BF2S Forums Katrina 2010

nlsme1 wrote:

lowing wrote:

nlsme1 wrote:

First, the arguement could be made that healthcare is "everyones" problem just as easily, yet you don't want govt. there.

Second, a lot more then the government.

Third, what arsenol do we have for this?

Fourth, (and here is the kicker) do you know how easy it would be, for BP to then say."you took over. You took longer then we would have, and we are no longer responsible for the cost associated with it. You let 30 million gallons spill AFTER you tok over"

30,000,000 gallons * $1,000 gallons=30,000,000,000

Do you really want to let BP off the hook from those kinds of fines?

No your health is YOUR problem, and my health is MY problem, I do not share in your problems.

Really? When did BP dump oil in the gulf and pollute the coast line before?

The US govt. has unlimited resources in manpower, what is needed the US govt. can get. BP is not an authority, the US govt. is.

BP, and here is the kicker, has already lost in the court the counts, the court of public opinion. They will pay for this, even at the expense of its own existence.

1 Well, then no the oil spill is not everyones problem. It is the problem of those directly effected by it.

2 When did the government?

3 Everything has "limits"

And the kicker "Like exxon payed?"

nlsme1 wrote:

No, you live on YOUR land, and I live on MINE. There is absolutly no way oil will contaminate MY land.

Pretty sure "authority" has been granted to BP to stop the leak, and to clean it up. And what resources do you keep speaking of? Other then "limited" manpower?

"Litigation was filed on behalf of 38,000 litigants. In 1994, a jury awarded plaintiffs US$287 million in compensatory damages and US$5 billion in punitive damages. Exxon appealed and the Ninth Circuit court reduced the punitive damages to US$2.5 billion. Exxon then appealed the punitive damages to the Supreme Court which capped the damages to US$507.5 million in June, 2008. On August 27, 2008, Exxon Mobil agreed to pay 75% of the US$507.5 million damages ruling to settle the 1989 Exxon Valdez oil spill off Alaska.[11] In June 2009, a federal ruling ordered Exxon to pay an additional US$480 million in interest on their delayed punitive damage awards.[12]   
"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exxon_valdez

According to the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, there are approximately 98 m³ (26,000 gallons) of Valdez crude oil still in Alaska's sand and soil.[13]

They paid a measely 20%. A majority of wich was "interest".

Spark wrote:

the US govt. has already had it.

Do they? I'm sincerely interested.

nlsme1 wrote:

lowing wrote:

nlsme1 wrote:

No, you live on YOUR land, and I live on MINE. There is absolutly no way oil will contaminate MY land.

Pretty sure "authority" has been granted to BP to stop the leak, and to clean it up. And what resources do you keep speaking of? Other then "limited" manpower?

"Litigation was filed on behalf of 38,000 litigants. In 1994, a jury awarded plaintiffs US$287 million in compensatory damages and US$5 billion in punitive damages. Exxon appealed and the Ninth Circuit court reduced the punitive damages to US$2.5 billion. Exxon then appealed the punitive damages to the Supreme Court which capped the damages to US$507.5 million in June, 2008. On August 27, 2008, Exxon Mobil agreed to pay 75% of the US$507.5 million damages ruling to settle the 1989 Exxon Valdez oil spill off Alaska.[11] In June 2009, a federal ruling ordered Exxon to pay an additional US$480 million in interest on their delayed punitive damage awards.[12]   
"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exxon_valdez

According to the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, there are approximately 98 m³ (26,000 gallons) of Valdez crude oil still in Alaska's sand and soil.[13]

They paid a measely 20%. A majority of wich was "interest".

We live on OUR planet, who knows the lasting affects of this spill if itis not stopped

Who knows, whatever is needed. disposal equipment, chemicals, whatever, I am not an expert, but I do know that whatever technology BP has, the US govt. has already had it.

Ok well again this is not 1988, this is 2010, a different attitude prevails regarding the environment and all of the "green" fuckers running around.

1 We all are a part of the same health care system. My doctors are your doctors. My nurses are your nurses. My cancers are your cancers. If you want to be obtuse. The decisions YOU make regarding YOUR healthcare effects ME. Who knows what diseases might be get out of control if it is not stopped.

2 Name ONE oil rig the government has ever owned. Let alone a deep sea rig.

3 "Supreme Court which capped the damages to US$507.5 million in June, 2008. On August 27, 2008"!

nlsme1 wrote:

So cancer does not have a global impact? Aids? Flu? Anything. You better beleive that if I have something, MANY others do too. Maybe you will continue to get lucky with the things that don't effect you.
So the "resources" are what exactly then? How many chemical plants does the government "own" that produces dispersants? How many textile plants do they own to turn out boom? How many submersables they got equiped for the job? Name ONE resource the government has.

nlsme1 wrote:

lowing wrote:

nlsme1 wrote:

So cancer does not have a global impact? Aids? Flu? Anything. You better beleive that if I have something, MANY others do too. Maybe you will continue to get lucky with the things that don't effect you.
So the "resources" are what exactly then? How many chemical plants does the government "own" that produces dispersants? How many textile plants do they own to turn out boom? How many submersables they got equiped for the job? Name ONE resource the government has.

Already told you, the govt, has their hand in the  development of most if not all the current technologies. It has the man power, authority, and money to pay to get whatever needs to be gotten online an operational to get this done.

and no sorry, until I get cancer, your cancer does nothing to me. It is a stupid analogy so let it go already. My health is personal and so is yours the environment is global.

The govt. does not need to own anything, it can athorize, direct and pay to get this done. We will assign blame and damages later.

Deep water drilling is realtivly new. It is also a global phenomenan. With hundreds of corporations, some, that have never operated in the US. The oil giants are the ones who led the way in oil exploration. They did it for money. The longer the spill goes on, the more money it will cost them. You really think the US gov is holding on to some magical answer? You really don't think that the best minds in our country are on this. The best minds the world over are on this.

As far as the cancer, it is a perfect analogy. Follow me here.

This oil spill will not effect me. It might you, but not me. Why, because I don't like seafood. I use very little oil, and the increased costs from a rise in oil prices would be offest by my investments in alternative energies. It is your problem not mine.

Now, I care about the well being of ALL of my countrymen (incuding New Orleans). I care for their access to healthcare, just as much as I care about the toxicity of their waters. I would be all for the US government stepping in and taking over, if they actually did have anything more to offer.

nlsme1 wrote:

I didn't expect the gov't to divert "Katrina". They were in charge of the levies,Failure. How many fema trailers(resources) sat, and most likely still sit empty? Failure. Making sure there was ample knowledge of hurricanes. Pass, they actually led the way in hurricane research(unlike oil). There were failures in all levels of government regarding Katrina. There were also failures of citizens. The ones that sat, and watched the hurricanes move in. Knowing their city was ill prepared.

Now you keep talking about photo opps, so I feel it is safe to assume you are talking about Obama? What do YOU propose HE do? Again, I would be all for the government taking over, but they lack anything MORE to offer.

The flu effects the whole planet. It can go up from there.

nlsme1 wrote:

In my analogy

Oil= health issues (cancer, flu,...)
Oil spill response=Healthcare(hospitals, doctors,...)
Your not asking the government to put down more oil are you?

Like I said, I would be all for the government taking over, if they actually had more to offer. I can't see the fact that there was a photo opp grounds for them having more to offer. Got a link where any other company came up with an idea?

What, you want 100,000 ships working on this? You do realize the leaking pipe is a whopping 21". BP probably has done a cost/benefit analasis. It most likely said the less oil spilled the better. At any cost. The official numbers have the conservative rate at over a million gallons a day. $1,000 dollar fine per gallon(not including clean up cost, or civil awards). 1 BILLION dollars a day in fines, on the low end. As of June 1, they have spent $990 million on containment and cleanup efforts. Almost one days fines(on the low end).