BF2S Forums All men are created equal

RAIMIUS wrote:

Simply put, ALL people should be treated equally under the law.  To institute any other system would allow bias, favoritism, racism, sexism, etc.

Everyone gets treated equally until they do something to change that (i.e. criminals lose their right to freedom because they committed a crime).

How about those that have worked for a quality of life, do they get to earn the respect, presitige, rewards, benefits, perks etc, that goes with the  credentials and hard work, or are the ones who have not earned it deserve equal treatment?

lowing wrote:

RAIMIUS wrote:

Simply put, ALL people should be treated equally under the law.  To institute any other system would allow bias, favoritism, racism, sexism, etc.

Everyone gets treated equally until they do something to change that (i.e. criminals lose their right to freedom because they committed a crime).

How about those that have worked for a quality of life, do they get to earn the respect, presitige, rewards, benefits, perks etc, that goes with the  credentials and hard work, or are the ones who have not earned it deserve equal treatment?

As promising and as just as such a system would be, good luck trying to implement a practical - and fair! - version of it.

Lowing, this isn't about equal results. It's about equal opportunity.

I think he's thinking more the Paris Hilton type.

FEOS wrote:

TheAussieReaper wrote:

Vote Democrat, cause we can't all be born with silver spoons in our mouths.

That's a ridiculous statement.

Look at the richest Americans. How many were born that way? Bill Gates? Nope. Warren Buffett? Nope. Steve Jobs? Nope.

They have families. Do you think their children, even grand children are ever going to have to worry about what a welfare payment looks like?

I didn't think so.

Spark wrote:

lowing wrote:

RAIMIUS wrote:

Simply put, ALL people should be treated equally under the law.  To institute any other system would allow bias, favoritism, racism, sexism, etc.

Everyone gets treated equally until they do something to change that (i.e. criminals lose their right to freedom because they committed a crime).

How about those that have worked for a quality of life, do they get to earn the respect, presitige, rewards, benefits, perks etc, that goes with the  credentials and hard work, or are the ones who have not earned it deserve equal treatment?

As promising and as just as such a system would be, good luck trying to implement a practical - and fair! - version of it.

Lowing, this isn't about equal results. It's about equal opportunity.

That is EXACTLY what I am promoting.  Give everyone the same legal opportunities.  I am a huge supporter of "equality under the law."  In my mind, government's purpose is to protect the people from unfair treatment (military protection, law enforcement, BASIC healthcare (i.e. they never turn away someone from a hospital, who is in dire need of care), BASIC food and housing (i.e. nobody needs starve or die of exposure).  Now, being practical, I can support subsidies of areas with proven social benefits (like education)...but then, the subsidies must be narrowly tailored to achieve the best outcome with the fewest adverse effects...

I hate attempts to force equal results.  If someone performs better, they deserve the rewards.  Give everyone a fair shot and some means succeed (cough-education-cough).  Make sure no one starves or dies of exposure.  Ensure people are treated fairly.  Ensure the security of the nation...that's about it...

TheAussieReaper wrote:

FEOS wrote:

TheAussieReaper wrote:

Vote Democrat, cause we can't all be born with silver spoons in our mouths.

That's a ridiculous statement.

Look at the richest Americans. How many were born that way? Bill Gates? Nope. Warren Buffett? Nope. Steve Jobs? Nope.

They have families. Do you think their children, even grand children are ever going to have to worry about what a welfare payment looks like?

I didn't think so.

If not, what business is that of yours? and how does it affect what YOU are responsible for in building your quality life?

Spark wrote:

lowing wrote:

RAIMIUS wrote:

Simply put, ALL people should be treated equally under the law.  To institute any other system would allow bias, favoritism, racism, sexism, etc.

Everyone gets treated equally until they do something to change that (i.e. criminals lose their right to freedom because they committed a crime).

How about those that have worked for a quality of life, do they get to earn the respect, presitige, rewards, benefits, perks etc, that goes with the  credentials and hard work, or are the ones who have not earned it deserve equal treatment?

As promising and as just as such a system would be, good luck trying to implement a practical - and fair! - version of it.

Lowing, this isn't about equal results. It's about equal opportunity.

No it is about equal results. I give you affirmative action as proof. The best candidate will not get the job, only race or sex will determine the awarded position. The white guy and the black guy both college graduates, apply for a position, the white guy had better grades, and better references but will loose out to the black guy because the black guy is guaranteed equal results ( affirmative action) for his efforts.

[TUF]Catbox wrote:

There is no reason that anyone in the US can't study hard... work hard... work harder and create the life of their dreams...
most people see the cost(time and effort needed) to be wealthy and either give up or decide to just make an avg living(which is fine if that's what they wan't)
the democrat(liberal) idea is to coddle and give money to the poor folks and take away any desire to better themselves...liberal voters for life...

Most everyone in this forum is an above avg educated person with goals and dreams(i really mean that even the liberals lol)... you have desires to start companies or be involved with exciting IT careers or whatever you are into doing for a living.... and after a lot of hard work and sweat... you have money to buy a house and do the things you wan't to do... then you get your knees cut out from under you by democratic politicians that wan't your money because you had the audacity of working hard and becoming succesful... and they think you should give money to folks who don't really have any desire to better themselves(not talking about legitimate situations to help people get back on their feet with... some taxes)....     
  The govt has a 9 percent approval rating... they are inept and prove it over and over... they helped in large part to create the housing sub prime debacle... Now they are going to fix it...? lmao   They couldn't even run the restaurants they started
http://keepers-native54.blogspot.com/20 … iling.html
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co … 01765.html
... we need a small govt and the ability to choose what we spend our hard earned money on....

yes the dirtbag ceos that make millions after they ruin a company should go to jail... we need common sense and accountability...

being wealthy isn't a crime... neither is being poor and getting the help you need to live the american dream... let us choose how we spend our money for charities and we will find that we are better at it
http://www.watchblog.com/republicans/ar … 04504.html

"being wealthy isn't a crime..neither is being poor" Man!! I like that!!

TheAussieReaper wrote:

FEOS wrote:

TheAussieReaper wrote:

Vote Democrat, cause we can't all be born with silver spoons in our mouths.

That's a ridiculous statement.

Look at the richest Americans. How many were born that way? Bill Gates? Nope. Warren Buffett? Nope. Steve Jobs? Nope.

They have families. Do you think their children, even grand children are ever going to have to worry about what a welfare payment looks like?

I didn't think so.

But who built the wealth?

BTW, Bill Gates and Warren Buffett have already said their kids aren't getting their money when they die.

Regardlesss, you've missed the point. Those rich cats weren't born with silver spoons in their mouths. And if you want to talk about rich people, look at Hollywood--leftist territory. They're not exactly poor, now are they? How many of them came from rich families?

If you're born rich, you have no real concept of what it is to work and struggle to take care of yourself or your family. You have stuff handed to you...so you think it's the way it should be for everyone. And then you vote democrat.

FEOS wrote:

If you're born rich, you have no real concept of what it is to work and struggle to take care of yourself or your family. You have stuff handed to you...so you think it's the way it should be for everyone. And then you vote democrat.

lol, rich people vote Democrat?

TheAussieReaper wrote:

FEOS wrote:

If you're born rich, you have no real concept of what it is to work and struggle to take care of yourself or your family. You have stuff handed to you...so you think it's the way it should be for everyone. And then you vote democrat.

lol, rich people vote Democrat?

Yes. Who are the ones speaking loudest for Obama right now?

Hollywood always votes Democrat, with minimal exceptions. They're not exactly poor now, are they?

The stereotype that only rich people vote Republican is too easy to destroy. Yet people seem to want to continue it because it's convenient. Even the rich folks in Hollywood who vote democrat.

TheAussieReaper wrote:

FEOS wrote:

The stereotype that only rich people vote Republican is too easy to destroy. Yet people seem to want to continue it because it's convenient. Even the rich folks in Hollywood who vote democrat.

lol Celebrities? Who cares about a few of them, most of which I'm willing to bet are gay. Think about it. Which straight male goes into acting school?

And they aren't exactly political, except during an acceptance speech.

Then again, Jolie adopts kids from Darfur, we feel sad for a day, and nothing gets changed there.

But, didn't you know, Democrats tax the high upperclass class wealthy, top 5% in terms of wealth.

Who do Republicans tax?

most actors are gay?  that's the dumbest statement i've heard in awhile...lol...  and if they were all gay... what would that matter?

and what do you mean.... the democrats tax the high upperclass wealthy? 

here's who pays the most taxes....
   "Feeling overtaxed? Under the U.S. income tax system, most of the taxes collected are supposed to be paid by the people who make the most money. Thanks to President Bush's tax cuts, that is exactly the way the system works, says the U.S. Treasury Department.
According to the Office of Tax Analysis, the U.S. individual income tax is "highly progressive," with a small group of higher-income taxpayers paying most of the individual income taxes each year.


In 2002 the latest year of available data, the top 5 percent of taxpayers paid more than one-half (53.8 percent) of all individual income taxes, but reported roughly one-third (30.6 percent) of income.

The top 1 percent of taxpayers paid 33.7 percent of all individual income taxes in 2002. This group of taxpayers has paid more than 30 percent of individual income taxes since 1995. Moreover, since 1990 this group’s tax share has grown faster than their income share.

Taxpayers who rank in the top 50 percent of taxpayers by income pay virtually all individual income taxes. In all years since 1990, taxpayers in this group have paid over 94 percent of all individual income taxes. In 2000, 2001, and 2002, this group paid over 96 percent of the total.
Treasury Department analysts credit President Bush's tax cuts with shifting a larger share of the individual income taxes paid to higher income taxpayers. In 2005, says the Treasury, when most of the tax cut provisions are fully in effect (e.g., lower tax rates, the $1,000 child credit, marriage penalty relief), the projected tax share for lower-income taxpayers will fall, while the tax share for higher-income taxpayers will rise.

The share of taxes paid by the bottom 50 percent of taxpayers will fall from 4.1 percent to 3.6 percent.

The share of taxes paid by the top 1 percent of taxpayers will rise from 32.3 percent to 33.7 percent.

The average tax rate for the bottom 50 percent of taxpayers falls by 27 percent as compared to a 13 percent decline for taxpayers in the top 1 percent.
The White House has announced it will lobby Congress to pass legislation making most of President Bush's tax cutting measures permanent.

Source: U.S. Treasury, Office of Tax Analysis "

http://usgovinfo.about.com/od/incometax … ysmost.htm