Fuck its the Birds!
This picture of Saturn’s icy moon Enceladus just came down from the spacecraft yesterday
This raw, unprocessed image of Enceladus was taken on November 30, 2010 and received on Earth December 1, 2010. It’s uncalibrated and uncleaned, straight from the spacecraft. Enceladus has a string of water geysers erupting from its south pole region, and usually they are seen individually. But this view shows them all blending together.
This raw, unprocessed image of Enceladus was taken on November 30, 2010 and received on Earth December 1, 2010. It’s uncalibrated and uncleaned, straight from the spacecraft. Enceladus has a string of water geysers erupting from its south pole region, and usually they are seen individually. But this view shows them all blending together.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
http://mblogs.discovermagazine.com/bada … f-arsenic/ the breakdown.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Not aliens but still pretty big news
I'd type my pc specs out all fancy again but teh mods would remove it. Again.
Arsenic?
Inb4xenomorphs
Inb4xenomorphs
A good explanation
The bacteria (technically, the strain GFAJ-1 of Halomonadaceae) was found in Mono Lake, an extremely alkaline and salty lake in California near the Nevada border. And I do mean salty and alkaline: it has about twice the salt of ocean water, and has the incredible pH of 10 (neutral water has a pH of 7, and the pH scale is logarithmic; this means the lake water has the same alkaline strength as commercial antacids). Worse yet, the lake has a high concentration of arsenic, a deadly poison to many forms of life (including us). This makes the water toxic for most living creatures as we know them; for example there are no fish in the lake. However, there are algae, shrimp, and other such flora and fauna.
… including these new microbes. Dr. Felise Wolfe-Simon found them in the mud around the lake, and discovered that not only do they happily live with the arsenic that when subjected to high levels of arsenic in their environment, they actually incorporated it into their biochemistry!
Life like us uses a handful of basic elements in the majority of its biochemistry: carbon, hydrogen, oxygen, and nitrogen for the most part. But phosphorus is also a critical element in two major ways: it’s used as the backbone of the long, spiral-shaped DNA and RNA molecules (think of it as the winding support structure for a spiral staircase and you’ll get the picture), and it’s part of the energy transport mechanism for cells in the form of ATP (adenosine triphosphate). Without it, our cells would literally not be able to reproduce, and we’d be dead anyway if it were gone. There are many other ways phosphorus is used as well, including in cell membranes, bones, and so on. It’s a key element for all forms of life.
Oh, pardon me: all known forms of life up until now. In many ways phosphorus is chemically similar to arsenic (the latter is right below the former in the table of elements, a clear sign of chemical companionship). In fact, in very small amounts (and I mean like 50 parts per billion) arsenic may be important for life, but in larger amounts it’s incredibly toxic — there’s a terrifying litany of such attributes.
But these microbes in Mono Lake, at some point in their evolution, decided that if you can’t lick ‘em, join ‘em. They have somehow been able to utilize arsenic in the lake, using it instead of phosphorus in their biochemistry. To determine this, Dr. Wolfe-Simon took samples of the microbes, adding more and more arsenic while decreasing the amount of phosphorus in their environment to essentially zero. This would kill almost everything known to man, yet these little critters thrived. Even weirder, the bacteria were able to survive when either the phosphorus or the arsenic was reduced, but not both. So somehow, it’s able to use both of these elements as needed to survive.
Amazingly, using radioisotope-tagged molecules containing arsenic, they were able to find that the microbes incorporated the arsenic into their very DNA! It’s hard to stress how shocking this is; as I understand it, saying something like that to a microbiologist without evidence would’ve had them slowly backing away from you and looking for weapons or an escape route.
That is seriously freaky. So what does this mean in the scale of things?
For one thing, it means that life, as Jeff Goldblum so eloquently stated in "Jurassic Park", will find a way. It’s not clear at all how these bacteria were able to figure out how to utilize arsenic, but it’s not hard to imagine that understanding this will have all sorts of implications for biology, and perhaps even medicine.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Life indeed finds a way. It really does put paid to the "life only exists in a very small range of conditions" theory - large life, perhaps, but on the bacterial scale, get any relatively stable environment, a bit of heat, a bit of water and a source of chemical energy and anything goes.
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
~ Richard Feynman
We have a (large life) path that has dominated here on earth. This has happened with a predefined "small" range of conditions that we accepted as law. That doesn't mean that another path hasn't evolved to dominate somewhere else. .. with a completely alien set of rules. That is the door that was opened with this announcement. This is confirmation of what most astrobiologist have long suspected. It's time we look for life beyond the goldilocks zone.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Yeah that's my point. Anywhere with some sort of fluid in decent quantity and chemical energy should be looked at.
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
~ Richard Feynman
This is fantastic news. It shows how infinite the possibilities of life are. There could be bacteria in most planets in our solar system, using all sorts of combination of elements. Why couldn't there at least a specc of bacterial life in somewhere in jupiter's or saturn's huge atmospheres?
"All truths are easy to understand once they are discovered; the point is to discover them."
Galileo Galilei (1564-1642)
Galileo Galilei (1564-1642)
This is big, not only for the fact that one element was substituted for another .. What's to stop life from substituting other chnops elements?
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Silicon-based biology tbh.
Hell, a biology that uses pure HCl instead of water as its "core fluid"
Hell, a biology that uses pure HCl instead of water as its "core fluid"
Last edited by Spark (2010-12-04 00:47:21)
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
~ Richard Feynman
lmao!
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Aurora Borealis sits on the horizon of this night view over much of Europe (from the ISS). The Strait of Dover is relatively clear as is Paris, the "City of Lights". There is some fog over the western part of England and London.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
I remember being on a plane cruising at altitude at night flying somewhere over south-eastern Europe, the skies were as clear as I've ever seen, so you could see everything. It was probably the most impressive view I've seen in my life. Like those ISS shots, just closer. The way we build around things and how it all looks, it always reminds me so much of the way bacteria grows.
Have you ever seen an iridium flare (u prbly have, but may have thought it was a meteor). I've got an app on my phone that give me a heads up when they are about to happen. I set the magnitude for anything less than -2 (the smaller the brighter). It's pretty neat stuff man.Mekstizzle wrote:
I remember being on a plane cruising at altitude at night flying somewhere over south-eastern Europe, the skies were as clear as I've ever seen, so you could see everything. It was probably the most impressive view I've seen in my life. Like those ISS shots, just closer. The way we build around things and how it all looks, it always reminds me so much of the way bacteria grows.
http://heavens-above.com/
Xbone Stormsurgezz
mek since when did you leave the house, let alone the country
libertarian benefit collector - anti-academic super-intellectual. http://mixlr.com/the-little-phrase/
Japanese Spacecraft Misses Venus .. no worries. They get another shot to enter orbit.
in seven years ..
in seven years ..
Xbone Stormsurgezz
I blame dark matter.
prof brian cox did this year's huw wheldon memorial lecture on the importance of science in television broadcasting
it's a very good address, for the brits it's on bbc iplayer... for those not in the UK... i do urge you to find it. interesting.
it's a very good address, for the brits it's on bbc iplayer... for those not in the UK... i do urge you to find it. interesting.
libertarian benefit collector - anti-academic super-intellectual. http://mixlr.com/the-little-phrase/
I just wish it would be more in the news and such. The documentaries which people like cox and attenborough present are enjoyable by mostly ANYONE with even the slightest bit of interest in the world, yet it only reaches a rather small audience.
Then we have discovery channel which presents itself as one exploring nature and science, instead casting fucking car and bike building programs from 9;00 till 23;00.
Then we have discovery channel which presents itself as one exploring nature and science, instead casting fucking car and bike building programs from 9;00 till 23;00.
Last edited by dayarath (2010-12-08 08:28:27)
inane little opines
my biggest gripe with discovery/science is that none of their shows are steeped in fucking reality, at all
they're all just HIGH ACTION! ADRENALINE! YEAH! shows about shit like 'WAYS THE WORLD COULD END!'
'WHAT WOULD IT BE LIKE IF ALIENS INVADED'
'PANDEMIC: GLOBAL CATASTROPHE'
'DICING WITH DEATH: NATURE'S CLOSE MISSES'
and they always have the same crackpot selection of phoney-academics that are more like sci-fi/fantasy fucking writers... all bullshit
they're all just HIGH ACTION! ADRENALINE! YEAH! shows about shit like 'WAYS THE WORLD COULD END!'
'WHAT WOULD IT BE LIKE IF ALIENS INVADED'
'PANDEMIC: GLOBAL CATASTROPHE'
'DICING WITH DEATH: NATURE'S CLOSE MISSES'
and they always have the same crackpot selection of phoney-academics that are more like sci-fi/fantasy fucking writers... all bullshit
libertarian benefit collector - anti-academic super-intellectual. http://mixlr.com/the-little-phrase/
Didn't they make deadliest warrior aswell? Discovery is absolutely SHIT. I mean, I like bear grylls (entertainment value; the man is hilariously over the top) and some program of a guy trying to find out if myths about fish in certain areas are true and whatnot but that's where it ends.
There is barely anything scientific about what they cast - as you said, lots of pseudoscience and usually fear mongering.
National Geographic on the other hand is alot better at delivering quality programs, yet I still feel that the BBC science documentaries are often times, by far, the best. It's a shame I only have NGC (it's good and all but usually too dumbed down for my liking), would have to discuss with the guys in the house and the landlord if we'd pay for more. Doubt they'd want to though.
The latest gripe I have with a discovery program is because of monsters inside me..... anyone who watches it will develop a phobia for parasites.
There is barely anything scientific about what they cast - as you said, lots of pseudoscience and usually fear mongering.
National Geographic on the other hand is alot better at delivering quality programs, yet I still feel that the BBC science documentaries are often times, by far, the best. It's a shame I only have NGC (it's good and all but usually too dumbed down for my liking), would have to discuss with the guys in the house and the landlord if we'd pay for more. Doubt they'd want to though.
The latest gripe I have with a discovery program is because of monsters inside me..... anyone who watches it will develop a phobia for parasites.
Last edited by dayarath (2010-12-08 12:31:10)
inane little opines