Employer/employee contracts

2010-04-21 16:09:26

#1

Jay: Bork! Bork! Bork!; +2,006|5648|London, England

As some of the Americans on this forum may know, Ben Roethlisberger, Quarterback for the Pittsburgh Steelers has been accused of rape for the second time. He has been suspended by the National Football League for the first 4-6 weeks of the season without pay.

I got into a rather heated argument about this today on another forum and was wondering what the reaction would be here. He has been suspended for violating the NFL's Code of Conduct without a trial by jury.

~ Law Enforcement representatives will conduct briefings each year for all coaches, club personnel and players. The content of these briefings will include drinking and driving laws and enforcement, possession of firearms, domestic abuse, assault and battery, gang related activities and other matters of significance.

~ Every team must implement programs to ensure club compliance with drinking and driving laws.

~ Expansion of counseling and treatment programs are mandatory for all club employees, players and coaches who violate the policy.

~ Patterns of discipline in the NFL's rocky past were hindered by ties to the Constitutional convention of "innocent until proven guilty". Changes to the disciplinary aspects of the code of personal conduct allow for disciplinary action to be taken at the time of arrest, rather than waiting for a guilty plea or verdict.

This is part of the Code of Conduct which every player must sign on to in order to play in the NFL. It does away completely with the concept enshrined in the US Constitution of 'innocent until proven guilty' and puts any player at the mercy of the Commissioner and the Court of Public Opinion.

My question is this: Should an employer based in the United States of America be allowed to trump the Constitution and Constitutional rights? As far as I am concerned I am an American first and an employee second. I think employers have been allowed to run roughshod over individual liberties for far too long. (Yes, this is an offshoot of the pedo thread).

"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat

2010-04-21 16:16:46

#2

lowing: Banned; +1,662|6942|USA

Well, since you do not have a RIGHT to a job, and the employer has a vested interest in your performance, appearance, reputation and voting record. The employer is and should be allowed to hire and fire as he/she sees fit.

Why do you think you have a constitutional right to your job with any employer?

2010-04-21 16:19:12

#3

Ilocano: buuuurrrrrrppppp.......; +341|6957

Barring discrimination, Cali is At Will, so. Just like a private club, play by our rules, or you're out. They aren't being forced to play in the NFL.

Analogy: This is my son's birthday party. I'm paying you to entertain his guests. You come here drunk and embarrass me, you're fired. Simple as that.

Last edited by Ilocano (2010-04-21 16:24:44)

2010-04-21 16:23:05

#4

mikkel: Member; +383|6892

I don't see why the NFL should be prevented from conducting business in the manner in which they see fit. If you disagree with how they do business, then don't sign the contract.

It's just another wonderful consequence of franchising professional sports.

Last edited by mikkel (2010-04-21 16:24:22)

2010-04-21 16:24:43

#5

lowing: Banned; +1,662|6942|USA

I agree with both of those comments...He gets paid pretty damn well to play ball, fame has consequences.

2010-04-21 16:31:31

#6

SEREMAKER: BABYMAKIN EXPERT √; +2,187|6859|Mountains of NC

its a priviledge to play for the NFL .........if you can't follow the rules then sit on the sidelines count how much money you're losing

https://static.bf2s.com/files/user/17445/carhartt.jpg

2010-04-21 17:00:17

#7

FatherTed: xD; +3,936|6790|so randum

lowing wrote:
I agree with both of those comments...He gets paid pretty damn well to play ball, fame has consequences.

QFT.

(feel ill)

Small hourglass island
Always raining and foggy
Use an umbrella

2010-04-21 17:01:19

#8

eleven bravo: Member; +1,399|5549|foggy bottom

let him play for the argonaughts

Tu Stultus Es

2010-04-21 17:10:30

#9

lowing: Banned; +1,662|6942|USA

FatherTed wrote:
lowing wrote:
I agree with both of those comments...He gets paid pretty damn well to play ball, fame has consequences.
QFT.

(feel ill)

try taking a shower and scrubbing.

2010-04-21 17:15:25

#10

Turquoise: O Canada; +1,596|6695|North Carolina

I'll put it this way... When it comes to corporations running over civil liberties, this is actually pretty tame.

"Dead peasant" insurance policies disturb me a lot more.

2010-04-22 02:07:56

#11

Flecco: iPod is broken.; +1,048|6955|NT, like Mick Dundee

Turquoise wrote:
I'll put it this way... When it comes to corporations running over civil liberties, this is actually pretty tame.

"Dead peasant" insurance policies disturb me a lot more.

GTFO, the dead peasant thing is LEGIT, LEGIT I SAY!

Seriously though, as somebody who is employed by a small business owner, and as the son of a man who ran a few different businesses in his life...

The employer is paying YOU for YOUR time, not just that, but if you put your job in jeopardy or ruin your employer's reputation, you bet your ass you're gonna get fired. If I get accused of raping somebody and the company's name ends up all over the front pages, chances are I'd get the sack as it would adversly affect business. Having your company remembered by investors as one that employed a rapist is not a great thing. My boss hands over his hard earned cash to purchase not just the fucking time between clocking on and clocking off, but my avaliability to work each and every day possible according to the terms of my contract and they purchase the ability to make excess demands of me. In my case, basically as an apprentice, like every other apprentice in the country I have no rights anyway.

I might bitch in EE about being asked to stay late, manage things far beyond my capabilities and in general do stuff I am not qualified for, but fuck me, that's why I get paid more than basically every other 1st year apprentice in the NT. My supervisor trusts me to handle shit. They purchase the right to make extra demands of me each and every time they send the orders to the bank to pay me. That's why I'm the only dude there at 6:30pm on a Friday night.

The day they ask me to do more than I feel they are paying me for, the day I really feel they are asking too much, I'll tell them to get fucked and I'll go get another job. Until then, tis work, 7am to 5:30/6:30/9:00pm every day barring the odd weekend off.

Whoa... Can't believe these forums are still kicking.

2010-04-22 02:30:33

#12

Catbox: forgiveness; +505|7006

Ben Roethlisberger has a serious problem with abusing women...
dating back to his college days... He should be happy he is still able to play in the NFL...
For his sake i hope he straightens up... but more than likely he will f@ck up again and then he will be through.

Love is the answer

2010-04-22 02:35:12

#13

11 Bravo: Banned; +965|5527|Cleveland, Ohio

nope. nobody is forced to work anywhere. and he signed that contract so........ QQ

2010-04-22 02:47:38

#14

Spark: liquid fluoride thorium reactor; +874|6965|Canberra, AUS

He would have a point... if there was such a thing as a constitutional right to a job.

But there isn't.

So he doesn't.

The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
^{~ Richard Feynman}

2010-04-22 03:18:18

#15

Cybargs: Moderated; +2,285|7007

Spark wrote:
He would have a point... if there was such a thing as a constitutional right to a job.

But there isn't.

So he doesn't.

Looking at the history of "equal" rights, you could bet your ass sooner or later even pedos can work at kindergartens.

https://cache.www.gametracker.com/server_info/203.46.105.23:21300/b_350_20_692108_381007_FFFFFF_000000.png

2010-04-22 03:19:38

#16

11 Bravo: Banned; +965|5527|Cleveland, Ohio

Spark wrote:
He would have a point... if there was such a thing as a constitutional right to a job.

But there isn't.

So he doesn't.

nothing in the 'tution aboot healthcare either......

2010-04-22 03:46:28

#17

Spark: liquid fluoride thorium reactor; +874|6965|Canberra, AUS

11 Bravo wrote:
Spark wrote:
He would have a point... if there was such a thing as a constitutional right to a job.

But there isn't.

So he doesn't.
nothing in the 'tution aboot healthcare either......

The difference is one rapist out of a job doesn't make any difference to the quality of life in a country.
A dysfunctional healthcare system, though...

The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
^{~ Richard Feynman}

2010-04-22 04:12:33

#18

Dilbert_X: The X stands for; +1,817|6396|eXtreme to the maX

Employers can do whatever they like, don't like it don't work there.
Is playing football even 'work'?

Fuck Israel

BF2S Forums Employer/employee contracts

lowing wrote:

FatherTed wrote:

lowing wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

Spark wrote:

Spark wrote:

11 Bravo wrote:

Spark wrote:

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