BF2S Forums Some England riot sentences 'too severe'

Those sentences are pretty ridiculous, but hardly surprising. I won't shed a tear for any of them though.

Jay wrote:

Those sentences are pretty ridiculous, but hardly surprising. I won't shed a tear for any of them though.

I know you like me, and I know you like macbeth. Well we've come to this conclusion:

Macbeth wrote:

jord wrote:

I'd agree with the justice advocates, it is too severe. It's an inflated sentance based on public anger, tired migistrates under a lot of pressure and kneejerk reactions. There isn't some elite that organised the whole thing that you can pin large sentances on and be done with it.

So I mean, feel free to fall in line with that.

jord wrote:

lowing wrote:

jord wrote:

I'd assume he's talking more about a heavy handed police force, though I don't know if he's doing a hypothetical on UK residents or speaking for his own country.


Either way I sincerely doubt he's talking about lack of welfare creating pressure on his life...

No he is talking about wanting to let off some steam as well, if the govt. pressured him too much. That can not be taken any other way than how it was said.

I know it can't, he said if the government pressured him he'd want to let off steam. How do you get into an attack on welfare from that? I'd just assume he's talking about the police here, afterall that's what sparked the events... Though it wasn't the cause of what happened elsewhere, it was just the start of the snowball.

He said he would want to let off some steam as well. As if, he understands those that actually DID "let off some steam" IE riot. and thinks they rioted because the govt. pressured them too much.

jord wrote:

lowing wrote:

jord wrote:

I know it can't, he said if the government pressured him he'd want to let off steam. How do you get into an attack on welfare from that? I'd just assume he's talking about the police here, afterall that's what sparked the events... Though it wasn't the cause of what happened elsewhere, it was just the start of the snowball.

He said he would want to let off some steam as well. As if, he understands those that actually DID "let off some steam" IE riot. and thinks they rioted because the govt. pressured them too much.

Right I'm following you, so how do you go government pressured them too much to the topic of welfare?


And just so you know, there's been very little change to welfare over the last few years, so I very much doubt it's any kind of trigger. (Unless someone has been just festering with rage over changes made some number of years ago)

THe govt. can only pressure you in 2 ways in a western society regarding this topic...By taking too much of your wealth for redistribution or not giving enough to those wanting to be distributed to. I will let you decide which category this guy fits into.

jord wrote:

lowing wrote:

jord wrote:

Right I'm following you, so how do you go government pressured them too much to the topic of welfare?


And just so you know, there's been very little change to welfare over the last few years, so I very much doubt it's any kind of trigger. (Unless someone has been just festering with rage over changes made some number of years ago)

THe govt. can only pressure you in 2 ways in a western society regarding this topic...By taking too much of your wealth for redistribution or not giving enough to those wanting to be distributed to. I will let you decide which category this guy fits into.

Well police harassment is another way they can pressure you.

Yeah, I can't count how many times the cops have harassed me every week. How about you? You know what he said and you know what he meant. Stop defending his ass. He feels pressured by the govt. to perform because he is not getting handout the way he thinks he should.

lowing wrote:

jord wrote:

lowing wrote:

THe govt. can only pressure you in 2 ways in a western society regarding this topic...By taking too much of your wealth for redistribution or not giving enough to those wanting to be distributed to. I will let you decide which category this guy fits into.

Well police harassment is another way they can pressure you.

Yeah, I can't count how many times the cops have harassed me every week. How about you? You know what he said and you know what he meant. Stop defending his ass. He feels pressured by the govt. to perform because he is not getting handout the way he thinks he should.

No I don't know what he meant and neither do you. Government pressure can be taking other ways than just "theyz getting less welfare money they pissed". This is a moot argument until he comes online and elaborates.

Then you've never been poor.

Ilocano wrote:

Jay wrote:

Then you've never been poor.

Being poor =/= excuse to be a criminal.  All about character.  I'd trust the illegal trimming my lawn before any suburbia wannabe rapper with entitlement issues.

Well, that's part of it. It's not so much entitlement, as it is filling peoples heads with lofty goals. We live in a world where people want to be rich and famous like they see on tv. They want to be on MTV Cribs (or whatever the equivalent is today). They want the Bentley's and the Lexus'. The media has marketed it as the penultimate goal. That, coupled with stuff like 'The American Dream' where we tell people they can go from rags to riches, and you end up with a lot of people with big goals and no hope of getting there.

You don't get that issue with immigrants, or children of immigrants. Their goals are usually much simpler. Provide for their kids, and give them a better life than they had themselves. That's my goal anyway, and I know that I share it with the vast majority of hispanics I've worked with. It means working shitty jobs if that's what's available to you. It means making sacrifices. Simple goals, but you get a payoff in the end.

People that turn to crime generally do so because they want the end goal, but either don't understand the steps to get there, or they want to take shortcuts. This is why you can always tell who the drug dealer is in the projects: look at the car he's driving. Work sucks, and working shitty jobs sucks even harder. The only way you'll ever get people to stop being wannabe thugs is to somehow instill some sort of family ethic in them. Not to sound like a social conservative (because I'm not one, at all), but it's the increasing destruction of the family unit that leads to crime than anything else. I don't know many fathers that turn to crime when they have a dependent wife and kids waiting at home for them.

I dunno, I don't have any solutions.

lowing wrote:

Jay wrote:

Then you've never been poor.

I see, so, are you saying being poor is the same as being a criminal or justifies being a criminal?

They were fuckin teenagers Jay, they were not laid off stock brokers that had it all the nlost everything. Hardly anyone is rich at the ages these assholes are at now, yet still somehow, manage to go through life without blowing up a single business, or looting. they have to earn their way through life getting experience, raises, and education along the way. Of course this is the problem, they don't wanna be bothered with any of that stuff.

Actually the biggest demographic of rioters is 20s-30s

Not "fucking teenagers" at all.

H2H

Can I point out that 20-30 totals 49% of all charged and 66% are between 20 and 40.

Last edited by Cheeky_Ninja06 (2011-08-19 09:51:23)

RTHKI wrote:

why would you lump ages 20-40 together.

"20s and 30s"

i.e. old enough to have a job etc not the wave of teenagers Lowing was talking about that had yet to experience the real world.

Last edited by Cheeky_Ninja06 (2011-08-19 10:13:24)

RTHKI wrote:

why would you lump ages 20-40 together.

lol take a wild guess why he would.

Cheeky_Ninja06 wrote:

lowing wrote:

Cheeky_Ninja06 wrote:

Can I point out that 20-30 totals 49% of all charged and 66% are between 20 and 40.

Look, don't even try it. the VAST majority of those idiots, 69% in the top 2 groups were younger than 24. So please stop with the maneuvering. They were teenagers and young 20 somethings. My post about them stands.

Jay said they were young people who wanted to take a shortcut to get rich. You said they were too young to be considering it. 20+ does not count as naive children.

By your previous posts there was a clear inferrence that everbody in the rioting was too young to have a job or even have finished their education. Go read your posts and ask if that still applies at mid twenties.

No, clearly my post was meant that at the ages of those rioting, they were no where near the point of making any real money, just like the rest of us at those ages, yes even 20 fuckin 4.