an all male non-tranny unit?

Homosexual and transgendered people in the military are two different things. I am fine with homosexuals, as long as they are professional, but trannies are a different matter that is more complicated.
The irony of guns, is that they can save lives.
DesertFox-
The very model of a modern major general
+699|4275|United States of America
I don't know why this is even being discussed as a hypothetical problem, seeing as there already are transgender people in the military who serve with distinction. You'd have to ask their unit how they felt about it. Secondly, it's not like it's the Tuskeegee Airmen; they're not going to create the 17th Transgender Regiment and put them all in one group. It's a very small segment of the small segment of the population who join the military.
KEN-JENNINGS
I am all that is MOD!
+2,774|4222|949

War Man wrote:

AussieReaper wrote:

Are they any less patriotic than you Warman?

Should they not be allowed to fight for the flag of their fathers?
Not a matter of patriotism, but of practicality and effectiveness.

Which physical standards would you put man-to-woman and woman-to-man trannies at? Which barracks do we put them in? Do we a create 1-2 more separate facilities for them? How do you think other soldiers' morale would be like fighting alongside them? How effective would a unit with at least one tranny be compared to say, an all male non-tranny unit?

Homosexual and transgendered people in the military are two different things. I am fine with homosexuals, as long as they are professional, but trannies are a different matter that is more complicated.
because only Homos can't be professional, and Transgenders are inherently unprofessional. 

Why would you need to create separate facilities? You understand they transition from Male to Female or Female to Male, not to Chimeras or dolphins, right?  Pretty sure we have facilities already built for male and female soldiers.  Last I checked it's not a complication the Armed Forces has had to waste a lot of time understanding the practicality and effectiveness of.

Regarding the morale "issue", it's a non-issue.  You're a military fetishist, you should know the indoctrination regarding "brotherhood" and "no soldier left behind".  I would imagine people are able to extend that feeling to yes, EVEN transgenders (GASP!).  And if they can't, they shouldn't be representing American ideals.

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