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2006-03-11 08:40:12
kn0ckahh
Member
+98|6954|netherlands, sweet lake city

OpsChief wrote:

Maybe this is too early to tell but I will strike while the iron is hot.  EA turns up the heat with the 1.2 missile lock so it may be that coordinated ground/air attacks will be needed to advance and cap some maps while reducing air losses. Just one more task for forces to deal with on the road to victory lol

It is called JSEAD  Joint Suppression of Enemy Air Defense and it is one of the hardest teamwork skills a military can exercise. Here is my BF2 translation.


Commander Tasks....Anticipate - Coordinate - Verify
   Scan&Spot  Sat for enemy locs and informs team (right click on red dot etc)
   Task&Talk   Issues orders to ground/air squads, for mutual timing of attacks
   Set&Track   Set UAV, track and report to tasked units about enemy activity
   Plot&Drop   Plots arty on enemy AA and plans supply drops to support the attack

Squad Leaders....Flexibility - Cooperation - Leadership
   Plan, move, execute, report, refit and move out
   Man AA vehicles continuously
   Man AA stations as needed, frequently
   Get out the .50 cals and PKMs to weaken or destroy aircraft

Aircraft...Situational Awareness - Coordinate Strike Plans -  Cooperate with Ground Plan
   Form an air squad to assist commanders communication
   Attack in mutually supporting teams of 2-3 mixed aircraft
     First aircraft drops defensive measures lowest and fastest path over enemy AA to shield following and more exposed aircraft
     Following aircraft destroys AA with TV missile if available
     Next pass executes strike, either planned or targets of opportunity

Kit Priorities (air maps supporting JSEAD strikes)
   Sniper  AA gunners
   AT       AA vehicles/stations
   Spt      AA stations
   SF       AA vehicles/stations


I bet I end up editing this a few times....

Let's have fun out there
Commanders, the attack plan needs to be in greater depth now. Account for all the AA along the routes/avenues of advance. Arty needs to hit the pedmounted AA in the strike area OR along the air avenues of attack.
hey this is exactly the kind of fighting in clanwars ... you should get in a clan
then youll see this is very possible.... the onlything is that in clanwars everything can go wrong and some things wont but this will make is very difficult to maintain good tactics .... + the chaos the commander will get if he gets all the squadldrs talking to him
2006-03-11 10:43:50
J0hn.F.Kenedy
Member
+-1|6973|Longueuil
i would say that AA vehicule should always be manned by a support class since they can give it unlimited amo...
2006-03-11 18:24:43
KamelGutt
Member
+1|6846|Norway
OPsChief. I hope i one day get to play, when youre commander..
2006-03-11 21:36:57
morbesso666
Member
+0|6979|Givataim, Israel
MAAN all this for a win? no thanks
its anyway not gonna work - lack of motivation of ppl.
2006-03-12 13:46:12
polarbearz
Raiders of the Lost Bear
+-1,474|7004|Singapore

OpsChief wrote:

]
   Attack in mutually supporting teams of 2-3 mixed aircraft
2 airplanes. max

and unless people stop tk-ing for planes, standing on the runways, parking a jeep/tank/APC in front of the plane while taking, i fly for points only
2006-03-14 19:52:45
OpsChief
Member
+101|6892|Southern California

polarbearz wrote:

OpsChief wrote:

]
   Attack in mutually supporting teams of 2-3 mixed aircraft
2 airplanes. max

and unless people stop tk-ing for planes, standing on the runways, parking a jeep/tank/APC in front of the plane while taking, i fly for points only
I said Aircraft not airplanes    that includes helos and anything you can steal when the bad guys aren't paying attention......
2006-04-27 15:51:44
Auqakuh2213
Bianchi Whore.
+53|6885
Nice summary, but wouldn't 'OODA' have sufficed?
2006-05-06 15:57:15
OpsChief
Member
+101|6892|Southern California
lol

it would to a select few but I was taught not to use acronyms without spelling them out when speaking to civilians or other branches of service.
2006-05-06 16:03:32
Cougar
Banned
+1,962|6980|Dallas
Hahaha, trying this on a pub server would be like Christopher Reeves trying to run in a marathon.  Trying this in a clan match would be very effective, besides the fact that when you are doing it you get capped out.

Good luck making this work.
2006-05-06 22:13:25
OpsChief
Member
+101|6892|Southern California

Cougar wrote:

Hahaha, trying this on a pub server would be like Christopher Reeves trying to run in a marathon.  Trying this in a clan match would be very effective, besides the fact that when you are doing it you get capped out.

Good luck making this work.
Luck is when you chuck a grenade over a wall and get 5 kills instead of the one you were chasing....

I think the specter of luck is exactly why people choose to write this off as fantasy. It takes serious skills and on levels above individual which many in BF2 have or can develop but are either untapped or that feeling of hopelessness among noobs shuts down their can-do attitude. Or they are just trying to have fun. All good.

We have done this, doesnt work every time but it does work. It isnt really that hard to do with a little practice and a few smart people; and I have seen it done once or twice by accident or coincidental efforts. When it is needed it should be tried rather than giving up. And you get capped either way, this needs to integrate with your own capping or defense efforts. For BF2 JSEAD is a brief Battle Drill to be conducted when needed to change the air/ground balance and turn air superiority in your favor so you can cap some flags.

I can see that you see the value enough to know it can work but don't believe in the probabilities. Try calling for JSEAD next time you see the situation call for it. If one or two people in the right position know what you are saying that may be enough to accomplish it.

But remember let's have fun out there

Opschief
2006-05-06 22:19:26
Capt. Foley
Member
+155|6803|Allentown, PA, USA
the only problem with using combined infantry and airpower attacks against AA is that it respawns in 30-60sec
2006-05-06 22:54:54
Cougar
Banned
+1,962|6980|Dallas

OpsChief wrote:

Cougar wrote:

Hahaha, trying this on a pub server would be like Christopher Reeves trying to run in a marathon.  Trying this in a clan match would be very effective, besides the fact that when you are doing it you get capped out.

Good luck making this work.
Luck is when you chuck a grenade over a wall and get 5 kills instead of the one you were chasing....

I think the specter of luck is exactly why people choose to write this off as fantasy. It takes serious skills and on levels above individual which many in BF2 have or can develop but are either untapped or that feeling of hopelessness among noobs shuts down their can-do attitude. Or they are just trying to have fun. All good.

We have done this, doesnt work every time but it does work. It isnt really that hard to do with a little practice and a few smart people; and I have seen it done once or twice by accident or coincidental efforts. When it is needed it should be tried rather than giving up. And you get capped either way, this needs to integrate with your own capping or defense efforts. For BF2 JSEAD is a brief Battle Drill to be conducted when needed to change the air/ground balance and turn air superiority in your favor so you can cap some flags.

I can see that you see the value enough to know it can work but don't believe in the probabilities. Try calling for JSEAD next time you see the situation call for it. If one or two people in the right position know what you are saying that may be enough to accomplish it.

But remember let's have fun out there

Opschief
I'm sorry, but if there is one thing out of all the others I have learned since playing BF2 it would have to be, "Simple is most effective".

Tell me what is more effective (In day to day BF2):

Trying to get your team to rally and make a "Defensive Wall" on the MEC team at Karkand, or "Make sure all armor whores have supply crates at the Hotel"?

Or how about:

A.Plane flys over base A.  You rally teammates to get into AA all across the map and you alert all pilots in the air where the target is at so that they can intercept. 

B.Or instead, getting on VoIP and saying "Dude I think a jet just flew over the warehouse...".

If you chose A, you just got capped off the map while trying to kill a Private First Class who just happened to be standing closer to the jet at the moment.
2006-05-07 12:54:12
OpsChief
Member
+101|6892|Southern California
OK you seem like bright guys whats the problem?  The concept is simple and takes some savvy players. Given that rather than look for why not, look for how can I instead.

This is a Battle Drill in IRL it is complicated because you are working jointly between different branched of service, but thats the planning. Once the plan is done the mission takes only minutes to complete. Just scale it down for BF2, tt takes 30-60 seconds and it's over.  Simplicity is relative. My proof is this:

Sit down and write out complete instructions for someone to brush their teeth. Use either checklist or flowhart style with explanations of each step and cautionary comments too. It looks complicated as hell while reading it, but when you see it done..... 

For alot of the teamwork skilled players just knowing that a joint/combined strike or even just being aware of shutting down AA could be enough to get it done.

Have fun out there...

 

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