Well fellow aviators ... any early impressions of 1.21? Do we need to develop any new tactics? Ground based AA seems to be somewhat more effect now. Maybe that was me being unlucky but I've been downed several times today due to accurate SAM fire. As for Air-to-Air missiles, it is possible to out manoeuvre them now and perhaps we will see a resurgence of the dogfight. Anyway, all thoughts welcome ...
Yes! I am a huge user of F-tapping. I'll trail an enemy jet and try to gun him down with the guns. If he starts getting smart with me and looping around, I'll tap F to get him to drop flares. Quickly tap F again into bombs, and tap back to missiles as the flares clear. I usually get at least one hit if I fire a pair of missiles using this tactic. With this strategy in mind, I've become very conservative as far as dropping flares goes; I don't want to be caught with my pants down and two armed missiles looking for a home in my rear end. Addmittedly, though, outmaneuvering missles is somewhat easier with 1.21. Fox One!Viper38 wrote:
A slightly obvious point to be made tonight regarding flares. Just had two very long rounds on Clean Sweep. First thing I noticed was that as my opponent dropped his flares he pulled up above them giving my targeting system the chance to distinguish between his counter measures and his aircraft. It may seem palpable but staying close to your flares makes it harder for the opposing pilot to lock onto you. Now for the second point, never waste missiles until the enemy has dropped his flares - as soon as this takes place tap the F key and switch to ground attack mode - In the first instance this may fool the enemy into thinking his counter measures have worked. More importantly, it seems to clear the lock on system and with another quick tap of F you will find that your targeting system will lock onto your opponents aircraft much faster. Does anyone else practice this quick double tap of the F key after an opponent has dropped his flares? Give it a try and let me know what you think.
On another topic, 1.21 is supposedly released on Friday - will it improve the situation for aviators or make our lives even harder? We shall have to see. Please do keep posting - we’ve got to keep these ground pounders on their toes.
Viper 38
Another note on 1.21, AA vehicles seem to be far more devastating. I've gotten locked onto from fairly far away, and I usually try to drop flares and climb to ~400 meters. A lot of times, they lock back onto me before I can reach the proper altitude and I'm toast. Seeing as I haven't mastered my bombing with the fighters, it's difficult for me to take out Linebackers and their foreign friends. Lately, I seem to take away half my own armor when I bomb with the bombers. More altitude needed, I suppose.
I'm glad to see I'm not the only one with a problem when it comes to getting away from those pesky J-10's. One thing I have noticed is that the USMC planes seem to handle better at higher altitudes, and if you come out of high altitude you have an advantage when it comes to speed as compared to low flying enemies. Something to keep in mind.
Thanks for another excellent post Skratch As you've noted, never drop those flares too quickly - I can't think of any advice on how to drop flares with correct timing - its just something to learn with a great deal of practice.
Yes it does appear that 1.21 has led to the revival of dogfighting and I really don't have too many complaints about the Air-to-Air missiles anymore.
Yes it does appear that 1.21 has led to the revival of dogfighting and I really don't have too many complaints about the Air-to-Air missiles anymore.
My advice updated to 1.21:
Learn how to land a jet! Something every pilot must be capable of - especially in the days of 1.21 when a missle can (still, although it's less likely :p) slam into your rear end at any time. Don't do what most players do, flying over an airfield 5 times, slowly, putting themselves at great risk. My advice: In the beginning, approach the airfield from far away, and make sure you're properly lined up. Start braking early, so that you're around 500-600 kp/h and about 1 1/2 height of one those jet hangers when you reach the start of the runway. You must be LOSING speed at this point, instead of just starting to brake. Do not approach the runway from a high angle, but try to fly low and straight instead. The secret to not exploding on contact with the runway is simple - do not let your nose touch it. Therefore, aim your nose upwards, while your jet slows down and loses altitude. keep braking once you've landed, fix your jet, reverse so you have enough room to take off, and fly away again.
Note: The F-35Bs have different ways of landing. My personal favourite is to hit reverse to hover at a speed of around 800, fly low over the water, then pull up just before the carrier . Flying up will slow you down, so if you time this right you'll be hovering right over the main deck, fixed in a sec, and you can fly off again.
You don't have to land your jet at a runway. The best classes you can be in a jet are engineer and support. You can land your jet anywhere as long as you follow the rule of not touching the ground with anything other than the wheels. Handy if your team has lost your only airfield, for example, as you can either repair or resupply your jet.
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-IMPORTANT- ALWAYS fly around in bomb mode unless if you want to use missles. Don't alert enemies to your presence untill they don't have a chance to get away.
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The best way to not get shot down in a jet is to simply not get anyone on your tail. There are a few ways you can actually make it less likely to get someone on your six:
-Fly at higher altitudes. 500-600 feet will basically keep you out of sight for most people.
-Don't fly in straight lines. It's much harder to actually get behind an enemy jet and stay there if they're constantly turning and not letting you stay in their 'tracks'.
-Don't take obvious routes. (eg.: US carrier straight to MEC airfield on Oman) So combine this with the previous tip and you'll be chasing more than dodging.
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A sure way to dodge missles: In the J10, if you've got a missle heading for you and you have no other option left than to dodge, start rollling (read: steer left/right+roll) Using this method I haven't been hit by a missle yet. Doesn't seem to work as well in other jets though.
Note: Beware of going out of the map! Or straight into the ground, for that matter, as you should only stop spiralling once you've dodged all missles, meaning that you'll be going in a straight line.
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Get more out of the flares - Do a barrel roll when you're being targeted by AA and launch your flares whilst doing it. Your flares will be launched upwards and will cover your ass for a much longer time. DO NOT launch your flares when you don't have a missle heading for you yet. If you can't see whether or not that's happening, launch your flares just after the enemies lock-on sequence is complete.
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A note of warning: Rubble is dangerous. If you've shot down an enemy jet/helicopter, always watch out for falling remains (or paratroopers, as these are equally nasty)
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Chasing someone around in circles? Getting bored yet? Do a looping. You'll learn to time this right so you end up right on your enemiessix.
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If you notice that the jet you're chasing is slowing down, laugh at the pilot, and just shoot it out of the sky as a slow flying jet is easier to kill than a sitting duck without legs. Missles will barely ever miss, or you can just finish them off with your guns.
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Guns - Don't underestimate these. Pilots seem to listen only for the beeping of a missle these days, so get yourself behind the enemy jet, and launch in with a nice volley of bullets. You can do lots of damage with this, and with sufficient practice bring down enemy jets in no time. Aim slightly above ground targets (and ahead of them if they're moving)
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Vertical bombing - Pesky AA sites? Fly straight up, do a nice 1/2 loop, and fly straight back down again above your target. AA sites are an easy target with guns here, so dont waste bombs. If you really have to, Fly as vertically as you can when dropping the bombs, and you'll get yourself a kill, plus all the other people waiting to whore the AA.
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the Uberloop! Hard to pull off, and you put yourself at some risk, but it does work - Fly very high up, and turn SLOWLY. I usually go up to 900 feet doing this. Your opponent will lose control of his jet, while you go back down again. The trick is to not turn too fast, so you don't lose control. In fact, if you fly high enough you will actually go faster than a missle.
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This one is VERY unlikely to be useful in actual online dogfighting, but it has saved my ass once or twice. If you've got no way out of a dogfight, fly up in a straight line. Go up as high as you possibly can - 2000 feet plus (hence: "not very likely to be useful"), deaccelerate, and let your jet do a 180. jump out of your jet. Yes, at 2000 feet. It should be heading down to earth now (As opposed to it flying off in a random direction) You can 'steer' yourself at these altitudes, and if you get it right you can fall back down to earth along with your jet. Just dont 'fly' into it or you'll just die. Once you've fooled your opponent get back in again. Yes, in midair.
Note- Beware of going out of the map! And you can actually 'fly' faster by holding down sprint.
Viper, feel free to add these to your post if you think they're of any use
Learn how to land a jet! Something every pilot must be capable of - especially in the days of 1.21 when a missle can (still, although it's less likely :p) slam into your rear end at any time. Don't do what most players do, flying over an airfield 5 times, slowly, putting themselves at great risk. My advice: In the beginning, approach the airfield from far away, and make sure you're properly lined up. Start braking early, so that you're around 500-600 kp/h and about 1 1/2 height of one those jet hangers when you reach the start of the runway. You must be LOSING speed at this point, instead of just starting to brake. Do not approach the runway from a high angle, but try to fly low and straight instead. The secret to not exploding on contact with the runway is simple - do not let your nose touch it. Therefore, aim your nose upwards, while your jet slows down and loses altitude. keep braking once you've landed, fix your jet, reverse so you have enough room to take off, and fly away again.
Note: The F-35Bs have different ways of landing. My personal favourite is to hit reverse to hover at a speed of around 800, fly low over the water, then pull up just before the carrier . Flying up will slow you down, so if you time this right you'll be hovering right over the main deck, fixed in a sec, and you can fly off again.
You don't have to land your jet at a runway. The best classes you can be in a jet are engineer and support. You can land your jet anywhere as long as you follow the rule of not touching the ground with anything other than the wheels. Handy if your team has lost your only airfield, for example, as you can either repair or resupply your jet.
------------------------------
-IMPORTANT- ALWAYS fly around in bomb mode unless if you want to use missles. Don't alert enemies to your presence untill they don't have a chance to get away.
------------------------------
The best way to not get shot down in a jet is to simply not get anyone on your tail. There are a few ways you can actually make it less likely to get someone on your six:
-Fly at higher altitudes. 500-600 feet will basically keep you out of sight for most people.
-Don't fly in straight lines. It's much harder to actually get behind an enemy jet and stay there if they're constantly turning and not letting you stay in their 'tracks'.
-Don't take obvious routes. (eg.: US carrier straight to MEC airfield on Oman) So combine this with the previous tip and you'll be chasing more than dodging.
------------------------------
A sure way to dodge missles: In the J10, if you've got a missle heading for you and you have no other option left than to dodge, start rollling (read: steer left/right+roll) Using this method I haven't been hit by a missle yet. Doesn't seem to work as well in other jets though.
Note: Beware of going out of the map! Or straight into the ground, for that matter, as you should only stop spiralling once you've dodged all missles, meaning that you'll be going in a straight line.
------------------------------
Get more out of the flares - Do a barrel roll when you're being targeted by AA and launch your flares whilst doing it. Your flares will be launched upwards and will cover your ass for a much longer time. DO NOT launch your flares when you don't have a missle heading for you yet. If you can't see whether or not that's happening, launch your flares just after the enemies lock-on sequence is complete.
------------------------------
A note of warning: Rubble is dangerous. If you've shot down an enemy jet/helicopter, always watch out for falling remains (or paratroopers, as these are equally nasty)
------------------------------
Chasing someone around in circles? Getting bored yet? Do a looping. You'll learn to time this right so you end up right on your enemiessix.
------------------------------
If you notice that the jet you're chasing is slowing down, laugh at the pilot, and just shoot it out of the sky as a slow flying jet is easier to kill than a sitting duck without legs. Missles will barely ever miss, or you can just finish them off with your guns.
------------------------------
Guns - Don't underestimate these. Pilots seem to listen only for the beeping of a missle these days, so get yourself behind the enemy jet, and launch in with a nice volley of bullets. You can do lots of damage with this, and with sufficient practice bring down enemy jets in no time. Aim slightly above ground targets (and ahead of them if they're moving)
------------------------------
Vertical bombing - Pesky AA sites? Fly straight up, do a nice 1/2 loop, and fly straight back down again above your target. AA sites are an easy target with guns here, so dont waste bombs. If you really have to, Fly as vertically as you can when dropping the bombs, and you'll get yourself a kill, plus all the other people waiting to whore the AA.
------------------------------
the Uberloop! Hard to pull off, and you put yourself at some risk, but it does work - Fly very high up, and turn SLOWLY. I usually go up to 900 feet doing this. Your opponent will lose control of his jet, while you go back down again. The trick is to not turn too fast, so you don't lose control. In fact, if you fly high enough you will actually go faster than a missle.
------------------------------
This one is VERY unlikely to be useful in actual online dogfighting, but it has saved my ass once or twice. If you've got no way out of a dogfight, fly up in a straight line. Go up as high as you possibly can - 2000 feet plus (hence: "not very likely to be useful"), deaccelerate, and let your jet do a 180. jump out of your jet. Yes, at 2000 feet. It should be heading down to earth now (As opposed to it flying off in a random direction) You can 'steer' yourself at these altitudes, and if you get it right you can fall back down to earth along with your jet. Just dont 'fly' into it or you'll just die. Once you've fooled your opponent get back in again. Yes, in midair.
Note- Beware of going out of the map! And you can actually 'fly' faster by holding down sprint.
Viper, feel free to add these to your post if you think they're of any use
Last edited by SargeV1.4 (2006-03-17 02:02:55)
Thanks Sarge - I've added your updated thoughts to the first page - love No.16 - gonna give that a try. Maybe its time this thread got sticky or even, dare I say it, featured. The material is simply gold for aviators - thanks to everyone who has contributed so far.
Why isn't this thread featured yet???
One thing you can do to determine when to drop flares is to have a convinient bind for rear view. Check if there's a missile on your tale and drop flares if there is. A very good pilot I watched a video of often checked his rear view while flying.Viper38 wrote:
Thanks for another excellent post Skratch As you've noted, never drop those flares too quickly - I can't think of any advice on how to drop flares with correct timing - its just something to learn with a great deal of practice.
Yes it does appear that 1.21 has led to the revival of dogfighting and I really don't have too many complaints about the Air-to-Air missiles anymore.
Thanks for all these pointers. Being a fairly inexperienced aviator, they've certainly put a few more tactics in my arsenal.
As regards the AA on the Essex, I've found the best tactic is to approach the ship from the bow and at an angle so as to keep the bridge between you and the gun. Once you're nicely (almost) lined up, come out slightly and with a final adjustment, blow the hell out of it with cannon fire. Almost all AA gunners will be scanning towards the land and rarely look behind them.
Swiss
As regards the AA on the Essex, I've found the best tactic is to approach the ship from the bow and at an angle so as to keep the bridge between you and the gun. Once you're nicely (almost) lined up, come out slightly and with a final adjustment, blow the hell out of it with cannon fire. Almost all AA gunners will be scanning towards the land and rarely look behind them.
Swiss
landing a jet is all good and well but the other day i landed a few times and i got TKed by some jelouse anti-tankers whilst i was being repaired on the run way........lol
just thought I'd see if anyone was still interested in this ... Zenmaster's guide is pretty much the shit but just thought it might be nice to reactive a thread where aviators of all skill levels can share their tactical wisdom
I'll pop this up at the start too - just to let everyone know its a little old - I'll try and update it soon
I'll pop this up at the start too - just to let everyone know its a little old - I'll try and update it soon
Last edited by Viper38 (2006-05-13 18:30:11)