BF2S Forums Government gets OK to track your every move with GPS

Uzique wrote:

my friend works on the IT maintenance team (standard office-type  IT job) at this place:

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Gua … am-006.jpg

and he had to sign all sorts of Her Majesty's privacy agreement... MI5/MI6 type stuff... family had to, as well.

and that's just for doing basic maintenance and troubleshooting with dumb staff that get non-responsive Word documents, etc....

SenorToenails wrote:

RDMC wrote:

And this is just one thing that I do not understand. How is your freedom compromised? You can still go anywhere you like, do anything you want except now it is stored somewhere on some hard drive.

Might just be me, but I simply do not see how my freedom is 'given away' because the government knows I went up and down Amsterdam today.

Must be some sort of age difference. Or maybe the mentality in the US is different then in the Netherlands, I don't know.

Ah, but there is a difference.  You elected to have that card so the government knows where you are going.  The benefit is...you don't have to use it, do you?  If the government secretly GPS's your car, that is different because you don't know about it and they didn't need a warrant to do so.  And people who accept this as protection from criminals are giving up their freedom.  That should be obvious.

And I'm railing against your chip-cards for transportation.  I use EZPass in NY here, which automates toll paying for me, so when I use it, I know my movements are being tracked.  If I don't want to use it, I can wait and pay tolls manually like lots of other people do.  It's a system I elect to be a part of, much like the chip-card (which you said has an anonymous variant), right?

RDMC wrote:

Might just be me, but I simply do not see how my freedom is 'given away' because the government knows I went up and down Amsterdam today.

Must be some sort of age difference. Or maybe the mentality in the US is different then in the Netherlands, I don't know.

RDMC wrote:

Well yes, but I have a personal chip card. However not entirely by choice. My use of public transit is free because I am a student. Therefore I got a personal public transport card on which during weekdays I can travel anywhere I like within the Netherlands without having to pay a single dime. Now I could decline this transport card, but that would mean I'd get the value of that card €80 euros per month but having to go up and down Amsterdam 20 times per month easily costs more than the €80 I'd get for not taking the personal chip card.

So in my case I do not really have a choice besides using a chip card that can be tracked, however I am not bothered by the fact that is being tracked.

Last edited by mafia996630 (2010-08-27 02:11:25)

Mitch wrote:

OxenBreeder wrote:

Iirc, this is my first D&ST reply, so please be gentle?



I believe as American's, we have a LOT to fear from our Gov't, no doubt about it.

But if you're that paranoid, take a peek under your car from time to time, if you "see" said GPS device, simply remove it. Toss it in the fucking lake/take a sledge hammer to it for all I care... it's not like it couldn't be removed from your car, damn!

All these fuckers are gonna catch me doing, is, my sorry ass going from home, to work. From work, to home....where's the thrill in that?

Has anyone ever stopped to think about how many people would have to be hired to analyze all this "data" that our Gov't supposedly collects on us?

500, or 5,000 people hired to "spy" on us?

Hell, lets say 5,000 are hired, just to read the text messages we Americans send daily. There's no way 5,000 people could handle the text data transmitted by teens alone, on a daily basis in America, let alone spy on where I'm going/where I've been..

Track my cell phone, track my car movements, track my online activities, the list can go on and on.. But it would take MANY millions of people just to analyze the "data" of the American people alone, on a daily basis.

"The only thing we have to fear, is fear itself!!"

Paranoia will destroy ya!

I recognize your ideas, however.

The fact that the government can now track you with GPS is just another step towards video cameras in your house and an RFID chip in your arm (or your "enhanced driver license")

Im a huge privacy advocate. Whether your doing something illegal or not, you shouldn't be monitored.

Sure, it sounds crazy, but there exists unspoken rules of fairness when it comes to commiting crimes and being caught. If there weren't, then why not just install a video camera in everyones house that pics up on keywords or actions and alerts someone to monitor you.

FFS, its not all that far fetched. They do it in the euroshit countries.

The game of cat and mouse between law enforcement and criminals is just that, its a game. Think of it like poker. You cant install a video camera on your opponents forehead and see his hand everytime.

I live a decently legal life, but ill be damned if someones going to track me "just incase i decide to do something illegal"

Do you understand what im saying?

jord wrote:

Mitch wrote:

OxenBreeder wrote:

Iirc, this is my first D&ST reply, so please be gentle?



I believe as American's, we have a LOT to fear from our Gov't, no doubt about it.

But if you're that paranoid, take a peek under your car from time to time, if you "see" said GPS device, simply remove it. Toss it in the fucking lake/take a sledge hammer to it for all I care... it's not like it couldn't be removed from your car, damn!

All these fuckers are gonna catch me doing, is, my sorry ass going from home, to work. From work, to home....where's the thrill in that?

Has anyone ever stopped to think about how many people would have to be hired to analyze all this "data" that our Gov't supposedly collects on us?

500, or 5,000 people hired to "spy" on us?

Hell, lets say 5,000 are hired, just to read the text messages we Americans send daily. There's no way 5,000 people could handle the text data transmitted by teens alone, on a daily basis in America, let alone spy on where I'm going/where I've been..

Track my cell phone, track my car movements, track my online activities, the list can go on and on.. But it would take MANY millions of people just to analyze the "data" of the American people alone, on a daily basis.

"The only thing we have to fear, is fear itself!!"

Paranoia will destroy ya!

I recognize your ideas, however.

The fact that the government can now track you with GPS is just another step towards video cameras in your house and an RFID chip in your arm (or your "enhanced driver license")

Im a huge privacy advocate. Whether your doing something illegal or not, you shouldn't be monitored.

Sure, it sounds crazy, but there exists unspoken rules of fairness when it comes to commiting crimes and being caught. If there weren't, then why not just install a video camera in everyones house that pics up on keywords or actions and alerts someone to monitor you.

FFS, its not all that far fetched. They do it in the euroshit countries.

The game of cat and mouse between law enforcement and criminals is just that, its a game. Think of it like poker. You cant install a video camera on your opponents forehead and see his hand everytime.

I live a decently legal life, but ill be damned if someones going to track me "just incase i decide to do something illegal"

Do you understand what im saying?

Other than the bone, misguided europe comment I agree.

Uzique wrote:

oug wrote:

1984

read it

oh jesus christ...

... before or after ive finished the Mr. Men series?

Uzique wrote:

FEOS wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

That's never been abused...  just ask FEOS... 

I don't believe I've ever said any such thing. That law, just like any other law, is prone to abuse. Because it is enacted by man and man is not perfect.

The key is in the enforcement of the mechanisms to counter such abuses, like those that already exist in Titles 18 and 50 of US Code for the PATRIOT Act. That is the part that we keep arguing about. You seem to think that the PATRIOT Act somehow throws those out the window...it does not.

there's a difference between some laws being misinterpreted and abused by the imperfections of man/human legal instrumentation

AND

purposefully designing a law with the aim of reducing liberties, freedoms and basic rights.

the neocons drafted up the patriot act hastily during a time of national emergency in order to effect the latter, not the former...