cl4u53w1t2
Salon-Bolschewist
+269|6759|Kakanien
A US congressional panel has described the killing of Armenians by Turkish forces during World War I as genocide, despite White House objections.

The resolution was narrowly approved by the House Foreign Affairs Committee.

Turkey, a key US ally, responded by recalling its ambassador in Washington for consultations. It has fiercely opposed the non-binding resolution.

The resolution calls on President Barack Obama to ensure that US foreign policy reflects an understanding of the "genocide" and to label the World War I killings as such in his annual statement on the issue.

Within minutes the Turkish government issued a statement condemning "this resolution which accuses the Turkish nation of a crime it has not committed".

A Turkish parliamentary delegation had gone to Washington to try to persuade committee members to reject the resolution.

Turkey accepts that atrocities were committed but argues they were part of the war and that there was no systematic attempt to destroy the Christian Armenian people.

The Armenian government welcomed the vote, calling it "an important step towards the prevention of crimes against humanity".

In 2007, a similar resolution passed the committee stage, but was shelved before a House vote after pressure from the George W Bush administration.

Armenia wants Turkey to recognise the killings as an act of genocide, but successive Turkish governments have refused to do so.

Hundreds of thousands of Armenians died in 1915, when they were deported en masse from eastern Anatolia by the Ottoman Empire. They were killed by troops or died from starvation and disease.

Armenians have campaigned for the killings to be recognised internationally as genocide - and more than 20 countries have done so.


http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/8550765.stm
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6691|North Carolina
Fuck yeah, about time...

Between Obama's neutrality on this and his neutrality on the Falklands, this is just getting pathetic.

People call Obama a leftist, but he's really just becoming a pushover.

Turkey can go fuck itself anyway, since they didn't help us with Iraq, and they actually made matters worse with their own issues involving the Kurds.
Commie Killer
Member
+192|6673

Turquoise wrote:

Fuck yeah, about time...

Between Obama's neutrality on this and his neutrality on the Falklands, this is just getting pathetic.

People call Obama a leftist, but he's really just becoming a pushover.

Turkey can go fuck itself anyway, since they didn't help us with Iraq, and they actually made matters worse with their own issues involving the Kurds.
Damned if he does, damned if he doesn't...

At the moment, we really need Turkey, so it might not of been the greatest idea, even if the Turks deserved it.
ruisleipa
Member
+149|6508|teh FIN-land

Turquoise wrote:

Fuck yeah, about time...

Turkey can go fuck itself anyway, since they didn't help us with Iraq, and they actually made matters worse with their own issues involving the Kurds.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Cybargs
Moderated
+2,285|7002
It's a non-binding reso. Jesus christ.

Turkey can piss off.
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unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,056|7057|PNW

Maybe a Turkish panel should accuse the US of genocidal activity during our expansionist phase.
DrunkFace
Germans did 911
+427|6967|Disaster Free Zone
1915
Fuck off no one cares.

Why do modern day Turks deserve to be punished for the wrong doings of their grandparents and great grand parents.
ruisleipa
Member
+149|6508|teh FIN-land

DrunkFace wrote:

1915
Fuck off no one cares.

Why do modern day Turks deserve to be punished for the wrong doings of their grandparents and great grand parents.
Of course people care, that's such a stupid response . just cos YOU don't care.

Who is being 'punished' by facing up to the truth?
cl4u53w1t2
Salon-Bolschewist
+269|6759|Kakanien

DrunkFace wrote:

1915
Fuck off no one cares.

Why do modern day Turks deserve to be punished for the wrong doings of their grandparents and great grand parents.
same goes for shoah??
Cybargs
Moderated
+2,285|7002

DrunkFace wrote:

1915
Fuck off no one cares.

Why do modern day Turks deserve to be punished for the wrong doings of their grandparents and great grand parents.
Why won't they just give out at least a fucking apology letter? It's not criticizing Turkish people but the Turkish government. It's not very fun when the Japanese completely omit the whole genocide part from their textbook now is it?
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ATG
Banned
+5,233|6815|Global Command

DrunkFace wrote:

1915
Fuck off no one cares.

Why do modern day Turks deserve to be punished for the wrong doings of their grandparents and great grand parents.
Much of the wealth of Spain and France came from their genocidal efforts in south america.  When peoples get rounded up and executed their bank accounts and property do not killed with them.

Admitting a genocide opens a country up for reparations. The decendants of the survivors have been stripped of their ancestral lands and wealth and they rightly have a legit claim to ask, where's my money?
Random_Guy
Member
+5|5708

DrunkFace wrote:

1915
Fuck off no one cares.

Why do modern day Turks deserve to be punished for the wrong doings of their grandparents and great grand parents.
1.5 million people died in the desert at the hands of the Turks and the survivors were forced to eat the carcasses of horses, dogs, lizards and whatever to stay alive. Now, what sort of mental scars would that leave in the minds of the children who watched their parents fight over a scrap of horse meat? Also if you can pass off the murder of 1.5 million people and say "Oh yeah it was over 90 years ago. Who cares anymore?" then you deserve to starve in a desert with only horse meat to eat. Also the blatant denial of the genocide by the Turks and people like you piss me off.
How would you feel if I barged into your house on a quiet morning and shot your father, ripped your unborn brother from your mother's womb and impaled it on a stake, raped your sister and forced you to walk in a desert in the middle of summer?

There are shitloads more people like you who say the genocide was helpful or an opportunity to the Armenians. I forgot his name but one TURKISH historian said "Us turks were only trying to help the Armenians by showing them new lands which they can live in and new people to become friends with"

Utter bullshit.
ruisleipa
Member
+149|6508|teh FIN-land

Random_Guy wrote:

1.5 million people died in the desert at the hands of the Turks and the survivors were forced to eat the carcasses of horses, dogs, lizards and whatever to stay alive. Now, what sort of mental scars would that leave in the minds of the children who watched their parents fight over a scrap of horse meat? Also if you can pass off the murder of 1.5 million people and say "Oh yeah it was over 90 years ago. Who cares anymore?" then you deserve to starve in a desert with only horse meat to eat. Also the blatant denial of the genocide by the Turks and people like you piss me off.
How would you feel if I barged into your house on a quiet morning and shot your father, ripped your unborn brother from your mother's womb and impaled it on a stake, raped your sister and forced you to walk in a desert in the middle of summer?

There are shitloads more people like you who say the genocide was helpful or an opportunity to the Armenians. I forgot his name but one TURKISH historian said "Us turks were only trying to help the Armenians by showing them new lands which they can live in and new people to become friends with"

Utter bullshit.
well said.

ATG wrote:

Admitting a genocide opens a country up for reparations. The decendants of the survivors have been stripped of their ancestral lands and wealth and they rightly have a legit claim to ask, where's my money?
why do you assume everyone is only interested in money? For some people just the fact that a country has admitted guilt in massive wrongdoings in the past might be enough you know. Just cos you might be fixated with ca$h doesn't mean everyone is.
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6691|North Carolina

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

Maybe a Turkish panel should accuse the US of genocidal activity during our expansionist phase.
They could...  and they'd be correct if they were pointing at what we've done to some Native Americans or to the Philippines when we conquered them.
Cybargs
Moderated
+2,285|7002

Turquoise wrote:

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

Maybe a Turkish panel should accuse the US of genocidal activity during our expansionist phase.
They could...  and they'd be correct if they were pointing at what we've done to some Native Americans or to the Philippines when we conquered them.
I still see many Phillipinos lel. Native Americans? Yes I can see that. Phillipenes? Not really.
https://cache.www.gametracker.com/server_info/203.46.105.23:21300/b_350_20_692108_381007_FFFFFF_000000.png
ruisleipa
Member
+149|6508|teh FIN-land

Cybargs wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

Maybe a Turkish panel should accuse the US of genocidal activity during our expansionist phase.
They could...  and they'd be correct if they were pointing at what we've done to some Native Americans or to the Philippines when we conquered them.
I still see many Phillipinos lel. Native Americans? Yes I can see that. Phillipenes? Not really.
Genocide very rarely (never?) destroys a complete people. There are still jews, still Fillipinos, still Native Americans, still Tutsis and Hutu in Rwanda, still Albanians. Just some genocides are more 'successful' than others - the Native Americna genocide is probably one of the most successful anywhere I'd imagine.
Cybargs
Moderated
+2,285|7002

ruisleipa wrote:

Cybargs wrote:

Turquoise wrote:


They could...  and they'd be correct if they were pointing at what we've done to some Native Americans or to the Philippines when we conquered them.
I still see many Phillipinos lel. Native Americans? Yes I can see that. Phillipenes? Not really.
Genocide very rarely (never?) destroys a complete people. There are still jews, still Fillipinos, still Native Americans, still Tutsis and Hutu in Rwanda, still Albanians. Just some genocides are more 'successful' than others - the Native Americna genocide is probably one of the most successful anywhere I'd imagine.
US in phillipenes was more conquering than ethnic cleansing. But the Native American thing... Yeah they completely wiped out most of the tribes.
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Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6691|North Carolina

Cybargs wrote:

ruisleipa wrote:

Cybargs wrote:


I still see many Phillipinos lel. Native Americans? Yes I can see that. Phillipenes? Not really.
Genocide very rarely (never?) destroys a complete people. There are still jews, still Fillipinos, still Native Americans, still Tutsis and Hutu in Rwanda, still Albanians. Just some genocides are more 'successful' than others - the Native Americna genocide is probably one of the most successful anywhere I'd imagine.
US in phillipenes was more conquering than ethnic cleansing. But the Native American thing... Yeah they completely wiped out most of the tribes.
Well, admittedly, genocide can have a broad definition.  I don't think that genocide should be limited to being defined as ethnic cleansing, but yeah, most genocides are specifically with the aim of killing people because of their ethnicity.

In the Philippines, we weren't killing people because of their race or culture, but we did seem to kill them without much concern about the body count.  I just think, overall, that period of American history was shameful -- just like what we did to some Native Americans.

I'm just surprised that countries like Turkey and Japan can't own up to their own shameful periods.  If we can, why can't they?
cl4u53w1t2
Salon-Bolschewist
+269|6759|Kakanien

Turquoise wrote:

Cybargs wrote:

ruisleipa wrote:


Genocide very rarely (never?) destroys a complete people. There are still jews, still Fillipinos, still Native Americans, still Tutsis and Hutu in Rwanda, still Albanians. Just some genocides are more 'successful' than others - the Native Americna genocide is probably one of the most successful anywhere I'd imagine.
US in phillipenes was more conquering than ethnic cleansing. But the Native American thing... Yeah they completely wiped out most of the tribes.
Well, admittedly, genocide can have a broad definition.  I don't think that genocide should be limited to being defined as ethnic cleansing, but yeah, most genocides are specifically with the aim of killing people because of their ethnicity.

In the Philippines, we weren't killing people because of their race or culture, but we did seem to kill them without much concern about the body count.  I just think, overall, that period of American history was shameful -- just like what we did to some Native Americans.

I'm just surprised that countries like Turkey and Japan can't own up to their own shameful periods.  If we can, why can't they?
i don't think that ethnic cleansing should be called genocide since it can "merely" mean the forcible removal of populations...
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6691|North Carolina
good point....
blademaster
I'm moving to Brazil
+2,075|6931
yeah I agree about time, also I want some health benefits and other shit black people receive since my ancestors were enslaved by Turks!!!!  since blacks can get it other groups should be able to abide or get the same treatment or privileges....
ruisleipa
Member
+149|6508|teh FIN-land

Turquoise wrote:

I'm just surprised that countries like Turkey and Japan can't own up to their own shameful periods.  If we can, why can't they?
This is exactly the point right here. No-one's even mentioned reparations, but a nation that can't face up to its past like Germany or the USA (at least to some extent) won't be able to move forward fully, imo.

blademaster wrote:

yeah I agree about time, also I want some health benefits and other shit black people receive since my ancestors were enslaved by Turks!!!!  since blacks can get it other groups should be able to abide or get the same treatment or privileges....
wut?
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6697|'Murka

ruisleipa wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

I'm just surprised that countries like Turkey and Japan can't own up to their own shameful periods.  If we can, why can't they?
This is exactly the point right here. No-one's even mentioned reparations, but a nation that can't face up to its past like Germany or the USA (at least to some extent) won't be able to move forward fully, imo.
Excuse me? Care to explain the parenthetical?
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein

Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
ruisleipa
Member
+149|6508|teh FIN-land

FEOS wrote:

ruisleipa wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

I'm just surprised that countries like Turkey and Japan can't own up to their own shameful periods.  If we can, why can't they?
This is exactly the point right here. No-one's even mentioned reparations, but a nation that can't face up to its past like Germany or the USA (at least to some extent) won't be able to move forward fully, imo.
Excuse me? Care to explain the parenthetical?
OK (no need to be so defensive). I mean the USA has to some extent faced up to past atrocities. More so than other countries even, the UK included I reckon.

What's the problem?
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6937|USA

ruisleipa wrote:

FEOS wrote:

ruisleipa wrote:


This is exactly the point right here. No-one's even mentioned reparations, but a nation that can't face up to its past like Germany or the USA (at least to some extent) won't be able to move forward fully, imo.
Excuse me? Care to explain the parenthetical?
OK (no need to be so defensive). I mean the USA has to some extent faced up to past atrocities. More so than other countries even, the UK included I reckon.

What's the problem?
you are correct.

The US has done some terrible things. Look up the expansionism era of the turn of the century in the South Pacific as an example of our behavior toward others if the treatment of the native Americans were not proof enough.

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