Completely random?
or
Precisely ordered?
I won't weigh in with any opinion, yet.
or
Precisely ordered?
I won't weigh in with any opinion, yet.
Nature is a powerful force. Those who seek to subdue nature, never do so permanently.
All science is founded on the assumption that the physical world is ordered.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
if by precisely ordered u mean "intelligent design" then no. but i do believe that the universe has patterns. but then again the human psyche loves to find patterns...
An beautiful yet random thing that looking at it you cannot but begin to wonder it's cause.
Science does. Are you attempting to disagree?Im_Dooomed wrote:
Would you not agree that intelligence prefers order?Kmarion wrote:
All science is founded on the assumption that the physical world is ordered.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Science is founded on an assumption?Kmarion wrote:
All science is founded on the assumption that the physical world is ordered.
And, would you not agree that intelligence prefers order?
Nature is a powerful force. Those who seek to subdue nature, never do so permanently.
Well if you are trying to pull God into this, you could say that God is above all and doesn't think the same way we do. So we can't know for sure if God prefers order or prefers chaos.Im_Dooomed wrote:
Would you not agree that intelligence prefers order?Kmarion wrote:
All science is founded on the assumption that the physical world is ordered.
Random start, which became ordered once the universal laws were established and came into effect. Time, the weight of atoms, the nuclear forces, etc.
lol, come on Km, i asked if YOU specifically agreed with my comment. Not the science community in general. And no, I'm not attempting anything other then asking for your opinion. Disagree with what?Kmarion wrote:
Science does. Are you attempting to disagree?Im_Dooomed wrote:
Would you not agree that intelligence prefers order?Kmarion wrote:
All science is founded on the assumption that the physical world is ordered.
Nature is a powerful force. Those who seek to subdue nature, never do so permanently.
Of course it is. The initial assumption is tested and verified by gathering observable, empirical and measurable evidence subject to specific principles of reasoning. A scientific method consists of the collection of data through observation and experimentation, and the formulation and testing of hypotheses.Im_Dooomed wrote:
Science is founded on an assumption?Kmarion wrote:
All science is founded on the assumption that the physical world is ordered.
If there was no assumed order, "set of rules" then the whole idea of science would be a waste of time. Assumptions are logical. Chaos is not.
btw that's not an original line. I'm not the first to stumble upon the obvious.
http://www.google.com/search?q=All+scie … 8&aq=t
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Random start, then ordered aftermath? Hm, curious.AussieReaper wrote:
Random start, which became ordered once the universal laws were established and came into effect.
Universal Law, that recognized theory, associated with the universe. "The way the world works." so to speak, right?
Nature is a powerful force. Those who seek to subdue nature, never do so permanently.
Let me answer by saying I am a man of science.Im_Dooomed wrote:
lol, come on Km, i asked if YOU specifically agreed with my comment. Not the science community in general. And no, I'm not attempting anything other then asking for your opinion. Disagree with what?Kmarion wrote:
Science does. Are you attempting to disagree?Im_Dooomed wrote:
Would you not agree that intelligence prefers order?
Spoiler (highlight to read):
ordered
Xbone Stormsurgezz
I find it interesting that so many scientists can believe the universe is based on this orderliness, and they agree that it has absolutely no intelligence behind it all, (Regarding the universe) Obviously, intelligence drives our world as we know it, Earth.
Not total control, but some.
Which raises a matter over "Universal Intelligence"...
Not total control, but some.
Which raises a matter over "Universal Intelligence"...
Nature is a powerful force. Those who seek to subdue nature, never do so permanently.
As components subjected to these universal laws we might just be incapable of understanding the glue that keeps it all together.. "it just is". That doesn't mean there is no rationale behind the Universe we live in. It just means we are predestined to explain it in a way that we must, given our own human role in this thing.Im_Dooomed wrote:
I find it interesting that so many scientists can believe the universe is based on this orderliness, and they agree that it has absolutely no intelligence behind it all, (Regarding the universe) Obviously, intelligence drives our world as we know it, Earth.
Not total control, but some.
Which raises a matter over "Universal Intelligence"...
Xbone Stormsurgezz
Before the big bang time was just a concept, when you follow the formation of our universe backwards those laws cease to exist. If you re-model the universe with the weight of an electron slightly different stars don't form.Im_Dooomed wrote:
Random start, then ordered aftermath? Hm, curious.AussieReaper wrote:
Random start, which became ordered once the universal laws were established and came into effect.
Universal Law, that recognized theory, associated with the universe. "The way the world works." so to speak, right?
Bit of both.Completely random?
or
Precisely ordered?
Fuck Israel
An intelligence (divine or universal) implies something apart from the Universe.Im_Dooomed wrote:
I find it interesting that so many scientists can believe the universe is based on this orderliness, and they agree that it has absolutely no intelligence behind it all, (Regarding the universe) Obviously, intelligence drives our world as we know it, Earth.
Not total control, but some.
Which raises a matter over "Universal Intelligence"...
An orderly Universe only implies the consistency of what is, is at it is.
To assume the necessity of a creator for the universe, based solely on the orderliness of the universe, also assumes a necessity for a creator for the creator... and you end up with something like "And it's turtles all the way down!". In other words, either something sprang from nothing - or our concepts of something and nothing are but Aristotle's shadows on a cave wall (i.e., distorted illusions seen as fact).
Last edited by rdx-fx (2009-02-25 01:25:39)
Someone read a brief history of time. ^
Xbone Stormsurgezz
"It's [reality] Jim, but not as we know it"Im_Dooomed wrote:
Completely random?
or
Precisely ordered?
20 years ago, yes. Now that you mention it.Kmarion wrote:
Someone read a brief history of time.
Am I channeling Hawking here?
In an infinite existence however small the probability of something happening it will eventually happen.Before the big bang time was just a concept, when you follow the formation of our universe backwards those laws cease to exist. If you re-model the universe with the weight of an electron slightly different stars don't form.
No doubt there were an infinite number of universes before this one where the mass of an electron was slightly off.
Fuck Israel
Seems to be your theme. BTW they've got a briefer history of time now.rdx-fx wrote:
20 years ago, yes. Now that you mention it.Kmarion wrote:
Someone read a brief history of time.
Am I channeling Hawking here?
Xbone Stormsurgezz
man, Optics gets brain-bending enough for me. Theoretical Physics I'll leave to the guys like Hawking, Einstein, and Planck... and the bong smokers in tie-dye.
Oh lovely.Kmarion wrote:
Seems to be your theme. BTW they've got a briefer history of time now.rdx-fx wrote:
20 years ago, yes. Now that you mention it.Kmarion wrote:
Someone read a brief history of time.
Am I channeling Hawking here?
Theoretical Physics for the ADHD child eh?
What next, Nuclear Weapon Design for Dummies ?
The Universe In A Nutshell is more confuzling.Kmarion wrote:
Someone read a brief history of time. ^