Two German Killers Demanding Anonymity Sue Wikipedia’s Parent

2009-11-13 04:53:59

#1

Macbeth: Banned; +2,444|5872

Wolfgang Werlé and Manfred Lauber became infamous for killing a German actor in 1990. Now they are suing to force Wikipedia to forget them.

The legal fight pits German privacy law against the American First Amendment. German courts allow the suppression of a criminal’s name in news accounts once he has paid his debt to society, noted Alexander H. Stopp, the lawyer for the two men, who are now out of prison.

“They should be able to go on and be resocialized, and lead a life without being publicly stigmatized” for their crime, Mr. Stopp said. “A criminal has a right to privacy, too, and a right to be left alone.”

Mr. Stopp has already successfully pressured German publications to remove the killers’ names from their online coverage. German editors of Wikipedia have scrubbed the names from the German-language version of the article about the victim, Walter Sedlmayr.

Now Mr. Stopp, in suits in German courts, is demanding that the Wikimedia Foundation, the American organization that runs Wikipedia, do the same with the English-language version of the article. That has free-speech advocates quoting George Orwell.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/13/us/13 … mp;emc=rss

Silly German law right? I mean shouldn't you be paying for the death of a person for the rest of your life? Don't people have a right to know if they're living next door to a sociopath?

2009-11-13 09:16:03

#2

Agent_Dung_Bomb: Member; +302|7023|Salt Lake City

While that may be German law, he has no right to scrub anything from material hosted here in the US.

2009-11-13 09:20:30

#3

S.Lythberg: Mastermind; +429|6733|Chicago, IL

Wolfgang Werlé and Manfred Lauber

too late, they are forever enshrined on the internet as whiny German murderers.

Also, it's perfectly legal to host any and all information providing that it's true

2009-11-13 09:29:09

#4

13urnzz: Banned; +5,830|6784

S.Lythberg wrote:
Also, it's perfectly legal to host any and all information providing that it's true

well, there goes ¾ of the posts from here.

2009-11-13 09:41:34

#5

Jay: Bork! Bork! Bork!; +2,006|5645|London, England

What I don't get is why people feel that criminals should pay for their crimes for the rest of their lives. I'm of the opinion that once a prison sentence has been carried out that the crimes should be forgiven and forgotten. Forcing criminals to put their past crimes on job applications etc and then denying them jobs based on their past just leads to recidivism.

Now, coupled with this, you need a justice system that actually makes sense with sentences that actually fit the crime. If someone gets out of jail after five years for a murder conviction it completely destroys my original argument. It is just this disparity within sentencing that allows companies to get away with their discrimination.

My $0.02 anyway. I have an uncle that was locked up for armed robbery because he was a crackhead at the time. Now he can't find any work because he has to put that on every job application even though he served his time. Is he likely to mess up again? Possibly, but you can't punish someone for something they haven't done.

"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat

2009-11-13 10:01:12

#6

-Sh1fty-: plundering yee booty; +510|5760|Ventura, California

This is going to attract more attention to them than if they had just left Wiki alone.

And above your tomb, the stars will belong to us.

2009-11-13 10:04:31

#7

Wreckognize: Member; +294|6772

lol Streisand effect

2009-11-13 16:27:34

#8

rdx-fx: ...; +955|6878

Sure.

As soon as their murder victim stops being dead, the murderers can have their chance at having their actions forgiven and forgotten.

2009-11-13 16:37:28

#9

Jay: Bork! Bork! Bork!; +2,006|5645|London, England

rdx-fx wrote:
Sure.

As soon as their murder victim stops being dead, the murderers can have their chance at having their actions forgiven and forgotten.

That's why the punishment needs to fit the crime.

"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat

2009-11-13 16:47:09

#10

ATG: Banned; +5,233|6816|Global Command

Tools. You cease to have rights when you get convicted of murder.

Sadly though, the ObaMao admin has probably already apologized for this.

2009-11-13 16:48:03

#11

Red Forman: Banned; +402|5687

ATG wrote:
Tools. You cease to have rights when you get convicted of murder.

this

2009-11-13 17:55:15

#12

BVC: Member; +325|6982

The problem with scrubbing it from the German-language version of the article is that they're effectively censoring content for any language in which German is an official language - that includes Austria, Switzerland, and probably a few others.

edit: Wiki says official language in six others, recognised minority language in many more, and an official EU language - so in theory they're exercising partial censorship of the entire EU.

Last edited by Pubic (2009-11-13 17:57:45)

2009-11-13 19:01:05

#13

ghettoperson: Member; +1,943|6936

I take it the German language Wiki servers are located in Germany then? I can't see them getting away with it outside Germany.

2009-11-13 19:57:18

#14

Macbeth: Banned; +2,444|5872

Wikipeida is very against censorship and will probably refuse to remove anything even if court ordered, it wouldn't surprise me if Germany loses their wiki because the killers have it blocked.

2009-11-13 20:17:55

#15

AussieReaper: ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°); +5,761|6440|what

You cant really police the internet unless the international law is the same.

*or you're China and just police whatever comes into the country also.

2009-11-13 20:30:10

#16

Macbeth: Banned; +2,444|5872

Force ISPs in Germany to block wikipeida, doesn't seem that hard.

2009-11-13 22:01:06

#17

Catbox: forgiveness; +505|7003

Having the murder label makes it really hard to meet new chicks...lol

Love is the answer

2009-11-14 21:51:07

#18

Roger Lesboules: Ah ben tabarnak!; +316|6864|Abitibi-Temiscamingue. Québec!

Red Forman wrote:
ATG wrote:
Tools. You cease to have rights when you get convicted of murder.
this

This x2

2009-11-15 02:32:25

#19

Bertster7: Confused Pothead; +1,101|6868|SE London

S.Lythberg wrote:
Wolfgang Werlé and Manfred Lauber
too late, they are forever enshrined on the internet as whiny German murderers.

Also, it's perfectly legal to host any and all information providing that it's true

No it isn't.

Think about it. Is it legal to publish classified information on the internet? Is it legal to publish copyrighted material on the internet? Is it legal to publish material about making bombs on the internet? Is it legal to publish kiddie porn on the internet?

Of course not.

These German murderers can fuck right off with their stupid case, but just pointing out it is most certainly not legal to publish anything on the internet just because it's true.

2009-11-15 08:22:37

#20

Macbeth: Banned; +2,444|5872

Bertster7 wrote:
Is it legal to publish material about making bombs on the internet?

Actually yes it is.

2009-11-15 09:07:26

#21

S.Lythberg: Mastermind; +429|6733|Chicago, IL

Bertster7 wrote:
S.Lythberg wrote:
Wolfgang Werlé and Manfred Lauber
too late, they are forever enshrined on the internet as whiny German murderers.

Also, it's perfectly legal to host any and all information providing that it's true
No it isn't.

Think about it. Is it legal to publish classified information on the internet? Is it legal to publish copyrighted material on the internet? Is it legal to publish material about making bombs on the internet? Is it legal to publish kiddie porn on the internet?

Of course not.

These German murderers can fuck right off with their stupid case, but just pointing out it is most certainly not legal to publish anything on the internet just because it's true.

Read up on American publishing laws. The methods of making thermonuclear bombs is essentially public domain, I can explain it if you want. you can publish any copyrighted material if you can prove you're not making a profit from it (most video and image hosting sites rely on this clause).

Classified information can be published by any media outlet that gets its hands on it, because it isn't classified anymore, is it? (most major news outlets have an agreement with the government to honor requests to not publish certain things)

As long as it isn't intentionally, untruthfully, and maliciously damaging your reputation (Libel), I can publish it.

BF2S Forums Two German Killers Demanding Anonymity Sue Wikipedia’s Parent

S.Lythberg wrote:

rdx-fx wrote:

ATG wrote:

Red Forman wrote:

ATG wrote:

S.Lythberg wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:

S.Lythberg wrote:

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