"A penny saved is a government oversight"-Ganahl Lumber Store witty quote of the week.
As a Conservative, I think that bank shareholders and board members should decide compensation for their executives (i.e. if an Executive brings in 10 billion in profits, then getting 1% of that - 100 million - is not all that uncalled for)...
EXCEPT when a company is taking money from the government that is when the government should be able to come in an put rules on that money.
I wonder how many of these companies would had taken the money if these 'strings' were spelled out before?
OP: I'm still not in favor of bailouts...low cost loans I can see, but not out-right free money.
EXCEPT when a company is taking money from the government that is when the government should be able to come in an put rules on that money.
I wonder how many of these companies would had taken the money if these 'strings' were spelled out before?
OP: I'm still not in favor of bailouts...low cost loans I can see, but not out-right free money.
It's not that easy Kmarion ... depends how the surplus is generated, and our surplus is only from sales of oil and gas ... the prices have been so good for so long it's no way we could spend all that money without causing huge currency problems for ourselves ... we also invested some of the money in a oilfund in various stock markets around the world that also made the fund skyrocket ... which is good for further generations when oil and gas runs out ...Kmarion wrote:
It's been argued that a reasonable debt can be good (better than a surplus). It means you are being invested in, via treasury certificates.. etc.Turquoise wrote:
Norway has a big trade surplus right now, correct?Varegg wrote:
Trade in general is a bitch these days, we have a hard time exporting anything but oil and gas ... and of course like any other country we are reluctant to import anything but the most necessary things ... the fear of stockpiling goods is becoming as bad as the blue collars are investing money.
http://books.google.com/books?id=UDpvIC … ;ct=result
And pr date our big trade surplus is in the cellar, we have a very export based industry with mostly fish and fish related products that are now grinding to a halt, the oil and gas is what is keeping us floating ... we need to develop industry and technology that will keep us with the same balance in the future to attract investment on our soil besides petroleum based products and that is a challenge with only 4,8 million people ...
Wait behind the line ..............................................................
FDIC basically already accomplishes that. No bailout is needed to continue that.Dilbert_X wrote:
My solution is let the companies fail, but guarantee savers deposits through govt support.
Seems win-win.
Shitty companies die.
Savers survive.
Govt doesn't need to spend more than necessary.
I admire your conviction lowing (and I'm no fanboy of the bailout concept myself) but paint the picture for me of what society would be like after the collapse of the financial system as we know it. Do you grow your own vegetables and produce your own power?lowing wrote:
I got a sollution for this.................NO BAILOUTS. Let those who will fail, fail.
While living in a communist compound run by the welfare state.Braddock wrote:
I admire your conviction lowing (and I'm no fanboy of the bailout concept myself) but paint the picture for me of what society would be like after the collapse of the financial system as we know it. Do you grow your own vegetables and produce your own power?lowing wrote:
I got a sollution for this.................NO BAILOUTS. Let those who will fail, fail.
There are instutions who would pick up the pieces and carry on, just like with any other business failure. It would not be the end of all man kind if a fucking bank failed.
However, the Obama crew must create this mega disaster scenario or their bullshit govt. control package would never get passed.
However, the Obama crew must create this mega disaster scenario or their bullshit govt. control package would never get passed.
What institutions lowing?
Nobody wants to pick up another companies huge debt. And I'd be surprised if these magical institutions weren't also suffering atm.
Nobody wants to pick up another companies huge debt. And I'd be surprised if these magical institutions weren't also suffering atm.
They will pick them up if they are sold cheap enough I assume. Money doesn't disappear, someone has it.TheAussieReaper wrote:
What institutions lowing?
Nobody wants to pick up another companies huge debt. And I'd be surprised if these magical institutions weren't also suffering atm.
But lowing in reality if nobody guaranteed the money in the banks there would be a massive rush by everyone to withdraw their money (as seen in the UK and Ireland when Northern Rock announced it was sinking and in Argentina during their financial crisis of 2001) and the fact is the entire amount probably doesn't exist in the sense of actual money that you can touch and so you would have a certain amount of the population who are lucky enough to get to the ATM's and banks in time and a very, very angry (and now poor) remainder. There would be riots and protests as society slowly crumbled. The idea that other banks would step in and pick up the pieces is highly questionable because with nowhere being guaranteed as absolutely safe people would be withdrawing across the board and very few banks would have any kind of real purchasing power. With lending at a standstill and money being kept under mattresses and sunk into gold social services such as the police would eventually run out of cash to pay employees and things would then start to look apocalyptical.lowing wrote:
There are instutions who would pick up the pieces and carry on, just like with any other business failure. It would not be the end of all man kind if a fucking bank failed.
However, the Obama crew must create this mega disaster scenario or their bullshit govt. control package would never get passed.
Like I say, I'm no fan of the bailout but I recognise it as a necessary evil. The fact that we have to go down this road though should merit some sort of severe clampdown on the investment banker cunts who helped cause it in the first place. It makes my blood boil every time I hear about a bonus while the entire economic system as we knows it limps along on life support. Rome is burning and these guys still think they're at the party.
Give the taxpayers their money back in the same proportions that they paid. Instant results.Braddock wrote:
But lowing in reality if nobody guaranteed the money in the banks there would be a massive rush by everyone to withdraw their money (as seen in the UK and Ireland when Northern Rock announced it was sinking and in Argentina during their financial crisis of 2001) and the fact is the entire amount probably doesn't exist in the sense of actual money that you can touch and so you would have a certain amount of the population who are lucky enough to get to the ATM's and banks in time and a very, very angry (and now poor) remainder. There would be riots and protests as society slowly crumbled. The idea that other banks would step in and pick up the pieces is highly questionable because with nowhere being guaranteed as absolutely safe people would be withdrawing across the board and very few banks would have any kind of real purchasing power. With lending at a standstill and money being kept under mattresses and sunk into gold social services such as the police would eventually run out of cash to pay employees and things would then start to look apocalyptical.lowing wrote:
There are instutions who would pick up the pieces and carry on, just like with any other business failure. It would not be the end of all man kind if a fucking bank failed.
However, the Obama crew must create this mega disaster scenario or their bullshit govt. control package would never get passed.
Like I say, I'm no fan of the bailout but I recognise it as a necessary evil. The fact that we have to go down this road though should merit some sort of severe clampdown on the investment banker cunts who helped cause it in the first place. It makes my blood boil every time I hear about a bonus while the entire economic system as we knows it limps along on life support. Rome is burning and these guys still think they're at the party.
So your solution is anarchy? Dismantle the tax system entirely thus leaving the Government to run on fresh air? I hate to have to drag reality into this argument again but cops and firemen tend to get a little disgruntled at fresh air in their pay cheques.lowing wrote:
Give the taxpayers their money back in the same proportions that they paid. Instant results.Braddock wrote:
But lowing in reality if nobody guaranteed the money in the banks there would be a massive rush by everyone to withdraw their money (as seen in the UK and Ireland when Northern Rock announced it was sinking and in Argentina during their financial crisis of 2001) and the fact is the entire amount probably doesn't exist in the sense of actual money that you can touch and so you would have a certain amount of the population who are lucky enough to get to the ATM's and banks in time and a very, very angry (and now poor) remainder. There would be riots and protests as society slowly crumbled. The idea that other banks would step in and pick up the pieces is highly questionable because with nowhere being guaranteed as absolutely safe people would be withdrawing across the board and very few banks would have any kind of real purchasing power. With lending at a standstill and money being kept under mattresses and sunk into gold social services such as the police would eventually run out of cash to pay employees and things would then start to look apocalyptical.lowing wrote:
There are instutions who would pick up the pieces and carry on, just like with any other business failure. It would not be the end of all man kind if a fucking bank failed.
However, the Obama crew must create this mega disaster scenario or their bullshit govt. control package would never get passed.
Like I say, I'm no fan of the bailout but I recognise it as a necessary evil. The fact that we have to go down this road though should merit some sort of severe clampdown on the investment banker cunts who helped cause it in the first place. It makes my blood boil every time I hear about a bonus while the entire economic system as we knows it limps along on life support. Rome is burning and these guys still think they're at the party.
No braddock only a portion of their taxes, more substantial than 500 bucks. and only for the past 2 years or so, not all the back ot the beginning of time.Braddock wrote:
So your solution is anarchy? Dismantle the tax system entirely thus leaving the Government to run on fresh air? I hate to have to drag reality into this argument again but cops and firemen tend to get a little disgruntled at fresh air in their pay cheques.lowing wrote:
Give the taxpayers their money back in the same proportions that they paid. Instant results.Braddock wrote:
But lowing in reality if nobody guaranteed the money in the banks there would be a massive rush by everyone to withdraw their money (as seen in the UK and Ireland when Northern Rock announced it was sinking and in Argentina during their financial crisis of 2001) and the fact is the entire amount probably doesn't exist in the sense of actual money that you can touch and so you would have a certain amount of the population who are lucky enough to get to the ATM's and banks in time and a very, very angry (and now poor) remainder. There would be riots and protests as society slowly crumbled. The idea that other banks would step in and pick up the pieces is highly questionable because with nowhere being guaranteed as absolutely safe people would be withdrawing across the board and very few banks would have any kind of real purchasing power. With lending at a standstill and money being kept under mattresses and sunk into gold social services such as the police would eventually run out of cash to pay employees and things would then start to look apocalyptical.
Like I say, I'm no fan of the bailout but I recognise it as a necessary evil. The fact that we have to go down this road though should merit some sort of severe clampdown on the investment banker cunts who helped cause it in the first place. It makes my blood boil every time I hear about a bonus while the entire economic system as we knows it limps along on life support. Rome is burning and these guys still think they're at the party.
If you wanna see anarchy, wait until the American people that work for a living are forced to give more than halk of their paychecks to Obama for wealth redistribution.
Last edited by lowing (2009-02-08 17:54:38)
"Wealth redistribution"... I love your rhetoric!lowing wrote:
No braddock only a portion of their taxes, more substantial than 500 bucks. and only for the past 2 years or so, not all the back ot the beginning of time.Braddock wrote:
So your solution is anarchy? Dismantle the tax system entirely thus leaving the Government to run on fresh air? I hate to have to drag reality into this argument again but cops and firemen tend to get a little disgruntled at fresh air in their pay cheques.lowing wrote:
Give the taxpayers their money back in the same proportions that they paid. Instant results.
If you wanna see anarchy, wait until the American people that work for a living are forced to give more than halk of their paychecks to Obama for wealth redistribution.
Refunding of tax payments would only be a sticking plaster on a severed limb. You think a guy who has millions deposited in an unguaranteed bank is going be content to leave his cash there because of a tax rebate? A tax rebate would not quell a bank rush lowing, bank rushes are self fulfilling prophecies, once they start they continue until rock bottom is reached and they start because people are scared and worried. Just look at Northern Rock, if everyone had just remained calm and left their cash in the bank it may have been okay but nobody wants to be the one mug who doesn't get their cash out. The only way to get people to relax and not move their savings from the bank to the mattress is to guarantee the banks... it's a bitter pill to swallow but it's just how it is.
What's annoying is that the irresponsible lenders don't seem to recognise that this is the economic equivalent of DEFCON 1 and are instead treating it as another blank cheque to fund their party lifestyles.
A certain amount of buyouts are occurring though. Warren Buffett is having a field day at the moment.TheAussieReaper wrote:
What institutions lowing?
Nobody wants to pick up another companies huge debt. And I'd be surprised if these magical institutions weren't also suffering atm.
You also see things like the Wells Fargo buyout of Wachovia. Some companies were just smarter in their business habits.
wealth redistribution is not rhetoric, it is a fact, Obama said himself, he wants to SPREAD the WEALTH. Dress it up as you see fit, it is WEALTH REDISTRIBUTION we are talking about.Braddock wrote:
"Wealth redistribution"... I love your rhetoric!lowing wrote:
No braddock only a portion of their taxes, more substantial than 500 bucks. and only for the past 2 years or so, not all the back ot the beginning of time.Braddock wrote:
So your solution is anarchy? Dismantle the tax system entirely thus leaving the Government to run on fresh air? I hate to have to drag reality into this argument again but cops and firemen tend to get a little disgruntled at fresh air in their pay cheques.
If you wanna see anarchy, wait until the American people that work for a living are forced to give more than halk of their paychecks to Obama for wealth redistribution.
Refunding of tax payments would only be a sticking plaster on a severed limb. You think a guy who has millions deposited in an unguaranteed bank is going be content to leave his cash there because of a tax rebate? A tax rebate would not quell a bank rush lowing, bank rushes are self fulfilling prophecies, once they start they continue until rock bottom is reached and they start because people are scared and worried. Just look at Northern Rock, if everyone had just remained calm and left their cash in the bank it may have been okay but nobody wants to be the one mug who doesn't get their cash out. The only way to get people to relax and not move their savings from the bank to the mattress is to guarantee the banks... it's a bitter pill to swallow but it's just how it is.
What's annoying is that the irresponsible lenders don't seem to recognise that this is the economic equivalent of DEFCON 1 and are instead treating it as another blank cheque to fund their party lifestyles.
People are not removing their money from banks as far as I can tell. They don't have any to remove. Give the tax payers a significant portion of their money back and hey will payy off bills buy new cars go on vacation etc....in other words SPEND.
this sentence I agree with, that is why FUCK bailouts let them die
I called his as well, yet again no one believes meTurquoise wrote:
A certain amount of buyouts are occurring though. Warren Buffett is having a field day at the moment.TheAussieReaper wrote:
What institutions lowing?
Nobody wants to pick up another companies huge debt. And I'd be surprised if these magical institutions weren't also suffering atm.
You also see things like the Wells Fargo buyout of Wachovia. Some companies were just smarter in their business habits.
I thought about this also.... and yes... I would do whatever it took to survive.Braddock wrote:
I admire your conviction lowing (and I'm no fanboy of the bailout concept myself) but paint the picture for me of what society would be like after the collapse of the financial system as we know it. Do you grow your own vegetables and produce your own power?lowing wrote:
I got a sollution for this.................NO BAILOUTS. Let those who will fail, fail.
Love is the answer
I have it's stored away with my zombie plan and my "holy shit aliens" plan.Braddock wrote:
I admire your conviction lowing (and I'm no fanboy of the bailout concept myself) but paint the picture for me of what society would be like after the collapse of the financial system as we know it. Do you grow your own vegetables and produce your own power?lowing wrote:
I got a sollution for this.................NO BAILOUTS. Let those who will fail, fail.
Why? is the world all of a sudden gunna stop flying? I have no debt, ( yet) I think I am gunna take advantage of this crisis and buy a new car dirt cheap.Braddock wrote:
I admire your conviction lowing (and I'm no fanboy of the bailout concept myself) but paint the picture for me of what society would be like after the collapse of the financial system as we know it. Do you grow your own vegetables and produce your own power?lowing wrote:
I got a sollution for this.................NO BAILOUTS. Let those who will fail, fail.
lmao...wish I could karma you again for this laugh.uevjHEYFFQ wrote:
I have it's stored away with my zombie plan and my "holy shit aliens" plan.Braddock wrote:
I admire your conviction lowing (and I'm no fanboy of the bailout concept myself) but paint the picture for me of what society would be like after the collapse of the financial system as we know it. Do you grow your own vegetables and produce your own power?lowing wrote:
I got a sollution for this.................NO BAILOUTS. Let those who will fail, fail.
Buy an eco friendly car and help the US auto industry. They get financial assistance for making those.lowing wrote:
Why? is the world all of a sudden gunna stop flying? I have no debt, ( yet) I think I am gunna take advantage of this crisis and buy a new car dirt cheap.
A national debt, if it is not excessive, will be to us a national blessing...Varegg wrote:
It's not that easy Kmarion ... depends how the surplus is generated, and our surplus is only from sales of oil and gas ... the prices have been so good for so long it's no way we could spend all that money without causing huge currency problems for ourselves ... we also invested some of the money in a oilfund in various stock markets around the world that also made the fund skyrocket ... which is good for further generations when oil and gas runs out ...Kmarion wrote:
It's been argued that a reasonable debt can be good (better than a surplus). It means you are being invested in, via treasury certificates.. etc.Turquoise wrote:
Norway has a big trade surplus right now, correct?
http://books.google.com/books?id=UDpvIC … ;ct=result
And pr date our big trade surplus is in the cellar, we have a very export based industry with mostly fish and fish related products that are now grinding to a halt, the oil and gas is what is keeping us floating ... we need to develop industry and technology that will keep us with the same balance in the future to attract investment on our soil besides petroleum based products and that is a challenge with only 4,8 million people ...
Xbone Stormsurgezz
The US doesn't make any yet.Buy an eco friendly car and help the US auto industry. They get financial assistance for making those.
Fuck Israel
I kinda liked this partKmarion wrote:
A national debt, if it is not excessive, will be to us a national blessing...Varegg wrote:
It's not that easy Kmarion ... depends how the surplus is generated, and our surplus is only from sales of oil and gas ... the prices have been so good for so long it's no way we could spend all that money without causing huge currency problems for ourselves ... we also invested some of the money in a oilfund in various stock markets around the world that also made the fund skyrocket ... which is good for further generations when oil and gas runs out ...Kmarion wrote:
It's been argued that a reasonable debt can be good (better than a surplus). It means you are being invested in, via treasury certificates.. etc.
http://books.google.com/books?id=UDpvIC … ;ct=result
And pr date our big trade surplus is in the cellar, we have a very export based industry with mostly fish and fish related products that are now grinding to a halt, the oil and gas is what is keeping us floating ... we need to develop industry and technology that will keep us with the same balance in the future to attract investment on our soil besides petroleum based products and that is a challenge with only 4,8 million people ...
I wish politicians could settle their difference more in the spirit of a founding fatherwiki wrote:
His intense rivalry with Vice President Burr eventually resulted in a duel, in which Hamilton was mortally wounded, dying the following day.
Wait behind the line ..............................................................