Some women want to wear burqa's. How many slaves want to be slaves?
Xbone Stormsurgezz
The role social media tools like Facebook and Twitter are playing in various uprising around the world makes me a bit sad. People from Egypt to Thailand are using Facebook and Twitter to organize protest and get info out of their countries about what is happening while we in the West use FB to post pictures of ourselves in mirrors after stalking a celebs twitter feed for a few hours.
For the most part yes. But I've also seen fb used to raise awareness about charity drives, protest, and other events here in the west also.
http://www.facebook.com/pages/St-Peters … 2649602323
We'd probably see it more if we were living in an oppressive toilet also.
http://www.facebook.com/pages/St-Peters … 2649602323
We'd probably see it more if we were living in an oppressive toilet also.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
In 2005 the MB got 20% of the votes in Egypt, there are no indicators today showing them to have more support but there are signs of them having less support in Egypt than 5 years ago ...lowing wrote:
from what I read the Muslim Brotherhood is stronger than you like to downplay them as being.Varegg wrote:
The Muslim brotherhood isn't as strong as international media like to portray them, they haven't got as much support on a ground level amongst the populace that holds religion and politics separate ... a tad similar to how "Muslim" Turkey is organised ...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_Brotherhood
http://www.jpost.com/Headlines/Article.aspx?id=206130
http://www.meforum.org/687/the-muslim-b … -of-europe
what a charming group.
Egypt is not the typical Islamic country like many other Arab nations, the MB have stronger positions in other countries ... in Egypt they are not strong enough to take over and they neither have a favored candidate with support in the populace to replace Mubarak ...
Those are as close as you get to facts about Egypt and the MB.
What your paranoid "muslims-are-taking-over-the-world" sources says I don't know, I don't waste my time with garbage ...
Wait behind the line ..............................................................
No, not really.Cybargs wrote:
banning slavery isnt progressive amirite.DrunkFace wrote:
How is "banning" anything progressive?Cybargs wrote:
Egypt is actually more progressive than most people think, they banned the Burka afaik.
Giving everyone equal rights is progressive. Not allowing someone who wishes to be a slave be one is hardly progressive.
DrunkFace wrote:
No, not really.Cybargs wrote:
banning slavery isnt progressive amirite.DrunkFace wrote:
How is "banning" anything progressive?
Giving everyone equal rights is progressive. Not allowing someone who wishes to be a slave be one is hardly progressive.
ok, then link me to sources saying the MB is not a significant organization, that their objective is not the expansion of Islam and that they have no interest in manipulating western politics with Islamic ideology. Just please, stop talking shit without sourcing it.Varegg wrote:
In 2005 the MB got 20% of the votes in Egypt, there are no indicators today showing them to have more support but there are signs of them having less support in Egypt than 5 years ago ...lowing wrote:
from what I read the Muslim Brotherhood is stronger than you like to downplay them as being.Varegg wrote:
The Muslim brotherhood isn't as strong as international media like to portray them, they haven't got as much support on a ground level amongst the populace that holds religion and politics separate ... a tad similar to how "Muslim" Turkey is organised ...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_Brotherhood
http://www.jpost.com/Headlines/Article.aspx?id=206130
http://www.meforum.org/687/the-muslim-b … -of-europe
what a charming group.
Egypt is not the typical Islamic country like many other Arab nations, the MB have stronger positions in other countries ... in Egypt they are not strong enough to take over and they neither have a favored candidate with support in the populace to replace Mubarak ...
Those are as close as you get to facts about Egypt and the MB.
What your paranoid "muslims-are-taking-over-the-world" sources says I don't know, I don't waste my time with garbage ...
Didn't think they were after influencing western politics, more after keeping western politics out of the middle east.
Israel's fucked if they take over Egypt though.
e: just to say, i'm completely 100% opposed to them having any sort of political power at all.
Israel's fucked if they take over Egypt though.
e: just to say, i'm completely 100% opposed to them having any sort of political power at all.
Last edited by presidentsheep (2011-02-08 11:34:07)
I'd type my pc specs out all fancy again but teh mods would remove it. Again.
Can you name any religion that doesn't have expansion at its core?lowing wrote:
ok, then link me to sources saying the MB is not a significant organization, that their objective is not the expansion of Islam and that they have no interest in manipulating western politics with Islamic ideology. Just please, stop talking shit without sourcing it.Varegg wrote:
In 2005 the MB got 20% of the votes in Egypt, there are no indicators today showing them to have more support but there are signs of them having less support in Egypt than 5 years ago ...lowing wrote:
from what I read the Muslim Brotherhood is stronger than you like to downplay them as being.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_Brotherhood
http://www.jpost.com/Headlines/Article.aspx?id=206130
http://www.meforum.org/687/the-muslim-b … -of-europe
what a charming group.
Egypt is not the typical Islamic country like many other Arab nations, the MB have stronger positions in other countries ... in Egypt they are not strong enough to take over and they neither have a favored candidate with support in the populace to replace Mubarak ...
Those are as close as you get to facts about Egypt and the MB.
What your paranoid "muslims-are-taking-over-the-world" sources says I don't know, I don't waste my time with garbage ...
"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat
-Frederick Bastiat
Wiki warrior on MB... Awesome. My new favorite group...
One citation from the document "General Strategic Goal for the Group in North America"[29] makes the objectives of the MB clear: "The process of settlement is a 'Civilization-Jihadist Process' with all the word means. The Ikhwan must understand that their work in America is a kind of grand Jihad in eliminating and destroying the Western civilization from within and "sabotaging" its miserable house by their hands and the hands of the believers so that it is eliminated and God's religion is made victorious over all other religions."
One citation from the document "General Strategic Goal for the Group in North America"[29] makes the objectives of the MB clear: "The process of settlement is a 'Civilization-Jihadist Process' with all the word means. The Ikhwan must understand that their work in America is a kind of grand Jihad in eliminating and destroying the Western civilization from within and "sabotaging" its miserable house by their hands and the hands of the believers so that it is eliminated and God's religion is made victorious over all other religions."
I stood in line for four hours. They better give me a Wal-Mart gift card, or something. - Rodney Booker, Job Fair attendee.
Nope, what makes Islam worse is, their beliefs, culture and religion are 180 degrees out from that of western civilization. Most of the west if not all of it, is based upon Christian values and morality. to have a Christian leader, in a Christian nation is not as big a deal as having an Islamic leader, pushing Islamic values and morality onto a Christian nation.JohnG@lt wrote:
Can you name any religion that doesn't have expansion at its core?lowing wrote:
ok, then link me to sources saying the MB is not a significant organization, that their objective is not the expansion of Islam and that they have no interest in manipulating western politics with Islamic ideology. Just please, stop talking shit without sourcing it.Varegg wrote:
In 2005 the MB got 20% of the votes in Egypt, there are no indicators today showing them to have more support but there are signs of them having less support in Egypt than 5 years ago ...
Egypt is not the typical Islamic country like many other Arab nations, the MB have stronger positions in other countries ... in Egypt they are not strong enough to take over and they neither have a favored candidate with support in the populace to replace Mubarak ...
Those are as close as you get to facts about Egypt and the MB.
What your paranoid "muslims-are-taking-over-the-world" sources says I don't know, I don't waste my time with garbage ...
Your reading skills yet again fail terribly ...lowing wrote:
ok, then link me to sources saying the MB is not a significant organization, that their objective is not the expansion of Islam and that they have no interest in manipulating western politics with Islamic ideology. Just please, stop talking shit without sourcing it.Varegg wrote:
In 2005 the MB got 20% of the votes in Egypt, there are no indicators today showing them to have more support but there are signs of them having less support in Egypt than 5 years ago ...lowing wrote:
from what I read the Muslim Brotherhood is stronger than you like to downplay them as being.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_Brotherhood
http://www.jpost.com/Headlines/Article.aspx?id=206130
http://www.meforum.org/687/the-muslim-b … -of-europe
what a charming group.
Egypt is not the typical Islamic country like many other Arab nations, the MB have stronger positions in other countries ... in Egypt they are not strong enough to take over and they neither have a favored candidate with support in the populace to replace Mubarak ...
Those are as close as you get to facts about Egypt and the MB.
What your paranoid "muslims-are-taking-over-the-world" sources says I don't know, I don't waste my time with garbage ...
I didn't say MB wasn't a significant organization ... I said they are not currently in a position to take power in Egypt ...
Wait behind the line ..............................................................
I see, so I take it that you are backing away form your position of this groups significance in lieu of backing up your bullshit? I took it that you are trying to downplay this group and its presence. If so, link me to sources that does that, if not, what the hell is your point?Varegg wrote:
Your reading skills yet again fail terribly ...lowing wrote:
ok, then link me to sources saying the MB is not a significant organization, that their objective is not the expansion of Islam and that they have no interest in manipulating western politics with Islamic ideology. Just please, stop talking shit without sourcing it.Varegg wrote:
In 2005 the MB got 20% of the votes in Egypt, there are no indicators today showing them to have more support but there are signs of them having less support in Egypt than 5 years ago ...
Egypt is not the typical Islamic country like many other Arab nations, the MB have stronger positions in other countries ... in Egypt they are not strong enough to take over and they neither have a favored candidate with support in the populace to replace Mubarak ...
Those are as close as you get to facts about Egypt and the MB.
What your paranoid "muslims-are-taking-over-the-world" sources says I don't know, I don't waste my time with garbage ...
I didn't say MB wasn't a significant organization ... I said they are not currently in a position to take power in Egypt ...
Last edited by lowing (2011-02-08 13:09:08)
Are you plain stupid or don't you read what is written before you answer?lowing wrote:
I see, so I take it that you are backing away form your position of this groups significance in lieu of backing up your bullshit? I took it that you are trying to downplay this group and its presence. If so, link me to sources that does that, if not, what the hell is your point?
My initial point was to downplay the so called media imposed significance of the MB in Egypt ... the BS falls on your account for not comprehending the simplest pieces of factorial linguistics presented in this thread
Wait behind the line ..............................................................
then downplay it with some information, ya know, something other than you said so. Because from what I read, you are full of shit.Varegg wrote:
Are you plain stupid or don't you read what is written before you answer?lowing wrote:
I see, so I take it that you are backing away form your position of this groups significance in lieu of backing up your bullshit? I took it that you are trying to downplay this group and its presence. If so, link me to sources that does that, if not, what the hell is your point?
My initial point was to downplay the so called media imposed significance of the MB in Egypt ... the BS falls on your account for not comprehending the simplest pieces of factorial linguistics presented in this thread
I'll give you a cluelowing wrote:
then downplay it with some information, ya know, something other than you said so. Because from what I read, you are full of shit.Varegg wrote:
Are you plain stupid or don't you read what is written before you answer?lowing wrote:
I see, so I take it that you are backing away form your position of this groups significance in lieu of backing up your bullshit? I took it that you are trying to downplay this group and its presence. If so, link me to sources that does that, if not, what the hell is your point?
My initial point was to downplay the so called media imposed significance of the MB in Egypt ... the BS falls on your account for not comprehending the simplest pieces of factorial linguistics presented in this thread
In that wiki-link YOU provided you can actually find the hard facts about the MB in Egypt ... if you had read your links you would have known this and wouldn't have been in need of that very information you now ask for that you yourself provided in the first place ...
So now that you have given us hard facts that you truly are a dumbass I wonder what's next ...
Wait behind the line ..............................................................
I read it all. I found this little line particularly poignant.Varegg wrote:
I'll give you a cluelowing wrote:
then downplay it with some information, ya know, something other than you said so. Because from what I read, you are full of shit.Varegg wrote:
Are you plain stupid or don't you read what is written before you answer?
My initial point was to downplay the so called media imposed significance of the MB in Egypt ... the BS falls on your account for not comprehending the simplest pieces of factorial linguistics presented in this thread
In that wiki-link YOU provided you can actually find the hard facts about the MB in Egypt ... if you had read your links you would have known this and wouldn't have been in need of that very information you now ask for that you yourself provided in the first place ...
So now that you have given us hard facts that you truly are a dumbass I wonder what's next ...
In my opinion " The hard facts " seem to Buttress Lowings point.While the Muslim Brotherhood and their Saudi financiers have worked to cement Islamist influence over Germany's Muslim community, they have not limited their infiltration to Germany. Thanks to generous foreign funding, meticulous organization, and the naivete of European elites...
Last edited by Hunter/Jumper (2011-02-08 14:38:36)
"The group is the world's oldest and largest Islamic political group,[1] and the "world's most influential Islamist movement."[2] The Brotherhood has as its slogan Islam is the solution.[3] It was founded in 1928 in Egypt by the Islamic scholar and schoolteacher Hassan al-Banna."Varegg wrote:
I'll give you a cluelowing wrote:
then downplay it with some information, ya know, something other than you said so. Because from what I read, you are full of shit.Varegg wrote:
Are you plain stupid or don't you read what is written before you answer?
My initial point was to downplay the so called media imposed significance of the MB in Egypt ... the BS falls on your account for not comprehending the simplest pieces of factorial linguistics presented in this thread
In that wiki-link YOU provided you can actually find the hard facts about the MB in Egypt ... if you had read your links you would have known this and wouldn't have been in need of that very information you now ask for that you yourself provided in the first place ...
So now that you have given us hard facts that you truly are a dumbass I wonder what's next ...
"The Brotherhood's stated goal is to instill the Qur'an and Sunnah as the "sole reference point for ... ordering the life of the Muslim family, individual, community ... and state"."
"Muslim Brotherhood: ‘Prepare Egyptians for war with Israel' "
"A leading member of the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt told the Arabic-language Iranian news network Al-Alam on Monday that he would like to see the Egyptian people prepare for war against Israel, according to the Hebrew-language business newspaper Calcalist."
"Since its founding in 1928, the Muslim Brotherhood (Hizb al-Ikhwan al-Muslimun) has profoundly influenced the political life of the Middle East. Its motto is telling: "Allah is our objective. The Prophet is our leader. The Qur'an is our law. Jihad is our way. Dying in the way of Allah is our highest hope." "
"But the Middle East is only one part of the Muslim world. Europe has become an incubator for Islamist thought and political development. Since the early 1960s, Muslim Brotherhood members and sympathizers have moved to Europe and slowly but steadily established a wide and well-organized network of mosques, charities, and Islamic organizations. Unlike the larger Islamic community, the Muslim Brotherhood's ultimate goal may not be simply "to help Muslims be the best citizens they can be," but rather to extend Islamic law throughout Europe and the United States."
"Four decades of teaching and cultivation have paid off. The student refugees who migrated from the Middle East forty years ago and their descendants now lead organizations that represent the local Muslim communities in their engagement with Europe's political elite. Funded by generous contributors from the Persian Gulf, they preside over a centralized network that spans nearly every European country."
So now, I do not insult you, and I will thank you to stop insulting me. You want to downplay their presence, then do it with something more than I said so and insults.
You are supposed to be a moderator of this site, try acting like one by first and foremost following your own rules. We will work on your debating skills later.
Last edited by lowing (2011-02-08 14:48:53)
I almost commented on " the insults not helping " but I must sound like a broken record at this point. Compared to D@lt and D~Bag, he is pretty cool and he doesn't switch topics in every rebuttal. On the whole at least I can learn a little from this guy if I don't agree with most of the views. He makes me pay more attention.
Well, it is no coincidence that this forum reflects real life tactics by the left. The 5 D's of the liberal argument... dodge, deception, deflect, deny, discredit.Hunter/Jumper wrote:
I almost commented on " the insults not helping " but I must sound like a broken record at this point. Compared to D@lt and D~Bag, he is pretty cool and he doesn't switch topics in every rebuttal. On the whole at least I can learn a little from this guy if I don't agree with most of the views. He makes me pay more attention.
You guys are amazing ... I would just like to remind you both that the issue we are discussing in this thread is the unrest in Egypt and the at least what I have been discussing as part of that is the significance of the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt and their chances of getting in control ...
I stress these two points because it looks like lowing is discussing something entirely different than the topic at hand ... as usual I might add
@lowing: I thought you would post some sections from your links but really hoped you didn't because it would just cement your status as a dumbass for the very same reasons as I stated in the beginning of this post ... congrats on your success at failing ...
So NOW you do not insult ME? ... why didn't you just start the debate with not insulting anybody and I'm sure you wouldn't have gotten any in return ...
Concerning my debating skills, they are far superior to yours both in quality and context ... just ask around
I stress these two points because it looks like lowing is discussing something entirely different than the topic at hand ... as usual I might add
So you read it but didn't understand it in the context of this thread obviously ... we're not talking about Germany or Europe but Egypt ...Hunter/Jumper wrote:
I read it all. I found this little line particularly poignant.In my opinion " The hard facts " seem to Buttress Lowings point.While the Muslim Brotherhood and their Saudi financiers have worked to cement Islamist influence over Germany's Muslim community, they have not limited their infiltration to Germany. Thanks to generous foreign funding, meticulous organization, and the naivete of European elites...
@lowing: I thought you would post some sections from your links but really hoped you didn't because it would just cement your status as a dumbass for the very same reasons as I stated in the beginning of this post ... congrats on your success at failing ...
In that context I hope you mean you will pay more attention because he surely doesn't ... he either doesn't read what the rest of us are writing or he doesn't understand it because his comments or answers doesn't match with what the rest of us are discussing ...Hunter/Jumper wrote:
On the whole at least I can learn a little from this guy if I don't agree with most of the views. He makes me pay more attention.
Yes I am a moderator but first and foremost I am a member of this forum and I express my opinions just like any other member ...lowing wrote:
So now, I do not insult you, and I will thank you to stop insulting me. You want to downplay their presence, then do it with something more than I said so and insults.
You are supposed to be a moderator of this site, try acting like one by first and foremost following your own rules. We will work on your debating skills later.
So NOW you do not insult ME? ... why didn't you just start the debate with not insulting anybody and I'm sure you wouldn't have gotten any in return ...
Concerning my debating skills, they are far superior to yours both in quality and context ... just ask around
Wait behind the line ..............................................................
and where does the MB and its track record not fit into the "unrest of Egypt"? I give you the perfect example of left wing tactics. In this post we have, deflection, dismissal and discredit.Varegg wrote:
You guys are amazing ... I would just like to remind you both that the issue we are discussing in this thread is the unrest in Egypt and the at least what I have been discussing as part of that is the significance of the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt and their chances of getting in control ...
I stress these two points because it looks like lowing is discussing something entirely different than the topic at hand ... as usual I might addSo you read it but didn't understand it in the context of this thread obviously ... we're not talking about Germany or Europe but Egypt ...Hunter/Jumper wrote:
I read it all. I found this little line particularly poignant.In my opinion " The hard facts " seem to Buttress Lowings point.While the Muslim Brotherhood and their Saudi financiers have worked to cement Islamist influence over Germany's Muslim community, they have not limited their infiltration to Germany. Thanks to generous foreign funding, meticulous organization, and the naivete of European elites...
@lowing: I thought you would post some sections from your links but really hoped you didn't because it would just cement your status as a dumbass for the very same reasons as I stated in the beginning of this post ... congrats on your success at failing ...In that context I hope you mean you will pay more attention because he surely doesn't ... he either doesn't read what the rest of us are writing or he doesn't understand it because his comments or answers doesn't match with what the rest of us are discussing ...Hunter/Jumper wrote:
On the whole at least I can learn a little from this guy if I don't agree with most of the views. He makes me pay more attention.
any chance at all you will dispense with the insults and post something other than I said so, as an argument?
Ya know follow the rules you are supposed to be enforcing?
Last edited by lowing (2011-02-09 01:02:50)
*sigh*
Last attempt
Never said the MB didn't fit into the unrest of Egypt, I simply stated that the media have hyped up their significance in Egypt, they are not as powerful in Egypt as the media reports, and not because I said so but because people who's job it is to know this says so ... it's a pretty unified thought amongst the experts in the field of Arab politics ...
If you read a tad more than your usual "hate-muslims-websites" you would also know this ...
Last attempt
Never said the MB didn't fit into the unrest of Egypt, I simply stated that the media have hyped up their significance in Egypt, they are not as powerful in Egypt as the media reports, and not because I said so but because people who's job it is to know this says so ... it's a pretty unified thought amongst the experts in the field of Arab politics ...
If you read a tad more than your usual "hate-muslims-websites" you would also know this ...
Wait behind the line ..............................................................
and what I posted seems to suggest that the MB is a little more influential and significant than that. Especially considering their established track record elsewhere.Varegg wrote:
*sigh*
Last attempt
Never said the MB didn't fit into the unrest of Egypt, I simply stated that the media have hyped up their significance in Egypt, they are not as powerful in Egypt as the media reports, and not because I said so but because people who's job it is to know this says so ... it's a pretty unified thought amongst the experts in the field of Arab politics ...
If you read a tad more than your usual "hate-muslims-websites" you would also know this ...
never been to an "I hate Muslims" website. Been to to sites that exposes and tracks and sources actions in the name of Islam however.
LOL
Anyway.
It is fun to see Netanyahu demanding any future Egyptian government must honour all previous agreements
When Netanyahu has made a point of ignoring the agreements of previous Israeli governments
Anyway.
It is fun to see Netanyahu demanding any future Egyptian government must honour all previous agreements
http://liveshots.blogs.foxnews.com/2011 … -new-iran/Netanyahu said he expects any new Egyptian government to keep the peace treaty with Israel, as it has served both countries - and the entire region - well.
When Netanyahu has made a point of ignoring the agreements of previous Israeli governments
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benjamin_N … lo_AccordsFrom the inception of the Oslo accords, Netanyahu opposed them. During his term as prime minister in the late 1990s, Netanyahu consistently reneged on commitments made by previous Israeli governments as part of the Oslo peace process, leading American peace envoy Dennis Ross to note that "neither President Clinton nor Secretary [of State Madeleine] Albright believed that Bibi had any real interest in pursuing peace."
Last edited by Dilbert_X (2011-02-09 02:01:07)
Fuck Israel