Pages: 1 2

 

2005-10-26 12:38:06
DUFFKING
Insert witty comment here
+3|6750|Brixham, UK
Before I begin, I'd like to point out that in many cases, I believe that having aircraft in the game can be beneficial.

However, I often feel that having bombers and so on in the game is detrimental to the experience of others. When I get in a tank, more often than not, it lasts about 3-4 minutes on a 64 player server before it gets bombed to heck. It's very frustrating for me, as my general thought process is:

'Oh yes! I'm in a tank! It's time to go blow the living everything out of stuff!'

It's a tank. I'm in a giant, metal, shell firing BEAST of a machine. I want to use it for it's intended purpose, not become a masssive target for every airborne object in the game bar clouds and the sun.

OK, flying is a skill that takes a lot of skill and patience to learn. But does anyone else believe that sometimes, games can be spoiled by the inclusion of aircraft? Is it not enough for the commander to be able to call in artillery barrages? All to often I see well planned tactical assaults on cp's decimated by a single aircraft. Sometimes, I have to think 'whats the point'.

P.S. This rant has been spawned by the fact that I am currently watching my dad play online at the moment, and i've seen people get bombed so many times it seems ridiculous.
2005-10-26 13:27:21
DrDestruction
Utilityman
+1|6770
Kubra Dam and Gulf of Oman are notorious maps for this.

I love flying too, and I suppose I dont think about it when I fly, but I know now that I intentionally avoid Gulf of Oman other than 16 player size because of the aircraft problem.

I don't think the game is ruined, I just think either the bombs need to do a little less damage or there need to be less planes (which is saying alot, considering the most planes there usually are on a given map is what, 4?).  I dont know.  I just avoid the maps I have issues with.
2005-10-26 13:33:43
DUFFKING
Insert witty comment here
+3|6750|Brixham, UK
Yeah, thats why I mostly try to play city maps: Only really have to worry about things like helicopters.

I've never liked Oman though. I think whenever I play that map it replaces my head with a flourescant pink baloon, and places an arrow on my had saying 'SHOOT HERE TO KILL.'

In the last day or so, i've tried to apply for commander on such maps instead. I've only succeeded in application 3-4 times, but I've had enough practice offline to know the interface well enough to be an asset to my team.
2005-10-26 13:39:14
Lawk
Member
+2|6766
I think the plane problem can be atleast partially solved by removing the ability to reload during flight.  As in, you drop the bombs/fire missiles and thats it, gota go back and get more.  Then, reloading/repairing at the airfield should be more involved.  Id say you should have to land and stop in the appointed location before you get more ammo and repairs.  Not just a flyby at 200mph.  I guess the reload crew just tosses the missiles in the air at just the right time and they perfectly latch onto the jet while its doing Mach 15.

This may solve the problem that i experience most of being in a tank, getting bombed, exiting the viehicle to repair, and then getting bombed again which kills me, but my tank is sitting their about to explode.  You might say, "Dont get out of the tank.", but I say "How many fucking bombs can that flying shit pile hold?!"  If it were an A-10 Warthog i could understand, but then atleast I would have a good chance of hitting it with my main gun.

Although maybe the only problem is the shitty AA weapons.

Last edited by Lawk (2005-10-26 13:47:56)

2005-10-26 13:43:37
Robkazoe
Member
+0|6750
I simply hate aircrafts. I also hate tanks a little bit (only for the spawncamping, in normal battles they are ok) but the difference between tanks and aircraft is that the tank is easy to destroy (anti tank kit, C4, AT Rocketlauncher in the levels or AT mines). There isn't an anti-aircraft kit, C4/mines are impossible, the only two thinks that work are other aircrafts or use the mounted anti air rocket launchers but the plains has nice flares so it's almost impossible to shoot the aircrafts out of the air. The AA tank is powerfull but way to weak (5 or 6 rockets from a chopper or 1 bomb of a aircraft and BOOM! dead).

The Fix: Simply remove the flares so mounted AA guns can easier hit a plain.

Last edited by Robkazoe (2005-10-26 13:45:01)

2005-10-26 13:47:23
DUFFKING
Insert witty comment here
+3|6750|Brixham, UK
Good point.

Personally, I think two other measures could be taken against this problem:

An Anti-Aircraft class of sorts. Maybe in the form of a deployable turret?

make the flipping anti aircraft emplacements work. Too many times have my missiles randomly veered away from a locked on target for no reason, even at a range of about 15 metres.
2005-10-26 13:54:41
savu
Member
+0|6804
DUffKING AND LAWK u took words from my mouth!!that 's the way it should be!!i dont fly aviators but betting bombed too much...theres some maos 2 seat aviators and thats a experience to be a missile gunner in aviatior(homing missiles what dont look is it frien or foe!)!!i think that reload system is ridicilous and need to be fixed somehow...at least i hope.those who have stick have no prob. at flying but i dont have and its really hard(thats my opininion)but im good with chopper or slick atleast average but this was REALLY GOOD TOPIC AND I AGREE FROM WORD TO WORD WITH U GUYS!!THX!!
2005-10-26 14:05:18
Azr4eL
Member
+0|6784|Italy
No one play Call of Duty? Nor Cod:United Offensive, I immagine. Well, CoD is more focused in infantry warfare than BF, and the introduction of the tanks in UO have started the same complains of above :"Why the hell I have learned how to use a rifle to instant kill someone, when they can be invulnerable to this just using a damned Tiger????"
Air superiority is the key of modern warfare: the only thing tha can balance air power is ... AIR POWER. Yes, I hate to play where the only 2 expert pilots are on the opposite side than me... So i've learned how to use planes. And now, when I realized I'm the "less n00b" pilot of my side just spawn on the airfield and then GO TO BURN DOWN THOSE B*STARD F***** BANDIT!!
And by the way... search the forum: you must read a wonderful article about "How to dismantile an enemy plane with a water pistol and a couple of Stinger"  .... Well... maybe the title is A LITTLE different!
2005-10-26 14:10:21
US|dirtysouth
purple sticky punch
+0|6806|englewood FL.
ya its like a whole diff. game in a jet, i can fly jus fine..slow fast high low..but i cant bom at all, and havent given it enough time to try really.
but.. i have also seen my hole team get hosed 3 times ina row by the untakable USMC airstrip in clean sweep i think( i can picture the map but not the name)

Last edited by US|dirtysouth (2005-10-26 14:11:28)

2005-10-26 14:14:07
DrDestruction
Utilityman
+1|6770

DUFFKING wrote:

Good point.

Personally, I think two other measures could be taken against this problem:

An Anti-Aircraft class of sorts. Maybe in the form of a deployable turret?

make the flipping anti aircraft emplacements work. Too many times have my missiles randomly veered away from a locked on target for no reason, even at a range of about 15 metres.
Exactly.  While I don't think an anti-aircraft class is feasible, I do believe that adding maybe one anti-aircraft missile to the AT kit is possible and fair.  That way, you arent necessarily spamming the area with these missiles, but it gives you something of a chance.

Truth be told, and Ive said this in other threads, I think the biggest issue is the lack of mobile anti-air units and the lack of effective anti-air missiles (either from fixed installations or mobile units).  Fix this, or at least make them more effective, and it would even out surprisingly well.

By lack of anti-air units, I mean on maps like Gulf of Oman and Wake Island.  Stinger sites are almost useless against fixed wing aircraft, but I have seen the mobile anti-airs take out quite a few.  One of the few reasons why I still play Kubra.
2005-10-26 14:31:16
.:ronin:.|Patton
Respekct dad i love u always
+946|6801|Marathon, Florida Keys
you always have the option of getting in a jet and shooting them down.......i dont use armor that much tho but i know how annyoing it is.
https://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g117/patton1337/stats.jpg
2005-10-26 15:38:39
superfly_cox
soup fly mod
+717|6773

i play tank alot but i don't mind being taken down by air units.  that's the life in the battlefield.  what bothers me is that air units can take out a tank with impunity.  there is nothing to counter them.  so my suggestion is don't alter the ability of plane to take down tanks...that is necessary (even though i have a ton of frustrating deaths from this).  make sure that the planes are easier to shoot down so you don't get massacred as often as you do.

my observation is on board with lots of planes, if one team has two good pilots they will dominate completely on a 64 player server!!!  not right...
2005-10-26 15:53:38
slidero
points
+31|6768
I would have no problem with removing the bombers from the game.  They're just way too easy to use and even if you constantly get shot down you can still get around a 5:1 ratio in them just by bombing shit over and over again.

edit: I suck at typing.

Last edited by slidero (2005-10-26 15:54:06)

2005-10-26 16:13:40
Lawk
Member
+2|6766
I dont think the jets should be tweaked.  Part of what I mentioned above has to do with their ability to stay in the air constantly.  Usually what grounds a jet is when they try to break particular laws of physics:  Two pieces of mass cannot occupy the same space at the same time.  In other words, when they crash.  If only the airplane repair procedure impeded their flight time, I would consider their setup more balanced.  If you want to repair a tank you have to STOP and do it yourself or have a mobile repair unit which requires teamwork.  They way jets are setup in this game makes them far superior in that realm.
2005-10-26 18:39:59
DrDestruction
Utilityman
+1|6770
Again, this isn't really an issue with the jets.

If EA would just add a little more/more effective AA in this game, everything would be fine.
2005-10-26 19:01:30
SoulBeeper
Member
+0|6773
I agree.
I love to fly the planes though but yes, once you learn how to move the plane the "right" way once you get  that noice when somebody locks on you, its too hard for people to shoot you down. even with the heavier and less "agile" bombers its too easy to avoid missiles.
they claim to have tweaked the AA but its not noticable. to me anyhow

as to the being bombed all the time, there are places that are more difficult to bomb than others. next to big things  haha like the big cylinders on daqing oil fields. in the forest it is also more difficult to hit your target. just learn how to avoid it or learn how to fly and shoot them down. or just go by foot VERY hard to spot foot soildiers that are not on the flags.
thats my five cents
2005-10-27 02:11:52
eatmywheaties
Member
+2|6750

DrDestruction wrote:

Kubra Dam and Gulf of Oman are notorious maps for this.
don't forget about operation clean sweep
2005-10-27 02:21:38
pinky_81
Member
+1|6781|Denmark
Make the planes only be able to drop 1 bomb at a time (reload times as TV-missile) - Perhaps make the bombs smaller and definately make the land to get rearmed...
And give the Portable Stinger to the engineer instead of the AT-guy
2005-10-27 02:36:58
Rosse_modest
Member
+76|6768|Antwerp, Flanders

eatmywheaties wrote:

DrDestruction wrote:

Kubra Dam and Gulf of Oman are notorious maps for this.
don't forget about operation clean sweep
And Daqing Oilfields
2005-10-27 02:39:04
WhyteDem0n
Member
+0|6771
I agree with making the jets' repair/reloads more complicated, but as it implies, that will be rather hard. Landing on the carriers will not be easy for most people, unless they add one of those cords that catch you before you fly off the end :-P But giving a class portable turrets is not going to happen, because there would be 59519034389217528903457 turrets placed all over the map. Planes do not need to removed whatsoever or weakened, their system just needs a bit of tweaking. Also, dropping only one bomb would suck, it'd be a lot harder to hit stuff >_<
2005-10-27 04:49:00
(9)Kermit
Teh Milho
+0|6756|Sumter SC

WhyteDem0n wrote:

Also, dropping only one bomb would suck, it'd be a lot harder to hit stuff >_<
I disagree. The Chinese plane has the ability to drop one at a time, and I always use that now, it took a while playing on unranked and/or singleplayer to get the technique down, but now I can reduce collateral damage by only dropping one. Well yeah it would be harder, but once you got it down it would be better, especially with the two-seaters, that would mean five bombing runs before reloading.

The AA definitely needs to be improved, especially on the carriers and airfields. Either that or I don't know how to use the AA. Could be both.
2005-10-27 05:33:07
dsb
Member
+0|6769

DUFFKING wrote:

'Oh yes! I'm in a tank! It's time to go blow the living everything out of stuff!'
Does it not occur to you that maybe the person in the plane said to him/her self, "Oh yes! I'm in a plane!  It's time to go nuke those damn tanks that are tearing up our infantry."

Does it also not occur to you that the same sentiments that you have towards planes, are the same sentiments people that play mostly as infantry have towards tanks?

If you had said, do something to decrease the virtual invulnerability of planes to forces on the ground, I'd a gree with you.  But it seems like you're saying, "no one should be able to kill me while I'm in a tank so I can go rape the opposition without interference."  And that just seems stupid.
2005-10-27 05:37:15
B.Schuss
I'm back, baby... ( sort of )
+664|6833|Cologne, Germany

well, it's modern warfare and air power is vital. there is no way around that. If you don't have capable pilots on your team, you are mostly doomed. But that is realistic. If you feel you are constantly on the team with the idiot pilots, get a joystick.

As far as AA Defense is concerned, I agree that the Stingers / IGLA emplacements are still a bit too weak. But on Gulf of Oman for example, there are at least 4 AA emplacements spread over the map. I assure you, enemy planes won't stay up long if you man those all. Most people just cannot be bothered to stay in that AA longer than it will take them to fire two missiles. there have been times where I have dedicated myself to Air Defense for the whole map, and it's always worked out well for my team. Sure, Air defense isn't all that fun ( no flag capping, no C4, no M95 headshots ), but it is vitally important. As often with BF2, teamplay wins the day here...

I have even seen groups of Spec Ops putting C4 on enemy runways. There are a lot of things a creative team can do to counter the threat posed by enemy air assets. you need to have an organized Air Defense, that's all.
I know though , that this can be hard to come by on public servers....

I also agree that planes should need to land before being able to repair and re-arm. Hopefully, EA addresses that in the next patch.
2005-10-27 06:09:06
cohen1976
Member
+14|6759
a jet can take out a tank easy ....but u need a good pilot for that
if the game is balanced u have pilots on both sides.
im an ok pilot as long there isent another good pilot around....with other pilots around i wont get much time and options to bomb on the ground cuz im constant doing dog fights in the air..
its very simple an american general once said "if u own the sky's u own the war"
then second if your plane is realy damaged just flying over the airport isent enough to get fixed 100%... i use to land when im on 25% condition to get fully repaird. but as long as im standing stil on the airport im a sitting duck for all other pilots or enemy's. so if a plane had to land every time it needs ammo ..then the airport would be camped with dudes with noob tubes. imo its all about balance.
2005-10-27 06:13:43
shortah
Oh did you want that tank?
+0|6763|Mechanicsville, VA

B.Schuss wrote:

I also agree that planes should need to land before being able to repair and re-arm. Hopefully, EA addresses that in the next patch.
That could possibly be the stupidest thing I've read today... What would the point of having to land to rearm be, that would take the entire point of mobile rearming out of the game... like heli's you don't have to land to rearm, you can hover 20 feet above the heli-pad, and be rearmed and repaired, or I could hover above a supply box and do the same thing.  Forcing a plane to land to rearm would require entirely to much effort on EA's part. Think about the planes take about 5-7 of deaccelerating before you notice it enough to land on the aircraft or runaway now, and the only planes that it is possible to land with is the f-35, because essentially its a harrier.  And personally I think that the AA is strong enough as it is, they need to make them slower, but more accurate.  I mean even through the upgrade, thats one of the things a skilled pilot will be able to do, is DODGE MISSLES.  It is possible. It happens in real life. PILOTS DODGE MISSLES. GET USE TO IT. What I do think they should do is give airplanes only 1 set of flares... and in order to get another set you ahve to rearm. kinda of like the bombs.. so If you ahve someone on your tail.. and you use them stupidly.. oh well.. ya just screwed yourself.  As a heli pilot I have definately noticed that the AA is more accurate and def. does more damage.  But it makes the pilots get better.  So don't get pissed when pilots start bein extremely sneaky, like I have.

This is just my 2 cents.

 

Pages: 1 2

Board footer

Privacy Policy - © 2024 Jeff Minard