BF2S Forums Anti-Islamist politician vows to defy ban by entering Britain

Bertster7 wrote:

Poseidon wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

So let me get this straight...  the solution to hate speech is arresting people.  I think Islamic extremists and people like Wilders are scumbags, but what have they done to garner bans or prosecution?

You guys are really going down a slippery slope right now.

Seriously...I'm all for locking someone up for making criminal threats or something, but just for talking shit? Pretty weak.

So you don't consider telling your followers to kill all non-Muslims is making criminal threats?

I don't know that much about the 2nd guy, but Abu Hamza is a nasty piece of work. Look him up.

Well, if you can prove a conspiracy for murder, yes, prosecution should be done.

Wilders shouldn't be banned from your country though.  Also, that diplomat who said some anti-Semitic things shouldn't be prosecuted (but he should be forced to resign).

The point is...  unless the person is actually engaging in a criminal offense, no charges or bans should be implemented.  Hate speech shouldn't be a criminal offense, unless again, a conspiracy for murder or violence is involved.

If you start banning people from expressing certain opinions, you've entered authoritarian territory.

andy12 wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:

So you don't consider telling your followers to kill all non-Muslims is making criminal threats?

I don't know that much about the 2nd guy, but Abu Hamza is a nasty piece of work. Look him up.

Well, if you can prove a conspiracy for murder, yes, prosecution should be done.

Wilders shouldn't be banned from your country though.  Also, that diplomat who said some anti-Semitic things shouldn't be prosecuted (but he should be forced to resign).

The point is...  unless the person is actually engaging in a criminal offense, no charges or bans should be implemented.  Hate speech shouldn't be a criminal offense, unless again, a conspiracy for murder or violence is involved.

If you start banning people from expressing certain opinions, you've entered authoritarian territory.

People here as everywhere else are easily led, I'm sure you have a similar Sheep/Shepherd ratio over there? Why risk this guy inspiring mindless bored individuals to commit hate crimes for the sake sitting on the high horse of "It's a democracy and you can say what you want". The reality is you can't say what you want in any country. There isn't freedom of speech anywhere, especially in regards to inducing crime and hate.

I had a deep think on this last night and I actually agree with some of what is being said by you, but I'll take this side in defence of the Queen and her country, GSTQ.

Well, I suppose this is where cultural differences take precedence.  A lot of countries prefer order over freedom.  America leans further in the freedom direction than most other countries, which as a result, sacrifices some of our order.

We tend to be somewhat aggressive as a people, which helps explain our higher crime rate than many other First World nations.  But, for better or worse, we place a much higher value on freedom than most other cultures.  As a highly individualistic person, I greatly appreciate freedom over order.

Granted, I can understand why many other people lean more in the order direction.  I guess I'm just way too Libertarian to trust government controlling the freedom of speech.  Censorship pisses me off quicker than most other things.