SuperJail Warden
Gone Forever
+641|3957
22,000 Americans commit suicide by firearm per year. That is more than half of the 40,000 Americans that commit suicide per year. This is a 40,000 person stadium filled.
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Whenever we talk about the 34,000 American killed by firearm per year, we are told by gun rights advocates that the suicides should be discounted from the total. Does anyone believe this may be a ridiculous idea to do?

Firearm suicide attempts are much more successful than suicide attempts by poisoning or even jumping. If restricting access to guns help reduce the suicide rate, why shouldn't that be something we do? Isn't it a good thing to have people be forced to try less successful methods of killing themselves?

I think when we talk about gun deaths we need to talk about firearm suicides and how we reduce the total amount of killed that way.

Do you disagree?
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Ty
Mass Media Casualty
+2,398|7012|Noizyland

Absolutely not. Access to firearms has a clear correlation to suicide deaths. When my mother was in the depths of depression she wanted to off herself. However she is scared of knives and couldn't bring herself to commit to cutting her wrists properly and when she tried to drown herself her panic reflex caught on and she ended up giving up and heading back to shore. I remember one of the worst times when she had attempted and failed to cut her wrists she demanded I get the key to the gun safe and shoot her. The fact she didn't have access to the guns in the house at that point, (only two keys, I have one, Dad has the other,) saved her life.

She has been good for a while though had a crisis recently so I went home to take care of her. I found to my dismay that she had acquired a key to the safe and had obviously been toying with the idea of suicide again. I found the shotgun out in the study and a collection of .270 rounds which she had obviously been trying to load into it. I found it funny - trust me, when you deal with this sort of shit you find humour where you can. She confessed to me that she was just "seeing if she could". I'm not sure if she meant seeing if she could use a firearm for in case she felt like offing herself or seeing if she could bring herself to use it on herself straight away. Either way it again shows how access to firearms and depression is a very dangerous mix. Had she known what she was doing she could have taken it just that fraction too far and then game over.

Trying to discount suicide deaths from overall firearm deaths is a broken argument. It's equal to arguing that a mad gunman would have been just as much danger without a gun because they would have opted for knives or explosives or something else to do harm. But it doesn't really work like that. Guns are easy, they give a sense of disconnection, and short of knowing that you don't put bullets in a shotgun anyone can use one. A mentally ill person with access to a firearm can be a danger to others but a mentally ill person with access to a firearm is far more of a danger to themselves. Mental illness doesn't discriminate, you have little to no control over who deals with it and how. However you can take steps to limit access to firearms and it is insane not to. That was certainly the first step I took.
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Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,815|6344|eXtreme to the maX
Probably not, many of those suicidal people would have thought harder if they hadn't had access to a gun and likely had time to recover.
Equally a good number of murders would not occur if people didn't have hold of a gun.

I like guns, I enjoy competition shooting, but you have to be realistic and sensible.
Fuck Israel
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|7010|PNW

Keeping firearms in the same house as a suicidal strikes me as a bit cruel and possibly unwise. But what do I know.
Steve-0
Karma limited. Contact Admin to Be Promoted.
+215|4198|SL,UT

do you know how to use a gun?
Ty
Mass Media Casualty
+2,398|7012|Noizyland

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

Keeping firearms in the same house as a suicidal strikes me as a bit cruel and possibly unwise. But what do I know.
Unwise to judge without knowing everything about the situation too.
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unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|7010|PNW

There's no possible way I could possibly know everything about "the situation" from three whole paragraphs, and am not sure whether I should be insulted that you think I thought I did. I suppose you might have interpreted it as contempt, when it was meant to be simply blunt. But you can lower your guard, because I'm not really into judging suicidals, and it takes a special set of circumstances for their immediate family to be worthy of ire. I'm just working with what I'm given as well as studies and a bit of my own experience which I don't really feel like going into here.
Ty
Mass Media Casualty
+2,398|7012|Noizyland

Fair enough. These aren't easy matters to deal with.

Apologies for being prickly. Not usually the case.
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